Praying For Healing May Not Work

Presbyterian Continuist · Mar 12, 2007

I am coming to understand that God does not always heal people in response to prayer, because it may not always be the way the Holy Spirit goes about healing the sick.

Sometimes to pray for someone to be healed can be unbelief instead of faith. We tend to beg God for things that He has already imparted to us.

Take the Holy Spirit gift of Healing. If a person has the gift of healing, then it would be unbelief to pray that God would heal someone, because the person does not believe that he or she has the gift within, to impart to sick people from the Holy Spirit within the person.

A person who believes that they have the gift of healing should be imparting healing to people, not praying to God for it. What use is in asking God for something He has already given?

If a person believes they have the gift of healing, then they should be laying hands on the person and declaring that Jesus heals them through the power of the Holy Spirit. There is an area of faith and power where we can, in the Holy Spirit, speak healing into another person.

The problem is that not many have that level of faith. They do not have the courage to step out and use the gift of healing that they have within them through the agency of the Holy Spirit. They pass the buck to the Lord and ask Him to do the healing, when the Holy Spirit would want them to speak healing into the sick person in the Name of Jesus.

Peter and John, in Acts 3, demonstrated this: They said, "Silver and Gold have we none, but such as we have we give to you; in the Name of Jesus Christ, rise up and walk." They did not pray "Lord heal this man."

Actually, there are not many references in the New Testament that healing actually came through prayer. James speaks of getting the Elders together to lay hands on the sick person and 'the prayer of faith will raise him up'. That is the only reference to prayer that I know.

I just wonder how much time and spiritual energy is wasted by people praying and praying for people to be healed, when God is waiting for people to develop the faith and courage to speak healing into people and to impart it to sick people through the power of the Holy Spirit within them.

It would be interesting to know, through a closer study of scripture concerning healing, whether we might be barking up the wrong tree with all our praying for healing. We might find that we are praying from a principle of unbelief instead of faith!

Worth thinking about...

jrlinz · Mar 12, 2007

Oscar, yes it would be interesting to me to do just such a study. I have seem healing aplenty directly related to pprayer, but I have seen a number of times healing did not occur when I thought it would. I have my ideas about why this is, and they are different than yours. Our ideas are not worth a hill of beans if it does not align with God's will on the subject. Let me know if you do pursue this study. I may put some time into it myself. I do have a little trouble seeing God as being indifferent with the prayer of His children.

JimfromOhio · Mar 12, 2007

Pray for healing will work. The real question is when? My request for healing is eternal, not temporal.

SharonL · Mar 12, 2007

Oscarr - this is awesome and smacks me between the eyes.

God gave me a vision many years ago that I had healing in my hands for Mongolism and that I would not even have to lay hands on them, but just walk by and command healing for them - I had forgotten this totally as I am always leary of bringing attention to myself so I kinda stand in the background.

I was visiting a friend last week and her husband has demisha (sp) - the Lord woke me up in the middle of the night and said very plainly "I gave you the gift of healing in your hands - why have you not prayed for Alan" - there was no question that it was from the Holy Spirit reminding me because I had totally forgotten about it - but I always did as you say - lay hands on and ask God to heal.

My problem is I don't want people to think I am thinking more of myself and acting like God - I have the faith to do it but don't know if I have the ability to step out to where I may appear to be acting like God. I have a fear that this will turn people off. I know that we have to pray in the name of Jesus - but I don't know how to go about it without appearing like I am taking on more authority than I should.

I like this example you gave - it should tell us all we need to know:
Peter and John, in Acts 3, demonstrated this: They said, "Silver and Gold have we none, but such as we have we give to you; in the Name of Jesus Christ, rise up and walk." They did not pray "Lord heal this man."

churchlady · Mar 12, 2007

You are so right, Oscarr.

When I think of the successes and failures that I've had in this area, I can put them in two distinct columns.

Column one (successes) would be where I commanded healing to come.

Column two (failures) would be where I asked God to heal. I know better than this, but when I am with people who clearly don't believe in the 'command healing' type of prayer, I usually try to do it their way, and it fails every time. How dumb is that!

Good to see you on the forum, by the way.

LeadWorship · Mar 12, 2007

I'm glad you bring this up, Oscar. I mentioned it in one of my first few posts on these forums and it didn't recieve much response. Why would we ask for somethign that God has already provided through His Son, Jesus? By His stripes we were healed. That's like asking for cash and being told, "But I already gave you a blank check".

I don't care who it is. If they come to me for prayer, or healing, or deliverance, or whatever, I pray scripture. I command healing, because that's the example we were given. I'll lay hands on and speak healing into what needs to be healed. Why? Because I speak it through the scriptural instruction that was outlined for us, and I speak it in Jesus' name. EVERYTHING is subject to his name.

Does it always come immediately? No. Do I worry? No, because I have been obedient and God honors that. I have done what he commanded, according to his own Word. Does it take faith to recieve? No, not always, but it most assuredly DOES take faith to keep. Ever know anyone who was healed, then 6 months later they are worse off then they started? It's because they believed the devil's lies over what God has already given. Oh yes, the devil will put lies in your thoughts and body.

Example: You were healed from a knee injury. You praise God daily for it! Two months later you get out of your car and that all too familiar pain comes back. You think, "Ouch! Man I thought God healed that!" That is a negative confession and a lie of the devil. God DID heal it, you DID recieve the healing and the devil is lying to you about the pain.

Remember, God does not remember the past if we are forgiven. I believe the same is true for healing. If we claim it, then God honors the claim. From that point on, it is made as new, but the devil, who thrives upon us by bringing up memories, will remind you of the pain. God says its not there. The devil says it is. Who do you believe? Cast him down! Rebuke him! You won't listen to his lies! You WERE healed and you don't want to hear anymore than that, so get away from me in Jesus' name! Get thee to the dry places you foul creature, and leave this child of God alone!

That's what I do, anyways.

Dave01 · Mar 12, 2007

One of the answers is here Oscarr,...

28 (EMTV) And those whom God has appointed in the church are: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, kinds of tongues.

These are listed as ministries assigned to people from GOD as HE wills. So,...each Spirit-filled church should have these positions filled and active.

Calminaion · Mar 13, 2007

There'ss ones bigs things Is thinks peoples ins generals misss.

S.

It's in the verse quoted above. Gifts of healing. That doesn't mean that someone has the gift of healing, otherwise they should be emptying hospitals and they would be worshipped as a god.

God gives gifts of healing for certain times for certain people.

Atlantians · Mar 13, 2007

Exactly.

Also, I believe we as physical beings have a very very different idea about physical malladies than God does.

Furthermore, we have to understand, God is more important to God than we are to God.
His ultimate goal is to glorify Himself through us,
He has chosen in His love for us to chose to glorify Himself by reflecting His glory off of us by saving us and doing good to us.
He could easily have glorified Himself though our destruction.
But He loves us and wants to glorify Himself in a way that will also be to our benefit.

Dave01 · Mar 13, 2007

Calminaion said:
There'ss ones bigs things Is thinks peoples ins generals misss.

S.

It's in the verse quoted above. Gifts of healing. That doesn't mean that someone has the gift of healing, otherwise they should be emptying hospitals and they would be worshipped as a god.

God gives gifts of healing for certain times for certain people.

That is personal opinion, and definetely not scripture text.

Read the text again and notice how these are listed positions,..

28 (EMTV) And those whom God----> has appointed <----in the church are: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, kinds of tongues.

Let's go into the greek while we are at it also,..

G5087

τίθημι

tithēmi

tith'-ay-mee

A prolonged form of a primary word θέω theō (which is used only as an alternate in certain tenses); to place (in the widest application, literally and figuratively; properly in a passive or horizontal posture, and thus different from G2476, which properly denotes an upright and active position, while G2749 is properly reflexive and utterly prostrate): - + advise, appoint, bow, commit, conceive, give, X kneel down, lay (aside, down, up), make, ordain, purpose, put, set (forth), settle, sink down.

Shoot, let's look at various translations of it,..

28 (AV) And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. {diversities: or, kinds}

28 (ASV) And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondly prophets, thirdly teachers, then {1} miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, {2} governments, divers kinds of tongues. {1) Gr powers 2) Or wise counsels}

28 (Darby) And God has set certain in the assembly: first, apostles; secondly, prophets; thirdly, teachers; then miraculous powers; then gifts of healings; helps; governments; kinds of tongues.

28 (Douay) And God indeed hath set some in the church; first apostles, secondly prophets, thirdly doctors: after that miracles: then the graces of healings, helps, governments, kinds of tongues, interpretations of speeches.

28 (EMTV) And those whom God has appointed in the church are: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, kinds of tongues.

28 (ESV) And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, helping, administrating, and various kinds of tongues.

28 (GUV) And God {SUBJECT} set for Himself certain {DIRECT OBJECT} (in) the assembly first sent ones, {APPOSITION} secondly prophets, {APPOSITION} thirdly teachers, {APPOSITION} then works of power, {APPOSITION} then gifts {APPOSITION} of healings, {DESCRIPTION} helps, {APPOSITION} governments, {APPOSITION} kinds {APPOSITION} of tongues. {DESCRIPTION}

28 (IGNT) kai {AND} ouv men {CERTAIN} eyeto o {DID SET} yeov {GOD} en {IN} th {THE} ekklhsia {ASSEMBLY:} prwton {FIRST,} apostolouv {APOSTLES;} deuteron {SECONDLY,} profhtav {PROPHETS;} triton {THIRDLY,} didaskalouv {TEACHERS;} epeita {THEN} dunameiv {WORKS OF POWER;} eita {THEN} carismata {GIFTS} iamatwn {OF HEALINGS;} antilhqeiv {HELPS;} kubernhseiv {GOVERNMENTS;} genh {KINDS} glwsswn {OF TONGUES.}

28 (Lamsa) For God has set in his church, first apostles; after them, prophets; then teachers, then performers of miracles, then those who have the gift of healing, helpers, leaders, and speakers in diverse languages.

28 (LIT) And God placed some in the church: firstly apostles; secondly, prophets; thirdly, teachers; then works of power; then gifts of healing, helps, governings, kinds of languages.

28 (Murdoch) For God hath placed in his church, first, legates; after them, prophets; after them, teachers; after them, workers of miracles; after them, the gifts of healing, and helpers, and leaders, and various kinds of tongues.

28 (NAS95) And God has {1} {A} appointed in {B} the church, first {C} apostles, second {D} prophets, third {E} teachers, then {2} {F} miracles, then {G} gifts of healings, helps, {H} administrations, various {I} kinds of tongues. {1) Lit set some in 2) Or works of power}

28 (NKJV) And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, varieties of tongues.

28 (Noyes) God appointed some in the church to be, in the first place, apostles, in the second place, prophets, in the third place, teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, those of helping and of governing, divers kinds of tongues. Are all apostles?

28 (Rotherham) And God hath, indeed, set, certain, in the assembly,first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that mighty works, then gifts of healings, helps, guidings, kinds of tongues.

28 (RSV) And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, then healers, helpers, administrators, speakers in various kinds of tongues.

28 (RWebster) And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, various kinds of tongues. {diversities: or, kinds}

28 (TRC) And God hath also ordained in the congregation, first the apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, then them that do {|doers of|} miracles, after that, the gifts of healing, helpers, governors, diversity of tongues.

28 (YLT) And some, indeed, did God set in the assembly, first apostles, secondly prophets, thirdly teachers, afterwards powers, afterwards gifts of healings, helpings, governings, divers kinds of tongues;

You know,... it get's quite old to watch people refuse to pick up their bible and read it, but instead just shoot from the hip personal opinions.

There are reasons people are not getting healed today, and without this GOD ordained position being filled in churches, is it any wonder they don't?

knownbeforetime · Mar 13, 2007

Atlantians said:
Exactly.

Also, I believe we as physical beings have a very very different idea about physical malladies than God does.

Furthermore, we have to understand, God is more important to God than we are to God.
His ultimate goal is to glorify Himself through us,
He has chosen in His love for us to chose to glorify Himself by reflecting His glory off of us by saving us and doing good to us.
He could easily have glorified Himself though our destruction.
But He loves us and wants to glorify Himself in a way that will also be to our benefit.

John Piper?

Dave01 · Mar 13, 2007

knownbeforetime said:
John Piper?

knownbeforetime · Mar 13, 2007

Um, yeah, that's John Piper and Atlantians just sounds like him.

Presbyterian Continuist · Mar 13, 2007

knownbeforetime said:
Um, yeah, that's John Piper and Atlantians just sounds like him.

I don't want to be picky or anything, but seeing this is my thread, can we keep to the point of it and not get distracted away by trivial things?

This thread is a reasonable discussion about the effectiveness of prayer and using the word of authority in healing. Let's keep it that way.

(Mr or Ms Moderator, please take note of this and support me please).

Presbyterian Continuist · Mar 13, 2007

jrlinz said:
Oscar, yes it would be interesting to me to do just such a study. I have seem healing aplenty directly related to pprayer, but I have seen a number of times healing did not occur when I thought it would. I have my ideas about why this is, and they are different than yours. Our ideas are not worth a hill of beans if it does not align with God's will on the subject. Let me know if you do pursue this study. I may put some time into it myself. I do have a little trouble seeing God as being indifferent with the prayer of His children.

I understand your point and have no argument with it at all. The issue I am raising is that we sometimes are asking God to do something that He has given us the ability to do. Sometimes praying to God when we have the Holy Spirit in us with the tools to do the work of God in others could be construed as unbelief because we do not have the faith to believe that the Holy Spirit in us can back us up when we command things to happen in the Name of Jesus.

This is not to say that we have the natural ability to heal or to work miracles in our own right; but we are given authority through the Name of Jesus (the power of attorney if you will) to use that Name to allow the Holy Spirit to flow through us for the healing and deliverance of those who need it.

Presbyterian Continuist · Mar 13, 2007

Calminaion said:
There'ss ones bigs things Is thinks peoples ins generals misss.

S.

It's in the verse quoted above. Gifts of healing. That doesn't mean that someone has the gift of healing, otherwise they should be emptying hospitals and they would be worshipped as a god.

God gives gifts of healing for certain times for certain people.

There are three ways in which God heals people:
1. Through the natural process of our bodies, which God designed in us.
2. Through the discoveries of medical science, which were mainly discovered by Christians seeking God for scientific answers for sickness in people. For instance, the guy who discovered pennicillin got the idea as he was walking to his local church on Sunday morning.
3. Instantaneous miraculous healing as demonstrated in the ministry of Jesus and the Apostles.

The problem that we have with the gifts of healing is that they are not utilised enough. In others words, not enough people are being miraculously healed through the Holy Spirit gifts of healing. While this situation exists, there is absolutely no danger of our hospitals being emptied out.

And if I am right about God instituting the three methods by which He heals people, then hospitals and doctors will always have a place in our society no matter how Christian and revived it might become at any time.

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