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Question about a vow made to God

MountainMan17

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John, sorry, but I'm not convinced on your interpretation of Matthew 5:34-37 and Jesus' words concerning vows. In the historical context, the Pharisees had different "levels" of vows / swearing which would make some of their promises essentially meaningless. Jesus is speaking about this practice and telling us to be people of our word. But, don't take my word for it, just look at any of the older commentaries such as Matthew Henry or John Gill on these verses. But, I respect your opinion and thank you for sharing. The cards are not so important to me, and if God dosen't want me partaking, I am glad to not partake. As I mentioned in the first post, I just don't want to continue in a legalistic belief if not necessary.
 
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John Helpher

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Okay, the reply above is really harsh imo.

I think it is proportional. MM has posted again about this in post #21. Look what he says in response to my rather strong comments about his fickle commitment and attempts to use God's grace to wiggle out of personal accountability for his actions:


My interpretation is that Jesus clearly said don't do it, but MM is arguing that it is okay to make promises; it's just that the promise he made was foolish so it shouldn't count anymore. He wants both; he wants an excuse to break this particular vow and he wants to argue that it's okay to continue making new vows in the future.

All such swearing, vows, oaths, etc are foolish for two reasons; 1, we can't control the future and 2, it demonstrates that our "yes" can't be trusted; a binding contracted is required to force us to do what we say we'll do. But, MM made the contract. He made the vow and that still wasn't good enough; he wants out of it. Neither his yes was good enough nor his vow. He'll continue making foolish promises and then, later, when he wants out of it, he'll refer to the grace of God as the excuse, just like he did with the cards.

I had suggested that if there was some real, genuine, humble contrition and recognition regarding the foolishness of making promises in the first place, then perhaps there could be some room there for forgiveness and moving on from submission to the vow. God wants us to keep our word, but he also cares about our motivations and whether or not we're genuinely growing. A genuine recognition of a mistake could be a sign of growth and therefore justify leaving that foolishness behind. But MM isn't doing that.

He's not referring to the making of the vow as foolishness. He's saying the vow itself is foolish. It's a way of distancing himself from the problem. He wasn't wrong. The vow is wrong. It may seem like a subtle distinction, but it's important. In other words, he hasn't grown at all from this experience. The opposite is true; he's learned what a valuable tool grace can be for excusing his bad behaviors. Just quote a few Bible verses, perhaps a few religious platitudes, maybe mention some Bible commentators who support the same view and boom, problem gone!

That is not Christianity.
 
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MountainMan17

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If Jesus forbade the making of vows and oaths, we have several exegetical issues which contradict the plain teaching of Scripture.

1. Jesus came to fulfill the law, not overturn it. If he forbade oaths, then he would be destroying all of the Old Testament teaching on oaths. Matthew 5:17

2. Jesus himself, while on trial, was silent before the questions of the Sanhedrin, until he was asked a question by the high priest under oath. Matthew 26:63-64. Was it a sin for Jesus to answer under oath? I think not.

3. Did the apostle Paul sin by partaking in an oath? Acts 18:18

4. As I already mentioned, in Matthew 5:34-37, Jesus was addressing the practice of Jews at that time to swear by the temple, the altar, the money of the temple, etc., all of which were ways for someone to later say their vow was not really binding. Jesus is simply telling us to be people of our word. Let our commitments be binding.

My question still stands, if one makes a promise, but later grows as a Christian and finds that the promise was not a correct one to make, are they still bound under it? From history, the reformers thought it was right to throw off the monastic vows that many of them had taken (Martin Luther for example). I am not sure if my situation has any parallels.

But, I am open to the Lord's will either way, and I am just seeking to learn and discern the truth from the whole body of Scripture.

I do not wish to debate with John any further as I cannot see his position as being Scriptural. However, I respect his opinion and can agree to disagree. I'd appreciate it if any other members have input. Otherwise, I appreciate everyone's time and I will take this to the Lord in prayer.

Blessings
 
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JoeT

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My response to the standing question remains unchanged. One does not "vow", place a sacrifice on the altar, without fully understanding what is being offered. It is a moral precept that all vows should be kept. Think of a world where no man's word is worth the spit used to make it.

JoeT
 
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