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Pope Benedict XVI set to remove SSPX Excommunications via decree within a few days.

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JoabAnias

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I got an e-mail about if from Dr. Robert Moynihan. It appears as a headline in "Inside the Vatican Magazine" today. http://insidethevatican.com/

Haven't seen anything from Le Observatory Romano or Zenit yet though which I find curious.

Maybe there is more to the story that they are waiting on before publishing the news. :shrugs:

Here is the full story from Inside the Vatican which includes the decree:
 
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JoabAnias

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Truly awesome! Praise God! Angels are rejoicing in Heaven!

Not quite fully resolved yet.

 
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a.d.ivNonasNovembres

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Wait, if they can't offer the sacrament of marriage validly, from a Roman perspective, wouldn't that mean that our priests couldn't either?

Rd. John
Honestly I've been wondering about that.
I was told that the Orthodox have all the sacraments, but then if they do how is it that the SSPX doesn't have valid confession and marriage?
 
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ThePilgrim

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Honestly I've been wondering about that.
I was told that the Orthodox have all the sacraments, but then if they do how is it that the SSPX doesn't have valid confession and marriage?
Yeah, that doesn't make sense to me either, since it seems like the Vatican is saying that in order to have valid confession or Eucharist, you need to have "jurisdiction" coming from a bishop in communion with Rome.

Which we neither have nor desire, and yet they recognize our sacraments.

Meh. Strange.

Grace and epace,
Rd. John
 
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Davidnic

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The Eastern Orthodox do not have the status of suspended a divinis as seen by Rome. If someone is suspended a divinis they can not perform priestly duties or faculties.

These bishops...though having the excommunication lifted still need to have the suspension a divinis lifted.

So that is why Rome views the Orthodox as valid without qualification as opposed to any done by these Bishops. Orthodox Bishops are not suspended a divinis.
 
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Davidnic

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But the reason for the invalidity of the marriages and confessions they perform, according to the Vatican, is not their suspended status, but rather their lack of jurisdiction from a local ordinary bishop in communion with the Pope, no?

Rd. John

I could be wrong, and it is a fine canonical point, but my understanding was what they lack is local bishop who had the authority to confer the faculties of priesthood. This is not solely an issue of validity of ordination per se. But tied into having the abilities of clerical state suspended in the bishops so they could not confer those faculties to the priests.

On the issue of the Eastern Orthodox Church the Catholic Church is clear on the validity of those Sacraments without quesiton. So that is why I thought it was more complex and was tied to the suspension at the time of the ordinations. Re-reading it I see why the phrasing raises questions.

You know thinking about it...the issue may be that the faculties come from the Bishop of Rome for them and they were out of union. But for Eastern Orthodox the faculties can descend legitimately through apostolic succession through the Patriarchs. So it is only an "in union with Rome issue" for them because that is their link to the Apostolic sees...so to speak.

Let me see if I can dig up a detailed line of reasoning from the Vatican.
 
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Korah

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While you're at it, how does this apply to Old Catholics? I know their orders are recognized as valid, and I doubt that the Vatican questions the marital status of Old Catholics. Their bishops do not descend from Eastern patriarchs--I assume the difference is that they do descend from territorial sees (even though later "superceded" by contending RC bishops), same as is true for Anglicans. (The Anglicans are yet a different case, as they are not regarded as having valid orders. So invalidity of orders helps protect recognition of the validity of marriages?)
Korah
 
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Korah

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Giving this a bump. Let's have the details, please, why on the one hand EO are fully apostolic, Anglicans are not, Old Catholics have valid orders and marriages, whereas the Lefebvrists have valid masses but not valid marriages. It's asking a lot, but it interests me (if no one else).
Korah
 
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