Mr. Perry quote "As a Christian I have a clear directive to support Israel"

Blind religiously based political support of a nation is a deeply flawed and anti democratic mindset.

SonOfTheWest said:

Blind religiously based political support of a nation is a deeply flawed and anti democratic mindset.

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Amen brother! I'm not sure exactly when this blind reverence for all things Jewish crept into modern Christianity but it's certainly NOT what Martin Luther or the traditional Roman Catholic Church taught for thousands of years.


"They (Jews) are the real liars and bloodhounds, who have not only perverted and falsified the entire Scriptures from beginning to end and without ceasing with their interpretations. And all of the anxious sighing, longing and hoping of their hearts is directed to the time when some day they would like to deal with us heathen as they dealt with the heathen in Persia at the time of Esther... Oh how they love that book Esther, which so nicely agrees with their blood-thirsty, revengeful and murderous desire and hope!" --MARTIN LUTHER 16th c. German religious reformer.


"Every time anyone says that Israel is our only friend in the Middle
East, I can't help but think that before Israel, we had no enemies in the
Middle East." --John Sheehan, S.J. (a Jesuit priest)


There is NO SALVATION outside of faith in Christ's redemptive sacrifice on the cross (period) (John 14:6). If Jews are to be saved solely on their supposed lineage to Abraham then Christ's suffering was in vain. Many of the monotheistic Arab's are also Abraham's descendants through the handmaid Hagar. Are they automatically "saved" too?

Such Universalist salvation thinking is religious heresy and makes a mockery of the crucifixion of Christ. Do you really believe that a vile Jew (I mean of the lowest possible sort) who daily mocks Christ with his profane profligate lifestyle and spits whenever the Holy name of Jesus is mentioned, then dies while cursing Christ will be accounted worthy of being numbered with the saints of God?

If Jews aren't required to believe in the sacrifice of Christ to be saved why did all the First Century apostles bother trying to preach the gospel to Jews? Aren't Jews to be saved regardless whether they believe or not?

James Forthwright said:

Amen brother! I'm not sure exactly when this blind reverence for all things Jewish crept into modern Christianity but it's certainly NOT what Martin Luther or the traditional Roman Catholic Church taught for thousands of years.


"They (Jews) are the real liars and bloodhounds, who have not only perverted and falsified the entire Scriptures from beginning to end and without ceasing with their interpretations. And all of the anxious sighing, longing and hoping of their hearts is directed to the time when some day they would like to deal with us heathen as they dealt with the heathen in Persia at the time of Esther... Oh how they love that book Esther, which so nicely agrees with their blood-thirsty, revengeful and murderous desire and hope!" --MARTIN LUTHER 16th c. German religious reformer.


"Every time anyone says that Israel is our only friend in the Middle
East, I can't help but think that before Israel, we had no enemies in the
Middle East." --John Sheehan, S.J. (a Jesuit priest)


There is NO SALVATION outside of faith in Christ's redemptive sacrifice on the cross (period) (John 14:6). If Jews are to be saved solely on their supposed lineage to Abraham then Christ's suffering was in vain. Many of the monotheistic Arab's are also Abraham's descendants through the handmaid Hagar. Are they automatically "saved" too?

Such Universalist salvation thinking is religious heresy and makes a mockery of the crucifixion of Christ. Do you really believe that a vile Jew (I mean of the lowest possible sort) who daily mocks Christ with his profane profligate lifestyle and spits whenever the Holy name of Jesus is mentioned, then dies while cursing Christ will be accounted worthy of being numbered with the saints of God?

If Jews aren't required to believe in the sacrifice of Christ to be saved why did all the First Century apostles bother trying to preach the gospel to Jews? Aren't Jews to be saved regardless whether they believe or not?

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Amen, the truth is always hard to swallow sometimes. It is much more comfortable to soften Christianity down to be nice and easy.

makingchristiandisciples said:

I don't care to take sides on this issue for the purpose of taking sides. But the Abrahamic covenant says God will bless those who bless Israel and curse those who curse Israel. That's good enough for me.

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Amen. It all rests in G-d's hands. His plan, His will, and His purpose for Israel will be accomplished, no matter what someone thinks or believes to the contrary. G-d is the One who is in control of all things, not men.

WhisperofHope said:

Amen. It all rests in G-d's hands. His plan, His will, and His purpose for Israel will be accomplished, no matter what someone thinks or believes to the contrary. G-d is the One who is in control of all things, not men.

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God is Sovereign, that's true, however, if we are to 'put on the mind of Christ' and comprehend even a glimpse of God's prophetic plan for the twelve true tribes of Israel it is important that we understand that the present inhabitants of the nation state called "Israel" bear no resemblance, spiritually or genetically, to their ancient counterparts. (Rev. 2:9, Rev. 3:9)

Let me put it another way; If a rich relation of yours were to pass away and some huckster shows up with a fraudulent will and fake claims to all the inheritance, then it's time to act and expose the counterfeit imposter for who and what he is, not just cave in and say, 'God's Will Be Done'.

Well stated, Incariol. We may have our doctrinal differences but on the insidious nature of the Jews we are in complete agreement.

The famous Protestant reformer Martin Luther minced no words on the subject of the Jews:

"The sun never did shine on a more bloodthirsty and revengeful people as they, who imagine to be the people of God, and who desire to and think they must murder and crush the heathen. And the foremost undertaking which they expect of their Messiah is that he should slay and murder the whole world with the sword. As they at first demonstrated against us Christians and would like to do now, if they only could; have also tried it often and have been repeatedly struck on their snouts...

Their breath stinks for the gold and silver of the heathen; since no people under the sun always have been, still are, and always will remain more avaricious than they, as can be noticed in their cursed usury. They also find comfort with this: 'When Messiah comes, He shall take all the gold and silver in the world and distribute it among the Jews.'(2) Thus,wherever they can direct Scripture to their insatiable avarice, they wickedly do so. Therefore know, my dear Christians, that next to the Devil, you have no more bitter, more poisonous, more vehement an enemy than a real Jew who earnestly desires to be a Jew." --Martin Luther

I support Israel as a sovereign nation, the only secular one in the Middle East. I don't feel any Scriptural conviction to do so. It seems more like common sense, really. Where in the Bible does is command Christians to love Israel?

KatAutumn said:

I support Israel as a sovereign nation, the only secular one in the Middle East. I don't feel any Scriptural conviction to do so. It seems more like common sense, really. Where in the Bible does is command Christians to love Israel?

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"Common sense" is not always the best course of action and may at times be deceiving, KatAutumn. Things are not always what they seem at first glance.

The passage most quoted by the Judaeo-Christian (sic) crowd is:

Gen 12:3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

However, it is always paramount to read Bible passages in context rather than basing doctrinal positions on only one verse. The previous verse states:

Gen 12:2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

This verse can't possibly be speaking of the present day Middle Eastern nation calling itself 'Israel'.

First of all, that morally corrupt New Jersey size nation is NOT a "Great nation" by any stretch of the imagination. Without the yearly influx of BILLIONS of USA dollars they'd be totally bankrupt.

Secondly, honestly ask yourself, if the modern state of Israel has been "a blessing" (or a curse) to those that continually come to their aid? Is America a more prosperous nation since the formation of the nation state of Israel in 1947? Or have we just inherited a host of Israeli's enemies in the Islamic World? Are we now a nation at peace or are we embroiled in endless Middle East wars with no exit strategy?

Thirdly, the demographic regions of any nation change through time. Just five hundred years ago the people of the America were far different than the majority of its inhabitants today. The Levant region where Israel is located was subject to many migrations, invasions, captivities and occupations. Just because someone 'claims to be a Jew' or a relation to Abraham does NOT make it so.

Jesus warned us to be wary of Jewish imposters (emphasis mine):

(Rev 2:9) I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

(Rev 3:9) Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Instead of using, 'common sense', to decide such crucial issues, open your spiritual eyes, study the Bible on this topic and make your own decisions as to which side (Anglo-Israel or Judeao-Christianity) bears the closest resemblance and bears the true marks and fruits of the true Biblical tribes of Israel.

James Forthwright said:

"Common sense" is not always the best course of action and may at times be deceiving, KatAutumn. Things are not always what they seem at first glance.

The passage most quoted by the Judaeo-Christian (sic) crowd is:

Gen 12:3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

However, it is always paramount to read Bible passages in context rather than basing doctrinal positions on only one verse. The previous verse states:

Gen 12:2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

This verse can't possibly be speaking of the present day Middle Eastern nation calling itself 'Israel'.

First of all, that morally corrupt New Jersey size nation is NOT a "Great nation" by any stretch of the imagination. Without the yearly influx of BILLIONS of USA dollars they'd be totally bankrupt.

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They must be pretty "great" to survive in the middle east for as long as they have. Which is no small feat considering the number of people there who want the nation wiped off the map.

Secondly, honestly ask yourself, if the modern state of Israel has been "a blessing" (or a curse) to those that continually come to their aid? Is America a more prosperous nation since the formation of the nation state of Israel in 1947? Or have we just inherited a host of Israeli's enemies in the Islamic World? Are we now a nation at peace or are we embroiled in endless Middle East wars with no exit strategy?

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The ultimate goal of the religion known as Islam is to either convert everyone in the world or have them paying a tax called the Jizya.

Surah 9.29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

So, in that regard, yes it has been a blessing. If Israel were to end up being destroyed, they're just going to move onward and upward through Europe where they have already started trying to impose sharia law. Then where do they go after that? Nowadays we have people who are afraid to call a spade a spade when it comes to Islam, because they're afraid of being branded a number of things including, but not limited to, racist, bigot, or islamophobe. Islam regards us, the non-islamic community, as an enemy regardless of whether or not what we regard them as one.

In regards to our economy, it had been on the incline ever since the end of WWII until this past decade. To imply that Israel is the problem is a far stretch.

Thirdly, the demographic regions of any nation change through time. Just five hundred years ago the people of the America were far different than the majority of its inhabitants today. The Levant region where Israel is located was subject to many migrations, invasions, captivities and occupations. Just because someone 'claims to be a Jew' or a relation to Abraham does NOT make it so.

Jesus warned us to be wary of Jewish imposters (emphasis mine):

(Rev 2:9) I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

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Rev 2:8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;
Rev 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.
Rev 2:10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.

O boy context! I don't see any of what you claim are imposter Jews throwing Christians in prison or causing them any sort of tribulation. Most of what they've done is defend themselves.

Instead of using, 'common sense', to decide such crucial issues, open your spiritual eyes, study the Bible on this topic and make your own decisions as to which side (Anglo-Israel or Judeao-Christianity) bears the closest resemblance and bears the true marks and fruits of the true Biblical tribes of Israel.

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Gen 17:8 And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

Jer 31:35 Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name:

Jer 31:36 If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.

What's the difficult part about the word everlasting? The land is theirs until "those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD." Seems pretty clear cut to me. So, I agree, study the Bible while also trying to piece every part of the puzzle together instead of taking half a puzzle and running with it.

Randomfeats said:

They must be pretty "great" to survive in the middle east for as long as they have. Which is no small feat considering the number of people there who want the nation wiped off the map.

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"Great" is a subjective term. The mere fact of 64 years existence for the modern so-called state of Israel is hardly a phenomenal feat. There were very few Jewish inhabitants in Palestine before 1947 and before the influx of Zionist Jews they all lived in relative harmony.

Without the BILLIONS of dollars in economic and military aid of the US and NATO countries, the combined strength of the Arab nations could soon make Israel an significant footnote in historical journals.

Randomfeats said:

The ultimate goal of the religion known as Islam is to either convert everyone in the world or have them paying a tax called the Jizya.

Surah 9.29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

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No rational person will lightly dismiss the global domination goals of Islam.

However, Arabs do not dominate all the Western media outlets (Movies, TV, Radio, Newspapers and most Print publications, Music industry) (Jews do), Arabs do not run the Federal Reserve (Jews do), Arabs do not control the Wall St. Banks and precious commodities markets. (Jews do) Arabs do not operate the most influential political action group in Washington, DC i.e., AIPAC (Jews do). Liberal Arabs do not possess lifetime seats in the US Supreme Court (Jews do) Arabs do not make up a sizable portion of lawyers and judges. (Jews do)

With the notable exception of Dr. Ron Paul, every aspiring US Presidential candidate feels compelled to travel to the Middle East, and get photographed wearing beanies and stuffing notes in the Wailing Wall. These same politicians don't make pilgrimages to Mecca. Arabs are not compelling Western armies to secure their homelands (Jews do). Arabs do not hold influential positions in the radical left-wing organizations of Gun Control lobby, Homosexual Rights groups, Feminist groups, Internet Censorship, Support illegal immigration, Abortion Rights, ADL, Southern Poverty Law Center, ACLU etc. (Jews do)

Now you tell me, honestly, which group (Jews or Arabs) pose the most imminent threat to the security of the United States of America?

Randomfeats said:

So, in that regard, yes it has been a blessing. If Israel were to end up being destroyed, they're just going to move onward and upward through Europe where they have already started trying to impose sharia law. Then where do they go after that? Nowadays we have people who are afraid to call a spade a spade when it comes to Islam, because they're afraid of being branded a number of things including, but not limited to, racist, bigot, or islamophobe. Islam regards us, the non-islamic community, as an enemy regardless of whether or not what we regard them as one.

Click to expand...

The threat of being called "an Anti-Semite" or "Holocaust denier" trumps all those phoney Islamophobic accusations in spades. Just ask Mel Gibson, Helen Thomas, Hank Williams Jr., Marlon Brando, Glen Beck etc. To even question historical aspects of the holocaust can mean immediate jail sentences in several Western countries. No one gets jailed for verbally attacking Arabs. Our media does it 24/7/365.

Randomfeats said:

In regards to our economy, it had been on the incline ever since the end of WWII until this past decade. To imply that Israel is the problem is a far stretch.

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The decline of the US economy began with the Woodrow Wilson administration permitting the Zionist Jews to control the privately owned Federal Reserve System. It's been nothing but a cycle of rampant inflation/depression and wars ever since.

Randomfeats said:

Rev 2:8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;
Rev 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.
Rev 2:10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.

O boy context! I don't see any of what you claim are imposter Jews throwing Christians in prison or causing them any sort of tribulation. Most of what they've done is defend themselves.

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Don't hold your breath, Randomfeats. I stated earlier that to even question certain aspects of WWII and the so-called holocaust will result in instant jail sentences in a number of countries (see: Ernst Zundel, David Irving, [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Gaston-Armand Amaudruz,[/FONT]Frederick Toben et. al.) and may soon be coming to a neighborhood near you.

Randomfeats said:

Gen 17:8 And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

Jer 31:35 Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name:

Jer 31:36 If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.

What's the difficult part about the word everlasting? The land is theirs until "those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD." Seems pretty clear cut to me. So, I agree, study the Bible while also trying to piece every part of the puzzle together instead of taking half a puzzle and running with it.

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You can't take one word 'everlasting' and make it the primary basis of your doctrine:


Gen 48:4 The Jews did not have their 'everlasting' homeland for thousands of years.
Exo 12:17 Feast day were to be 'for ever'
Exodus 40:15 The Levitical priesthood was supposedly 'everlasting'
Lev 13:64 Yearly animal sacrifices were to be 'everlasting'
Lev. 3:17 Peace offerings, wave offerings and sin offerings were to be 'everlasting' ordinances

What you are ignoring, Randomfeats, is the possibility that those claiming to be Jews are Khazar Satanic frauds posing as Jews for profit and power (just as Jesus warned) and that it is the Anglo-Saxon and related races bear the true fruit of the Israelite nations. They are the ones who spread the gospel and love God's only Son. God gave His true chosen people the New Jerusalem (USA and Europe).This is the Promised Land of milk and honey. Hundreds of generations of Jews have come and gone and the obstinate Jews still vehemently reject Jesus as their Messiah. You can be imprisoned for up to five years by merely distributing Bibles in Israel. They are the 'bad figs' (Jer. 24:2) all the Jew's fruit is rotten. They've been expelled dozens of times for their treachery and usury practices (anti-Semitism had little to do with it).

There is NO SALVATION or divine blessing outside of acknowledging Jesus as LORD (period).

Yep, you lost me with the "Jews run the world!" antisemitic hysteria.

The Bible says 'Woe be unto those who try to make Israel split their lands' - good enough for me.

SharonL said:

The Bible says 'Woe be unto those who try to make Israel split their lands' - good enough for me.

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Me too. And the fact that G-d said He would bless those who blessed Israel and curse those who cursed her. That settles it for me.

James Forthwright said:

"Great" is a subjective term. The mere fact of 64 years existence for the modern so-called state of Israel is hardly a phenomenal feat. There were very few Jewish inhabitants in Palestine before 1947 and before the influx of Zionist Jews they all lived in relative harmony.

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You're right it is a subjective term and of course when Israel was reestablished there's going to be an influx of people, I don't see what point you're trying to make. If they were in "relative harmony" before what makes it so hard to live in harmony now?

Without the BILLIONS of dollars in economic and military aid of the US and NATO countries, the combined strength of the Arab nations could soon make Israel an significant footnote in historical journals.

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So Israel gets a lot of aid from the US, and it's mostly military aid to defend themselves.
http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/2012/tables/12s1299.pdf
You can even see that some arab nations had been getting billions.

However, Arabs do not dominate all the Western media outlets (Movies, TV, Radio, Newspapers and most Print publications, Music industry) (Jews do), Arabs do not run the Federal Reserve (Jews do), Arabs do not control the Wall St. Banks and precious commodities markets. (Jews do) Arabs do not operate the most influential political action group in Washington, DC i.e., AIPAC (Jews do).

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So, Jewish people run these media outlets. Ok, and what's wrong with that? Would you feel any different if they were owned by a Canadian/Russian/Mexican or what have you?

With the notable exception of Dr. Ron Paul, every aspiring US Presidential candidate feels compelled to travel to the Middle East, and get photographed wearing beanies and stuffing notes in the Wailing Wall. These same politicians don't make pilgrimages to Mecca. Arabs are not compelling Western armies to secure their homelands (Jews do). Arabs do not hold influential positions in the radical left-wing organizations of Gun Control lobby, Homosexual Rights groups, Feminist groups, Abortion Rights, ADL, Southern Poverty Law Center, ACLU etc. (Jews do)
Now you tell me which group (Jews or Arabs) pose the most imminent threat to the security of the United States of America?

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Our candidates are showing support for a nation that has been an ally since the 50's, what's the issue? The Jews that hold those influential positions, probably have an opposing viewpoint to your own, right. How does that make them more of a threat to security than anyone else in similar positions that aren't Jews?

The threat of being called "an Anti-Semite" or "Holocaust denier" trumps all those phoney Islamophobic accusations in spades. Just as Mel Gibson, Helen Thomas, Hank Williams Jr., Glen Beck etc. To even question historical aspects of the holocaust can mean immediate jail sentences in several Western countries. No one gets jailed for verbally attacking Arabs. Our media does it 24/7/365.

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Author, Macha Laxmaiah, arrested in Andhra Pradesh for writing book against Muslims -
Cartoonist arrested for 'insulting people' - World news - Europe - msnbc.com
'Koran burning': men expect to be charged with inciting racial hatred - Telegraph
Free to Speak | The Eagle Online

People do get jailed for it much like anything else that is branded as racism and the like, including antisemitism. It all falls under the load of crap that is political correctness, but that's a different story.

The decline of the US economy began with Woodrow Wilson and his allowing the Zionist Jews to control the privately owned Federal Reserve System. It's been nothing but a cycle of rampant inflation and wars ever since.

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From your previous post

Is America a more prosperous nation since the formation of the nation state of Israel in 1947?

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I don't see what Woodrow has to do with post WWII economy or prosperity.

Don't hold your breath, Randomfeats. I stated earlier that to even question certain aspects of WWII and the so-called holocaust will result in instant jail sentences in a number of countries (Ernst Zundel, David Irving, [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Gaston-Armand Amaudruz,[/FONT]Frederick Toben et. al.) and may soon be coming to a neighborhood near you.

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They were arrested mostly for charges involving holocaust denial. Not inherently antisemitic, but could be viewed as such.

You can't take one word 'everlasting' and make it the basis of your doctrine:

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You can't take things out of context and attempt to contradict "my doctrine."

Gen 48:4 The Jews did not have their 'everlasting' homeland for thousands of years.

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They've always had some remnant of their people there iirc, you even mentioned how very few Jews "lived in relative harmony" there before 1947.

Exo 12:17 Feast day were to be 'for ever'

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Did I miss something or is the feast of unleavened bread no longer observed?

Exodus 40:15 The Levitical priesthood was supposedly 'everlasting'

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"Throughout their generations" is a pretty big part of the verse to ignore.

Exo 40:15 And thou shalt anoint them, as thou didst anoint their father, that they may minister unto me in the priest's office: for their anointing shall surely be an everlasting priesthood throughout their generations.

Lev 13:64 Yearly animal sacrifices were to be

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'everlasting'

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There is no Leviticus 13:64 in any of the Bibles to which I have access.

Lev. 3:17 Peace offerings, wave offerings and sin offerings were to be 'everlasting' ordinances

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Lev 3:17 It shall be a perpetual statute for your generations throughout all your dwellings, that ye eat neither fat nor blood.

I think you're misquoting verses or have a really skewed comprehension of them.

What you are ignoring, Randomfeats, is the possibility that those claiming to be Jews are Khazar Satanic frauds posing as Jews for profit and power (just as Jesus warned) and that it is the Anglo-Saxon and related races bear the true fruit of the Israelite nations and God gave His true chosen people the New Jerusalem (USA and Europe). Hundreds of generations of Jews have come and gone and the Jews still vehemently reject Jesus as their Messiah. You can be imprisoned for up to five years by merely distributing Bibles in Israel.

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I tried searching for any arrests for distributing Bibles in Israel and didn't find any and certainly not any prison time.

There is NO SALVATION or divine blessing outside of acknowledging Jesus as LORD (period).

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I didn't say there was any other way, but I do recognize why a lot of Jews haven't recognized Jesus as the Messiah.

Rom 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded
Rom 11:8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear; ) unto this day.

if the land of Israel means nothing to the Lord anymore, then why is it the place all the nations of the world come against, why is it the place Jesus returns to fight against these nations?

The land of Israel has nothing to do with salvation or the Jews, but it is to honor the covenant with Gods men of faith, Abraham, Issac, and Jacob. It has nothing to do with the modern Jews of Israel.

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