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Luke 16 "Rich Man/Poor Man" parable.....The most misunderstood/misinterpreted Parable in the NT?

The parable


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LittleLambofJesus

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20 Yet a certain Poor-one was to name Lazarus, who had been cast toward the gate of him, having sores-abiding

In contrast to the Rich Man, we now look at Lazarus:

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

The first thing to note is that he is depicted as a beggar. This is an apt description of the Gentiles who "laid at the gate" of Judah. Paul describes the predicament of the Gentiles before they accepted the Messiah in his letter to the Ephesians:
EPHESIANS 2:12 Remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.
This Scripture is also a fitting representation of the position of the nations before the Messiah's sacrifice for the world's sins. They were certainly "excluded from the commonwealth of Israel," "strangers to the covenants of promise," and "without hope and without God in the world." The Gentiles were beggars, located outside Judah and longing to be fed spiritual crumbs from the table of the divinely blessed Jews.

Additionally, we are told that dogs came and consoled Lazarus in his misery, licking his sores. The Jews considered the surrounding Gentiles to be unclean "dogs." Even Yeshua himself used this unflattering comparison when he conversed with the Greek Syrophoenician woman while in the region of Tyre (Mark 7:24-30).

Also important to the story is the meaning of the name Lazarus. This Greek name is a form of the Hebrew Eleazer, and it literally means "he whom God helps." The use of this particular name is very significant to the message of the parable, for the Gentiles would indeed become "those whom God helped" through the sacrifice of His son, Yeshua.
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The Righterzpen

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This erroneous teaching leads to the denial of the existence of an immediate or present Hell. The false doctrine of soul-sleep, and other ideas that teach the unconscious state of the dead between death and resurrection, spring from this error.

When I studied this; I did not get the impression that "place where they are not seen or heard" was a reference to "soul sleep" or that these dead are not confined to a place where there is no "wailing and gnashing of teeth".

They are not "seen or heard" not because of their silence but because of God's requirement of justice. (Their guilt.)

On the flip side of that coin though, we have the significance of the passages concerning Jesus: "You have not left my soul in hell...." There are also passages in Psalms of: I cry out to You for justice because I'm not guilty of sin - (sort of thing as it relates to Jesus).

So yes, I agree. "hell" and "grave" are not the same thing.
 
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The Righterzpen

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This interpretation makes more contextual sense than alleging Lazarus to be Jesus.

The connection of the name Lazarus to Eleazar is interesting; but since it's from the Septuagint and not the Hebrew; not sure how valid it is. The Septuagint is not Divinely inspired.

Interesting none the less; and would warrant more study.
 
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BobRyan

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It is a parable which means the main point is to listen to the point of the parable.

31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’ ”
 
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ebedmelech

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I'm following the thread...but nothing has convinced me this is anything but a parable that shows me that riches don't mean blessing and poverty is not a curse.

I find more in this parable in common with Jesus' tongue lashing He issued to the Pharisees in Matthew 23.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

20 Yet a certain Poor-one was to name Lazarus, who had been cast toward the gate of him, having sores-abiding

"gate" occurs 253 times in 208 verses in the NKJV.

EPHESIANS 2:12
Remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.
This Scripture is also a fitting representation of the position of the nations before the Messiah's sacrifice for the world's sins. They were certainly "excluded from the commonwealth of Israel," "strangers to the covenants of promise," and "without hope and without God in the world." The Gentiles were beggars, located outside Judah and longing to be fed spiritual crumbs from the table of the divinely blessed Jews.
Mic 1:9 For her wounds are incurable. For it has come to Judah; It has come to the gate of My people—To Jerusalem.
===============
NT Gate
=======================
Pulpit Commentary
In striking contrast to the life of the rich man, the Master, with a few touches, paints the life of the beggar Lazarus. This giving a name to a personage in the parable occurs nowhere else in the evangelists' reports of our Lord's parabolic teaching. It probably was done in this case just to give us a hint, for it is nothing more, of the personal character of the poor sufferer who in the end was so blessed.

The object of the parable, as we shall see, did not include any detailed account of the beggar-man's inner life; just this name is given him to show us why, when he died, he found himself at once in bliss. Among the Jews the name very often describes the character of him who bears it. The Greek name Lazarus is derived from two Hebrew words, El-ezer ("God-help"), shortened by the rabbis into Leazar, whence Lazarus. He was, then, one of those happy ones whose confidence, in all his grief and misery, was in God alone. Well was his trust, as we shall see, justified. The gate at which he was daily laid was a stately portal (πυλών).

Lazarus is represented as utterly unable to win his bread. He was a constant sufferer, covered with sores, wasting under the dominion of a loathsome, incurable disease. This representative of human suffering has taken a strange hold on the imagination of men. In many of the languages of Europe the name of the beggar of the parable appears in the terms "lazar," "lazar-house," and "lazaretto," "lazzaroni." Unable himself to walk, some pitying friend or friends among the poor - the poor are never backward in helping others poorer than themselves, thus setting a noble example to the rich - brought him and laid him daily close by the splendid gates of the palace of Dives. The crumbs signify the broken fragments which the servants of the rich man would contemptuously, perhaps pityingly, toss to the poor helpless beggar-man as he lay by the gate
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Bengel's Gnomen

Even in a parable a proper name has place: Ezekiel 23:4 [Aholah and Aholibah]. However that there was really at Jerusalem at that time such a person, named Lazarus, is recorded by Theophylact from the tradition of the Hebrews.—ἐβέβλητο, was lying)[175] disabled in his limbs. His hunger and nakedness is opposed to the sumptuous fare and fine clothing of the rich man. The character which marked the soul of Lazarus is to be gathered in part from his own external condition, and in part from the opposite character of the rich man.—πυλῶνα, gate) that of a great house: the poor man was removed to a distance from the rich man, at such a distance however, as that the rich man might have been moved to compassion, and Lazarus at the same time might see his table. The antithesis is “Abraham’s bosom,” [κόλπον, Luke 16:22], Comp. note Acts 12:13 [πυλὼν is more spacious than πύλη, and may include the adjoining hall or uncovered entrance].

[175] Rather, he had been laid by others, not being able to move himself.—E. and T.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Sores on Lazarus

20 Yet a certain Poor-one was to name Lazarus, who had been cast toward the gate of him, having sores abiding<1669>

"sores" occurs 6 times in 6 verses in the NKJV.
"sore" occurs 31 times in 25 verses in the NKJV.
Exo 9:9
“And it will become fine dust in all the land of Egypt, and it will cause boils that break out in sores on man and beast throughout all the land of Egypt.”
Lev 13:2
“When a man has on the skin of his body a swelling, a scab, or a bright spot, and it becomes on the skin of his body like a leprous[fn] sore, then he shall be brought to Aaron the priest or to one of his sons the priests.
G1669 ἑλκόω (helkoō) occurs 1 times in 1 verse
1669. helkoo from 1668; to cause to ulcerate, i.e. (passively) be ulcerous:--full of sores.

G1668 ἕλκος (helkos) occurs 3 times in 3 verses
1668. helkos
probably from 1670; an ulcer (as if drawn together):--sore.

Rev 16:2 So the first went and poured out his bowl upon the earth, and a foul and loathsome sore came upon the men who had the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image.
Rev 16:11 They blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and did not repent of their deeds
Kindgdom Bible Studies Template Page

Who is the poor neglected beggar full of sores, to whom the very dogs show more pity and kindness than the rich man? The rich man “fared sumptuously every day” while Lazarus was lying at his gate a mass of sores, loathsome and in want, and yet uncared for and unpitied by him who enjoyed so many blessings. Who is this poor, wretched, pathetic, despised man?

The Jews looked upon the heathen nations about them as barbarians and dogs.
It seems quite clear therefore that in this parable Lazarus is the people lying at Judah’s gate who are recipients of none of the blessings so lavishly bestowed upon them.

In the rich man we see the children of the Kingdom, who as such were clothed in purple and fine linen, rich and increased with goods, daily feasting on the finest of delicacies, contrasted with the heathen world, lost, full of sores, and lacking everything. Lazarus was laid at the rich man’s gate full of sores, which denotes his cast-out and spiritually deficient condition.
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Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

In contrast to the rich man, we now see Lazarus. The first thing to note is that he is depicted as a beggar. This is an apt description of the Gentiles who "laid at the gate" of Judah. Paul describes the predicament of the Gentiles before they accepted the Messiah in his letter to the Ephesians:

This Scripture is also a fitting representation of the position of the nations before the Messiah's sacrifice for the world's sins. They were certainly "excluded from the commonwealth of Israel," "strangers to the covenants of promise," and "without hope and without God in the world." The Gentiles were beggars, located outside Judah and longing to be fed spiritual crumbs from the table of the divinely blessed Jews.

Additionally, we are told that dogs came and consoled Lazarus in his misery, licking his sores. The Jews considered the surrounding Gentiles to be unclean "dogs." Even Yeshua himself used this unflattering comparison when he conversed with the Greek Syrophoenician woman while in the region of Tyre (Mark 7:24-30).

Also important to the story is the meaning of the name Lazarus. This Greek name is a form of the Hebrew Eleazer, and it literally means "he whom God helps." The use of this particular name is very significant to the message of the parable, for the Gentiles would indeed become "those whom God helped" through the sacrifice of His son, Yeshua.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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It is a parable which means the main point is to listen to the point of the parable.

31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’ ”


It can be discovered that Jesus was talking especially or specifically to the religious leaders who had and believed in no resurrection, or in some kind of false after life,
and Jesus was using their own 'stories' to expose the falseness of them (which they saw then, but few people see today).

So much in the words of Jesus telling the story of Lazarus and the rich man is directly contrary , if it was a factual happening, to all Scripture, that it obviously cannot be real in that sense. No, it was perfectly used to expose false beliefs of religious leaders at the time, who Jesus was addressing....
 
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BobRyan

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True and many Bible scholars such as R.C. Sproul admitted that this is a parable since you have things like "praying to the dead" in the story and God is not presented as the "Sovereign of all of heaven" but rather Abraham is.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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True and many Bible scholars such as R.C. Sproul admitted that this is a parable since you have things like "praying to the dead" in the story and God is not presented as the "Sovereign of all of heaven" but rather Abraham is.
And someone else pointed out that someone being burned continually in a presumed fire of great intensity would not be talking with someone else dead, nor asking for A DROP of water....
 
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BABerean2

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Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

From your link...

"CONCLUSION

The parable of Lazarus and the rich man, long used by mainstream Christian ministers to teach the "reality of hell," really has nothing to say about punishment or reward in the afterlife. Yeshua used this story, which fit the common misconception about life after death in his day, to show the fate that awaited the Jewish nation because of the unbelief and faithlessness which caused them to reject him as the Messiah. They still suffer from that fate to this very day. Yet the time is soon coming when God will pour on the Jews the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on their Messiah whom they pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for his only son, and grieve for him as one grieves for a firstborn (Zec. 12:10).

Bryan T. Huie
January 9, 1998"


Did Christ reveal the reality of hell in the verse below?

Mat_10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.


Was Zechariah 12:10 fulfilled during the first century, or does it lie in the future, as the author above infers?

Joh 19:34 But one of the soldiers pierced His side with a spear, and immediately blood and water came out.
Joh 19:35 And he who has seen has testified, and his testimony is true; and he knows that he is telling the truth, so that you may believe.
Joh 19:36 For these things were done that the Scripture should be fulfilled, "NOT ONE OF HIS BONES SHALL BE BROKEN."
Joh 19:37 And again another Scripture says, "THEY SHALL LOOK ON HIM WHOM THEY PIERCED."

.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Luke 16:21 And yearning<1937> to be satisfied from the scraps, those falling from the table<5132> of the Rich Man, but also the dogs<2965> coming licked-upon the sores of him.

1937. epithumeo from 1909 and 2372;
to set the heart upon, i.e. long for (rightfully or otherwise):--covet, desire, would fain, lust (after).
G1937 ἐπιθυμέω (epithymeō) occurs 18 times in 16 verses
==============
Luk 17:22
Then He said to the disciples, “The days will come when you will desire to see one of the days of the Son of Man, and you will not see it.
Rom 7:7
What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.
James 4:2
Ye are coveting/desiring
<1937> and not ye are having. Ye are murdering<5407> and being jealous/envious and not ye are able to be obtaining. Ye are fighting and are battling and not ye are having because ye are not requesting.
James 5:6 Ye condemn, ye murder<5407> the Righteous-One, not He is resisting to Ye.
==============================
Revelation..........

REVELATION 9:6 "MEN WILL BE SEEKING THE DEATH, DEATH IS FLEEING FROM THEM" 70AD SIEGE FAMINE?


Revelation 9:6 And in those days the men shall be seeking the death, and not no shall be finding it; and they shall be desiring/yearning<1937> to be dying, and the death is fleeing from them.
Another form of that Greek word used in conjunction with the Great City:
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Luke 16:21 And yearning to be satisfied from the scraps falling from the table<5132> of the Rich Man, but also the dogs<2965> coming licked-upon the sores of him.

jI had never given much thought to the "table" mentioned until I started seeing where it is mentioned in both the OT and NT.

The table could be symbolizing a regular table for eating meals at, but also symbolize a type of OC table of show bread which was located inside the Sanctuary where only Priests could enter and minister. The Rich man appears to represent both Royalty and a Priest as described earlier concerning the clothing, which can also be viewed as an anti-type of Jesus, Who was a type of Melchizedek.

Some verses from the NT:

Mat 9:10
Now it happened, as Jesus sat at the table in the house, that behold, many tax collectors and sinners came and sat down with Him and His disciples.
Mat 15:27
And she said, “Yes, Lord, yet even the little dogs eat the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.”
Mar 7:28
And she answered and said to Him, “Yes, Lord, yet even the little dogs under the table eat from the children's crumbs.
Luk 14:10
“But when you are invited, go and sit down in the lowest place, so that when he who invited you comes he may say to you, ‘Friend, go up higher.' Then you will have glory in the presence of those who sit at the table with you.
Luk 22:30
“that you may eat and drink at My table in My kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.”
=============================
Used in 3 verses outside of the Gospel's with Hebrews mentioning the table of showbread

Rom 11:9
And David says:Let their table become a snare and a trap, A stumbling block and a recompense to them.
1Co 10:21
You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the Lord's table and of the table of demons.

Heb 9:2
For a tabernacle was prepared: the first part, in which was the lampstand, the table, and the showbread, which is called the sanctuary;

What about Revelation 11:1-2 SANCTUARY, COURT AND HOLY CITY
Sanctuary and Court

=====================================
Some OT verses:

Exo 26:35
“You shall set the table outside the veil, and the lampstand across from the table on the side of the tabernacle toward the south; and you shall put the table on the north side.
Exo 37:16
He made of pure gold the utensils which were on the table: its dishes, its cups, its bowls, and its pitchers for pouring.
Num 4:7
“On the table of showbread they shall spread a blue cloth, and put on it the dishes, the pans, the bowls, and the pitchers for pouring; and the showbread shall be on it.

Mal 1:7
“You offer defiled food on My altar, But say, ‘In what way have we defiled You?' By saying, ‘The table of the LORD is contemptible.'
Mal 1:12
“But you profane it, In that you say, ‘The table of the LORD is defiled; And its fruit, its food, is contemptible.'
=============================
Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

This Scripture is also a fitting representation of the position of the nations before the Messiah's sacrifice for the world's sins. They were certainly "excluded from the commonwealth of Israel," "strangers to the covenants of promise," and "without hope and without God in the world." The Gentiles were beggars, located outside Judah and longing to be fed spiritual crumbs from the table of the divinely blessed Jews.

Also important to the story is the meaning of the name Lazarus. This Greek name is a form of the Hebrew Eleazer, and it literally means "he whom God helps." The use of this particular name is very significant to the message of the parable, for the Gentiles would indeed become "those whom God helped" through the sacrifice of His son, Yeshua.
==========================
Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible
And desiring to be fed with the crumbs,.... The offal food, broken bread, fragments of meat: that food which falls from the knife, or plate, in eating, and from thence on the ground; and literally understood, may express the low condition Christ was in, in his human nature: he assumed a true body, like to ours, and partook of the same flesh and blood with us, and was liable to the same infirmities as ours, which are sinless; and among the rest, was subject to hunger and thirst, and was obliged to the ministration of others for a subsistence: and it may also express his contentment in such a condition; he never murmured at the providence of God, but was entirely, resigned to his will; he did not desire to live in fulness and affluence, but avoided and shunned every step that led unto it; nor did he envy the plenty of others, and was fully satisfied with his meanness; nor did he ever work a miracle for the sake of feeding himself.

Moreover, the words being understood mystically, may design the elect of God among the Jews, who, like crumbs, were few in number, a seed, a remnant, according to the election of grace; there were but few among them that were chosen of God, and effectually called by his grace; and but a little flock to whom he gave the kingdom; and a small number, who entered in at the strait gate, and were saved; and these few were very mean and despicable for their outward poverty; for the poor had the Gospel preached to them, and they received it, when the rich, and the rulers of the people, rejected it: and they were like crumbs their small degree of worldly wisdom and knowledge, being babes, simple, and foolish, who followed Christ, while the learned, wise, and prudent despised him; and for their sinfulness and vileness, being, generally speaking, notorious sinners, publicans and harlots; and of these it may be said what follows,
which fell from the rich man's table; being originally of the Jews, but separated from them by the grace of God, and rejected by them with scorn and contempt. These Christ "desired"; see Sol 7:10 his desire was towards them from everlasting, when he asked them of his Father, and they were given to him; and it was not only after their persons, but after their salvation, and that both in eternity and in time; and which he signified by various words and actions; and it is towards them, while in a state of unregeneracy, that they may be converted, and believe in him; and when they are called, he delights in the grace he puts in them, and in the righteousness he puts upon them; he takes pleasure in their company; he desires them for his habitation; he stands at the door and knocks for admission to them; and nothing is he more earnestly solicitous for, and eager after, than their being with him in glory to all eternity; and his end in all, "is to be fed" or "satisfied with them";
see Isaiah 53:11 he came into the world to gather these scattered crumbs and fragments together; it was his meat and drink, to work out their salvation; and it will be his highest joy and pleasure to present them to his Father, and himself, complete and perfect, and introduce them into his kingdom and glory: he will be fully satisfied in them, and they in him, when they shall awake in his likeness. Then will all Christ's desires, prayers, and intercessions, have their full accomplishment. The Vulgate Latin adds, "and no man gave to him"; which seems to be transcribed from Luke 15:16 and is not supported by any copy or version.
==============================
Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
(21) And desiring to be fed with the crumbs.—The habits of the East, the absence of knives and forks and the like, made the amount of waste of this kind larger than do the habits of modern Europe. (Comp. the language of the Syro-Phœnician woman, in Mark 7:28.) Here the picture is heightened by two touches. The dogs are there, and get the crumbs, which the man fails to get, and then they come and lick the open sores. The question has been raised whether this touch is meant to intensify the sufferings of the beggar, or to contrast the almost human sympathy of the brute with the brutal apathy of the man.
 
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Contenders Edge

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When Jesus speaks in parables, He generally does not give names to the characters He features and if there is a reason to believe that the story of the rich man and Lazarus is at least in part true story, it is because the poor man Lazarus has a name. The rich man is not given a name.

We also know that Jesus rose a man named Lazarus from the dead. Is this Lazarus who was raised from the dead the poor man in the story? If so, then this would lend credence that the story is in fact a true story and not merely a parable.

As for the Lazarus who was raised from the dead, we do not know much about him except that he had fallen ill, had died, and then was raised from the dead. Is it possible that this man had experienced the misfortune of being a beggar on the street before being found by his sisters? That is a possibility.

This story also gives us a glimpse of what the after-life was like for men before the New Covenant.
All men went down into Sheol, only those who had died in faith went to a compartment called Paradise which was also called Abraham's Bosom, a place of comfort where Lazarus had gone.

The rich man woke up in the torment side of Hell and in short found himself longing for even a small drop of water to cool his tongue. Before the death and resurrection of Christ, no departed soul, good or bad, was admitted into the direct presence of God, but because God is just, He would not suffer the righteous to experience an afterlife of torment either hence the reason for Paradise.

Remember also that Jesus told the repentant thief who was crucified alongside Him that he would be with Him in Paradise. Christ clearly did not go into Hell to be tormented. That was already done for us on the cross. Instead, He went into Paradise for the three days He was in the grave.

But after the establishment of the New Covenant by the death of Christ and His resurrection, men can now be in the presence of the Lord after death upon forgiveness of sins by placing their trust in Christ and in Him alone for their salvation but those who refuse, will find themselves in eternal torment.
 
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Daniel C

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Also this scenario is depicted to real for a parable. The rich man still had all his senses in hell, he could see,taste the water hear the voices.....feel the flames.

And the examples were real people,Lazarus,moses,Abraham and the condemned rich man.
 
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yeshuasavedme

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Little Lamb, without the foundation laid for the doctrines of Sheol in the belly of the earth, and the Lake of Fire/Kingdom of darkness prepared for the Devil and his evil angels =the satans, then all you have here is only error and speculation on these things.
Enoch the prophet, the 7th from Adam [as Jude, the womb brother of Jesus wrote -with understanding of the Book, for they had it and read it], saw it all when taken on tours of the entire creation, and who was shown everything by the angels appointed to show him these things, laid down the entire foundational for the belly of the earth and the 4 hollows there, and who was in them and went to them and how long they would be held there.

Jesus spoke about that real place, in Luke 16, not as laying a new foundation or giving a parable, but telling about the “certain man”, and Lazarus, who were real people, in Sheol below. One in torments and one in comfort at that time -until Jesus descended and led those ones out of the captivity of death who waited there, in the death of separation from the Father of Glory until the Atonement was finished and Yeshua came down and set them free, and took them to Paradise above.
Okay, that being true, the rich man had a name, and he had a residence, and he had 5 brothers. So when that rich man asked for Lazarus to go warn his brothers so that they would not come there, Abraham answered him that they would not believe if one rose from the dead, if they would not believe Moses.

The most merciful LORD, being gracious to the 5 brothers who were alive, gave them the message, Himself, that day.

“Prove it ain’t so!”
They were alive. They knew about Lazarus and their brother. They heard Jesus.
The rich man’s prayer that his brothers be warned was actually delivered that day.
God is merciful....plenty of warning to those brothers, and to all who heard Jesus that day and ever after, who read about it.
 
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Shrewd Manager

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Hm, food for thought here.

How about the 'certain rich man' as Solomon, with his purple and fine linen, having 5 brothers, and likes to party down? If the shoe fits...

Solomon as the 'father of the Pharisees'-type, spoilt by wealth become apostate, idolatrous and occultic. To this day the Jews and Freemasons venerate Solomon.

I like the idea that Lazarus is at least a type of Christ, but moreso in the raised Lazarus of John 11 fame, but obviously there's a connection in the name alone. Eleazer is translated as 'God helps', but could it not possibly mean or suggest 'God's helper'? Still the best fit seems to me to be Israel, the longsuffering children who've been shut out of Solomon's temple.

The sores indicate at least Lazarus has wounds that need tending to, need healing. The esoteric mystery crumbs from the table are unsatisfying, and won't help his condition. Maybe that's what's making him ooze.

The dogs are at least a certain type of gentile, and maybe they are types of Christians who drink of Jesus' blood from his wounds, which is life.

So the picture of Hades can be seen as the product of this spiritual idolatry by which pagan concepts have crept into Judaism. So the rich man and his ilk introduce this rubbish into doctrine, and Jesus says, ok this is where it leads.

So the devil digs a pit and proceeds to fall into it. (A bit like me after the foregoing analysis!)
 
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LittleLambofJesus

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!
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Luke 16:21 And yearning to be satisfied from the scraps falling from the table of the Rich Man, but also the dogs<2965> coming licked-upon the sores<1668> of him.

It is interesting to note that there 2 Greek words for dogs in the NT There are various views on what these adult hound dogs are representing.

Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon


2965. kuon a primary word; a dog ("hound") (literally or figuratively):--dog.
[2952. kunarion neuter of a presumed derivative of 2965; a puppy:--dog.]
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NT verses that use G2965:

G2965 κύων (kyōn) occurs 5 times in 5 verses

Mat 7:6
“Do not give what is holy to the dogs; nor cast your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you in pieces.
Luk 16:21
“desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
Phl 3:2
Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the mutilation/circumcision!
2Pe 2:22
But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: “A dog returns to his own vomit,”[fn] and, “a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.”

Rev 22:15
But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.
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A few commentaries"

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

In contrast to the rich man, we now see Lazarus. The first thing to note is that he is depicted as a beggar. This is an apt description of the Gentiles who "laid at the gate" of Judah. Paul describes the predicament of the Gentiles before they accepted the Messiah in his letter to the Ephesians:

Additionally, we are told that dogs came and consoled Lazarus in his misery, licking his sores. The Jews considered the surrounding Gentiles to be unclean "dogs." Even Yeshua himself used this unflattering comparison when he conversed with the Greek Syrophoenician woman while in the region of Tyre (Mark 7:24-30).
Also important to the story is the meaning of the name Lazarus. This Greek name is a form of the Hebrew Eleazer, and it literally means "he whom God helps."
============================
Kindgdom Bible Studies Template Page

Lazarus means, “Whom God helps.” And the plaintive cry of this Canaanite woman, at the very border of the land of Israel, in all her spiritual poverty and ethnic loathsomeness was, “Lord, HELP ME!” What could be a greater commentary on the true meaning of the parable of the rich man and Lazarus than the expressions found in this remarkable story. When you remember the expressions, “the dogs,” and, “the crumbs which fall from the master’s table,” these parallel precisely the expressions found in the parable of the rich man and Lazarus. “And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table: the other dogs came and licked his sores.”

Lazarus’ association with the dogs and his lying at the rich man’s gate, fed upon crumbs that fell from his table, places him quite convincingly in both the “dog” class and the “Gentile” class. In the encounter with the Canaanite woman it was the “dogs” that ate the crumbs, while in the parable of the rich man it is Lazarus who eats the crumbs. How beautifully this confirms to our understanding Lazarus’ identity with the “dogs.” The “dogs” of that day were the non-Jewish pagans, and this woman was a Canaanite, the vilest of the vile. Lazarus lay at the rich man’s “gate,” and this woman encountered the Lord at the “border” of the land of Israel. How plainer can language be! As to religion, all that the nations had of truth and reality were the crumbs that fell from the Jewish table. The heathen had no prophet; they had no scripture revealed by the Holy Spirit; they had no great temple service instituted by the God of heaven; they had no covenant with the true and living God; but in Eph. 2:11-12 Paul calls the saints to remember that they being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, at that time they were:
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Expositor's Greek Testament
and moreover, etc.—ἐπέλειχον, licked (here only in N.T.); was this an aggravation or a mitigation? Opinion is much divided. Or is the point that dogs were his companions, now licking his sores (whether a benefit or otherwise), now scrambling with him for the morsels thrown out? The scramble was as much a fact as the licking. Furrer speaks of witnessing dogs and lepers waiting together for the refuse
================================
Bengel's Gnomen
This particle, the words, not only so, having to be supplied in the former member, usually intensifies the force of the words which follow.—οἱ κύνες) the dogs, strictly so called [not figuratively]. The utter desertion of the naked and outcast Lazarus is herein denoted. The words, the angels, in Luke 16:22, form a powerful antithesis to the dogs here.—ἑρχόμενοι, coming) not for Lazarus’ sake, but for their own; as if he were a corpse [a carcase for them to prey upon].—ἀπέλειχον, began to lick off) The structure of the dog’s tongue and its saliva impart relief to a body that is not much diseased; but these exasperate the pain of a body covered over with ulcers (‘sores’).—ἓλκη) sores, full of matter.
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Equivalent Hebrew word:

3611 keleb from an unused root means. to yelp, or else to attack; a dog; hence (by euphemism) a male prostitute:--dog.

Some verses where it is used.......Jezebel[wife of Ahab, mentioned in Thyatira, the 4th Assembly in Revelation] and Ahab, the enemies of the Prophet Eilijah are mentioned

H3611 כֶּלֶב (keleb) occurs 32 times in 31 verses

1Ki 21:23
“And concerning Jezebel the LORD also spoke, saying, ‘The dogs shall eat Jezebel by the wall of Jezreel.’
1Ki 21:24
The dogs shall eat whoever belongs to Ahab and dies in the city, and the birds of the air shall eat whoever dies in the field.”

Last 4 times used in OT

Psa 22:16
For dogs have surrounded Me; The congregation of the wicked has enclosed Me. They pierced My hands and My feet;

Isa 56:11
Yes, they are greedy dogs Which never have enough. And they are shepherds Who cannot understand; They all look to their own way,
Every one for his own gain, From his own territory.

Isa 66:3
“He who kills a bull is as if he slays a man; He who sacrifices a lamb, as if he breaks a dog’s neck; He who offers a grain offering, as if he offers swine’s blood; He who burns incense, as if he blesses an idol.
Just as they have chosen their own ways, And their soul delights in their abominations,

Jer 15:3
“And I will appoint over them four forms of destruction,” says the LORD: “the sword to slay, the dogs to drag, the birds of the heavens and the beasts of the earth to devour and destroy.
=================================

 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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Also this scenario is depicted to real for a parable. The rich man still had all his senses in hell, he could see,taste the water hear the voices.....feel the flames.
This actually contradicts the possibility that it ever happened.

(the other descriptions of torture do not give space for the rich man to know anything nor to speak to anyone, and obviously not to ask for a drop of water when buckets would not cool him if in such circumstances)

No problem though - it is no contradiction with Scripture when understood as the Jews understood Jesus' depiction.... it directly confronted and exposed the false and contradictory to reality ideas the religious leaders had that Jesus was speaking to. (He did not address this to disciples/students/or pupils of His, but to those opposed to the Father) ....
 
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LittleLambofJesus

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!
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22 Became yet to be dying the beggar/poor-one<4434> and to be carried away him by the Messengers into the bosom of Abraham.
Yet died also the Rich-one and was entombed.

4434. ptochos from ptosso (to crouch); akin to 4422 and the alternate of 4098);
a beggar (as cringing), i.e. pauper (strictly denoting absolute or public mendicancy, although also used in a qualified or relative sense; whereas 3993 properly means only straitened circumstances in private), literally (often as noun) or figuratively (distressed):--beggar(-ly), poor.
G4434 πτωχός (ptōchos) occurs 34 times in 34 verses

Mat 5:3
“Blessed are the poor in spirit, For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

Luk 4:18
“The Spirit of the LORD is upon Me, Because He has anointed Me To preach the gospel to the poor;
He has sent Me
to heal the brokenhearted,[fn] To proclaim liberty to the captives And recovery of sight to the blind, To set at liberty those who are oppressed;

Luk 14:21
“So that servant came and reported these things to his master. Then the master of the house, being angry, said to his servant, ‘Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in here the poor and the maimed and the lame and the blind.’

Gal 2:10
They desired only that we should remember the poor, the very thing which I also was eager to do.

Jas 2:2
For if there should come into your assembly a man with gold rings, in fine apparel, and there should also come in a poor man in filthy clothes,
Jas 2:3
and you pay attention to the one wearing the fine clothes and say to him, “You sit here in a good place,” and say to the poor man, “You stand there,” or, “Sit here at my footstool,”
Jas 2:5
Listen, my beloved brethren: Has God not chosen the poor of this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which He promised to those who love Him?
Jas 2:6
But you have dishonored the poor man. Do not the rich oppress you and drag you into the courts?
================
Luke 16:
19 Yet a certain Man was rich
22 Became yet to be dying the beggar/poor-one<4434>

Used 2 times in the covenantle book of Revelation:

Rev 3:17

“Because you say, ‘I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing’—and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked—

Rev 13:16

He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads,

========================
A similar story/parable occurs in Samuel of the OT:

1Sa 2:7
The LORD makes poor and makes rich; He brings low and lifts up.


2Sa 12:1
Then the LORD sent Nathan to David. And he came to him, and said to him: “There were two men in one city, one rich and the other poor.
2Sa 12:4
“And a traveler came to the rich man, who refused to take from his own flock and from his own herd to prepare one for the wayfaring man who had come to him; but he took the poor man's lamb and prepared it for the man who had come to him.”
 
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