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Do you receive revelation,or just introject Wright because of a piece of paper?
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Do you receive revelation,or just introject Wright because of a piece of paper?Can you answer my question please...
Do you reject the reformation because Luther, Calvin, Zwingli, Vermigli, etc were scholars and their reforming work depended upon that scholarship?
So you believe the reformation only came to be bacause some called Luther and Calvin scholars?Can you answer my question please...
Do you reject the reformation because Luther, Calvin, Zwingli, Vermigli, etc were scholars and their reforming work depended upon that scholarship?
Revelation and study are not an either or but a both/and.Do you receive revelation,or just introject Wright because of a piece of paper?
God can and does work through scholars and scholarship just as he works through many other means. Just as God used the scholarship of Luther, Calvin, Vermigli, to reform the church of their time he can use the scholarship of people like Tom Wright to do the same. The reformers would be aghast at the idea that one could accept their work but reject out of hand later scholarship that is potentially reforming. They knew that the church would always need reforming, they said so explicity, and they knew that scholarship would be part of that just as it was part of their reformation.So you believe the reformation only came to be bacause some called Luther and Calvin scholars?
Exactly. If we were talking about John Dominic Crossan then I wouldn't be shocked but the reaction, but ...I find it interesting that so many are willing to dismiss the work of certain theologians, pastors, and scholars as heresy, yet are unwilling to actually take the time to find out what they are disagreeing with. I have found that the works of N.T. Wright are quite orthodox and exigetically sound, while being quite though provoking. I would encourage those who are arguing against his theology to actually read one of his books. You might just be pleasantly surprised.
What does the body of Christ need to be reformed from? It is not the sholarship of men that reforms His Church.. It is Christ himself that builds His Church.. God can even use a donkey to speak forth what He wants to say.God can and does work through scholars and scholarship just as he works through many other means. Just as God used the scholarship of Luther, Calvin, Vermigli, to reform the church of their time he can use the scholarship of people like Tom Wright to do the same. The reformers would be aghast at the idea that one could accept their work but reject out of hand later scholarship that is potentially reforming. They knew that the church would always need reforming, they said so explicity, and they knew that scholarship would be part of that just as it was part of their reformation.
I did,but your love if intellect has prevented you from understanding.At least I have posted scripture,you are just trying to play semantical cornering games.Revelation and study are not an either or but a both/and.
Please note that I have explicitly said one should not automatically accept everything simply because it is based on scholarship, but neither should one automatically reject it.
Now, can you please stop evading the question and answer it.
You won't know unless you are prepared to listen to people who might have soemthing important to say.What does the body of Christ need to be reformed from?
It was through the scholarship of men that God reformed his church in the Reformation. If you reject in-principle God reforming through scholarship then you reject the Reformation itself.It is not the sholarship of men that reforms His Church.
And one of the ways he does it is through scholarship.It is Christ himself that builds His Church.
But not every ass is speaking for God. (Mat 11:15)God can even use a donkey to speak forth what He wants to say.
Then give a straight answer an idiot like me can understand:I did,but your love if intellect has prevented you from understanding.
Perhaps you've missed all the allusions to scripture because I haven't put verse numbers by each one.At least I have posted scripture,
No, I'm challenging the incredible inconsistancy in your position.you are just trying to play semantical cornering games.
No-one is saying that God only works through scholars.Sooo,what about Peter and John,did they need scholars? Last I heard,fishing was very blue collar,not Princeton!
What does the body of Christ need to be reformed from?
It is not the sholarship of men that reforms His Church.. It is Christ himself that builds His Church.. God can even use a donkey to speak forth what He wants to say.
Exactly. If we were talking about John Dominic Crossan then I wouldn't be shocked but the reaction, but ...
God has also used mere common men such as Moses and Jonah.All men are just common men. Peter was a fishermen for pity sakes..
No-one has said otherwise. Though I'm not to sure that your examples are good ones it doesn't really matter because nobody is disputing the point. Indeed, I've given an explicity example of such myself earlier in the thread (Amos).God has also used mere common men such as Moses and Jonah.
And yet Peter and John would eventually write their epistles in refined Greek. Not bad for a couple of Galilean fishermen.Sooo,what about Peter and John,did they need scholars? Last I heard,fishing was very blue collar,not Princeton!
Wisdom calls aloud in the street, she raises her voice in the public squares at the head of the noisy streets she cries out, in the gateways of the city she makes her speech: "How long will you simple ones love your simple ways? How long will mockers delight in mockery and fools hate knowledge?
Has anyone heard of this? To me it sounds like some want to "re-evaluate'" scripture.He indicates that we need to learn about first century Judaism. He believes that what Paul meant by justification was an issue of Gentile and Jewish believers getting along and accepting one another. To me that sounds like a watering down of the book of Galatians.And obscuring what justification really is.
It is called NPP,new perspective on Paul.From what I have read on sites already,I dont like the smell of it.I also dont like when a scholar is given to much credence,or is over quoted.
One note I would like to add is this.As far as the climate of the first century goes,we saw the viloence of Paul against the Christians,and then we saw that same collective violence visited upon him,after conversion.So I think that stonings and beatings,give us a good idea,of the times.I say this because Wright indicates that he thinks that there was not a big problem between unsaved Jews,and Christians.
If you really believed in one receiving revelation,you would not be all that thrilled about intellect.No-one has said otherwise. Though I'm not to sure that your examples are good ones it doesn't really matter because nobody is disputing the point. Indeed, I've given an explicity example of such myself earlier in the thread (Amos).
So.....I know a man who speaks several languages,yet he cant understand grace.And yet Peter and John would eventually write their epistles in refined Greek. Not bad for a couple of Galilean fishermen.
Scholarship is not essential to respond to HaShem's calling but He uses all things for His purposes. You shouldn't be so quick to dismiss scholars who have worked to understand His revelation.
The Mishley Shlomo says:
You're the one creating false dichotomies. I'm happy that God works through scholars like Jerimiah, Luke, Paul, Calvin, Luther, Vermigli, - and through less scholarly people like Amos, Mark perhaps, ... I have made it clear that I don't take scholarship to automatically mean that God is working through somebody, and that God can and does work through 'ordinary' people.If you really believed in one receiving revelation,you would not be all that thrilled about intellect.
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