Obama in Berlin!

demodocos said:

The USA don't have any bases in France and in Germany, most people lament the USA's decision to close bases and to transfer troops to other countries as a sign of the growing alienation between our countries that has devastated the communities that have grown around those bases in the past 50 years.

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I didn't say the US has any bases currently in France. Those were removed in the 1960s. However, the US did have bases all throughout Europe, which many grew to resent as I mentioned above.

As for Germany, it is funny to hear that coming from someone in Germany. The US has military in four bases- Ansbach, Geilenkirchen, Ramstein, Spangdahlem.

I don't think you know much about the world outside the US.

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It would seem I do.

Sign Of The Fish Burger said:

I think that unfortunately describes most Americans I know.

Heck I'm a Canadian living in the US and I'm surprised at how little people know about where I come from- and we share a [very large] boarder!

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Canadians, Canadians...OH, aren't you the guys who say "eh" after everything?

Geilenkirchen is a NATO air base. Ramstein is as well, and holds the presence of 11 different countries. Spangdahlem is a US Air Force base. Ansbach is a US Army base.

Someone on another forum I frequent got all excited about the fact that "Obama's Birth Certificate is Forged" When I asked for a website or proof she sent me this:

http://www.rightwingnews.com/mt331/2008/07/barack_obama_birth_certificate.php

Evidently I owe some one an apology for my effort at humor with Obamma's visit to Germany ....

I sought to note that many men have tried to speak as Kennedy spoke before the berlin wall came down "blah-blah-blah... rhetoric, politics, empty words"

I sought to speak a word of warning ... of the man who many thought was a leader and savior of a defeated nation " sieg heil ... we acknowledge and follow the leader"

We in the state of Illinois, thought Governor Ryan was terrible and replaced him with a young, man from chicago.... Rod Blagovick... who turned out to be worse than Ryan.... be careful what you ask for, it might come true ....

I do not see the draw in either Hillary or Obamma... who have sold their respective souls to Pollitical Action Committiess (PAC's); big business ; splinter groups...and embraced many "nonchristian things", spending billions for a job that pays 200,000.00 a year .... some one expects some thing in return ...

for what it is worth ....

paul

I do not see the draw in either Hillary or Obamma... who have sold their respective souls to Pollitical Action Committiess (PAC's); big business ; splinter groups...and embraced many "nonchristian things", spending billions for a job that pays 200,000.00 a year .... some one expects some thing in return ...

for what it is worth ....

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Obama sold to big businesses? I don't think so. Not a dime from any. I would rather my candidate be sold to non-profit, cause-centered PAC's than big oil and pharmaceutical companies as are the Republicans.
Who are you (or me) to define what is "unchristian"? I think that the only areas that the Democrats stray from Christian Values are in the areas where they are too conservative. (But who am I to say?).

They are paying millions for a job that pays $400,000 per year. I agree that someone is expecting something, but at the same time I would say that if you are putting more into something than you will get out of it, then you must be passionate about what you are doing. Why not be that passionate about changing your country?

plmarquette said:

We in the state of Illinois, thought Governor Ryan was terrible and replaced him with a young, man from chicago.... Rod Blagovick... who turned out to be worse than Ryan.... be careful what you ask for, it might come true ....[emph. added)

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Wait. Who thought Ryan was a bad governor? I thought he did pretty good as governor actually. Selling Drivers Licenses among other things for contributions while Secretary of State was bad though.

I do not see the draw in either Hillary or Obamma... who have sold their respective souls to Pollitical Action Committiess (PAC's); big business ; splinter groups...and embraced many "nonchristian things", spending billions for a job that pays 200,000.00 a year .... some one expects some thing in return ...

for what it is worth ....

paul

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Then you shouldn't vote for them.
tulc(who does actually see some good in Obama)

SpiritualAntiseptic said:

I didn't say the US has any bases currently in France. Those were removed in the 1960s. However, the US did have bases all throughout Europe, which many grew to resent as I mentioned above.

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You said: "People of France, Germany and other failing European states hate the US- when we have not attacked them. They hate us for our cold war military bases there. For them, it is a reminder of dependence- a dependence they are resentful for."

So what I'm supposed to believe is that you meant to say that the French are mad at the USA because something that didn't exist for at least 40 years is reminding them of their dependence on your country right now?
Sorry, I don't buy that, this looks far more like a deliberate attempt at backpedaling.

Btw, what makes you think we're failing? Last time I checked, we were doing great.

As for Germany, it is funny to hear that coming from someone in Germany. The US has military in four bases- Ansbach, Geilenkirchen, Ramstein, Spangdahlem.

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Anderson Barracks, Dexheim
Argonner Kaserne, Hanau (closing by 2009)
Artillery Kaserne, Garmisch-Partenkirchen
Bamberg Local Training Area, Bamberg
Barton Barracks, Ansbach
Benjamin Franklin Village, Mannheim
Cambrai-Fritsch Kaserne, Darmstadt (closing in 2008)
Campbell Barracks, Heidelberg
Coleman Barracks, Mannheim
Conn Barracks, Schweinfurt
Faulenberg Kaserne, Würzburg (closing in 2008)
Flak Kaserne, Augsburg
Francois Kaserne, Hanau
Funari Barracks, Mannheim
Gießen Depot, Gießen (closing in 2008)
Grafenwöhr Training Area, Grafenwöhr/Vilseck
Griesheim Army Airfield/Stars and Stripes Kaserne, Griesheim (closing 2008)
Grossauheim Kaserne, Hanau (closing by 2009)
Hammonds Barracks, Seckenheim
Heidelberg Army Airfield, Heidelberg
Hohenfels Training Area/Joint Multinational Readiness Center, Hohenfels (Upper Palatinate)
Husterhoeh Kaserne, Pirmasens
Hutier Kaserne, Hanau (closing in 2009)
Kaiserslautern Military Community
Katterbach Kaserne, Ansbach
Kelley Barracks/Nathan Hale Depot, Darmstadt (closing 2008)
Kelley Barracks, Stuttgart
Kilbourne Kaserne, Heidelberg
Lampertheim Training Area, Lampertheim
Landstuhl Regional Medical Center, Landstuhl
Ledward Barracks, Schweinfurt
Leighton Barracks, Würzburg (closing in 2008)
Mark Twain Village, Heidelberg (expanding)
McCully Barracks, Wackernheim
Miesau Army Depot, Miesau
Nachrichten Kaserne, Heidelberg
Panzer Kaserne, Stuttgart
Patch Barracks, Stuttgart
Pioneer Kaserne, Hanau (closing by 2009)
Pulaski Barracks, Kaiserslautern
Patrick Henry Village, Heidelberg
Patton Barracks, Heidelberg
Rhein Ordnance Barracks, Kaiserslautern
Robinson Barracks, Stuttgart
Rose Barracks, Vilseck
Shipton Kaserne, Ansbach
Smith Barracks, Baumholder
Spinelli Barracks, Mannheim
Storck Barracks, Illesheim
Strassburg Barracks, Idar-Oberstein
Sullivan Barracks, Mannheim
Taylor Barracks, Mannheim
Tompkins Barracks, Schwetzingen
Underwood Kaserne, Hanau (closing in 2008)
Warner Barracks, Bamberg
Wiesbaden Army Airfield, Wiesbaden
Wolfgang Kaserne, Hanau (closing by 2009)
Würzburg Hospital, Würzburg (closing in 2008)
Yorkhof Kaserne, Hanau (closing by 2009)
etc, etc, etc...

Four bases in Germany... riiiight...

I don't think you know much about the world outside the US.

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It would seem I do.

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You keep saying that... doesn't make it true though.

demodocos said:

You said: "People of France, Germany and other failing European states hate the US- when we have not attacked them. They hate us for our cold war military bases there. For them, it is a reminder of dependence- a dependence they are resentful for."

So what I'm supposed to believe is that you meant to say that the French are mad at the USA because something that didn't exist for at least 40 years is reminding them of their dependence on your country right now?
Sorry, I don't buy that, this looks far more like a deliberate attempt at backpedaling.

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I was talking about Europe as a whole. Europe as a whole is upset with the US for having bases on their continent because they were too weak to defend themselves from the Soviet.

Btw, what makes you think we're failing? Last time I checked, we were doing great.


Four bases in Germany... riiiight...

You keep saying that... doesn't make it true though.

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Dude- you are now arguing that there are bases in Germany? You just said:
"The USA don't have any bases in France and in Germany"

FatBurger said:

Geilenkirchen is a NATO air base. Ramstein is as well, and holds the presence of 11 different countries. Spangdahlem is a US Air Force base. Ansbach is a US Army base.

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It is a base where US forces are stationed. I was responding to his remark that the US doesn't have any bases in Germany- I only needed the name of one base... but I named the four significant places of US forces in Germany.

I love Barack so very much, but this satirical video is absolutely hilarious. Check it out...

http://www.youtube.com/swf/l.swf?vi...WORfgMInIW6LFRX8WL&fs=1"></param><param&hl=en

Adammi said:

I love Barack so very much, but this satirical video is absolutely hilarious. Check it out...

http://www.youtube.com/swf/l.swf?vi...WORfgMInIW6LFRX8WL&fs=1"></param><param&hl=en

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Regrettably it would appear that the video is no longer available...

SpiritualAntiseptic said:

It is a base where US forces are stationed. I was responding to his remark that the US doesn't have any bases in Germany- I only needed the name of one base... but I named the four significant places of US forces in Germany.

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Right, which would mean that I wasn't disagreeing with you, I was simply clarifying.

FatBurger said:

Right, which would mean that I wasn't disagreeing with you, I was simply clarifying.

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Oh, ok

Actually, originally I was going to specify the NATO bases... but ironically figured that would just make a tangent argument about whether I can say the US has a 'base' if it is classified as NATO

SpiritualAntiseptic said:

I was talking about Europe as a whole. Europe as a whole is upset with the US for having bases on their continent because they were too weak to defend themselves from the Soviet.

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You were giving your explanation for why people in France and Germany "hate" America.

Dude- you are now arguing that there are bases in Germany?

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Now you're just trying to downplay your lack of knowledge. You believe that the reason why people in Germany "hate" the USA because of your military bases here, but your belief that there are only four bases in Germany shows that your knowledge is very limited in that matter.

You just said:
"The USA don't have any bases in France and in Germany"

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There was a comma missing in that sentence.
"The USA don't have any bases in France, and in Germany, most people lament the USA's decision to close bases and to transfer troops to other countries as a sign of the growing alienation between our countries that has devastated the communities that have grown around those bases in the past 50 years."

Get real, the stuff about communities having grown around those bases in the past 50 years wouldn't make any sense if I had meant to say that there aren't any bases in Germany. Try reading entire sentences sometime.

I can read sentences just fine- but if you are going to be missing commas and using run-on sentences, don't get upset when someone misunderstands you.

The bases in Europe have everything to do with resentment. However, there are many other reasons why the Germans and French hate the US- but it is out of jealousy.

SpiritualAntiseptic said:

I can read sentences just fine- but if you are going to be missing commas and using run-on sentences, don't get upset when someone misunderstands you.

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I'm not upset because you misunderstood but annoyed because you discarded most of what I said by abruptly cutting off the quote.

The bases in Europe have everything to do with resentment.

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And I, as a person living here, tell you that you are wrong. I don't know how you came to that conclusion, but it's definitely not based on facts. If there is any resentment stemming from the fact that the USA are maintaining military bases in Germany, it's by far outweighed by the goodwill stemming from the effect those bases have on the economy.

However, there are many other reasons why the Germans and French hate the US- but it is out of jealousy.

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You really believe that your country's ability to de-populate the entire planet is something to be jealous of, right?

Oh get real, (Western) Germany has been working on getting rid of that Prussian mindset that makes people fawn over military strength for 40-60 years now.
Yeah, you've got a really biiig club, but by all means, that's nothing to be jealous of because, to quote Ben Parker; "With great power comes great responsibility".

You're just trying to find flaws in others because it's easier than to concern yourself with your own failings.

...reminds me of a guy who once said something about wooden beams in eyes.