Luke 16 "Rich Man/Poor Man" parable.....The most misunderstood/misinterpreted Parable in the NT?

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 27, 2019

This "Covenantle" parable is probably my largest study of the Bible and would like to go thru it.

I happen to like the commentary on this site as he delves into the Greek in most places, so I will be using him a lot.

A little background on where the parable was spoken and to whom it was spoken.
Note the reaction by the Judean religious Rulers to this parable:

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

The self-righteous Pharisees and scribes, acknowledged by Yeshua as the legitimate religious teachers of the Jews (Matt. 23:1-3), should have been the ones telling these people of God's love for them. They should have been the ones teaching these sinners, exhorting them to return to God and receive His love and forgiveness. However, because of their faith in their own righteousness and their contempt for these tax collectors and sinners who didn't measure up to their standards, the Pharisees and scribes excluded them and considered them accursed (John 7:49).

Afterward, speaking primarily to his disciples but with the Pharisees (and probably the crowd) still listening in, Yeshua related the parable of the unjust steward (Luke 16:1-13).

The Pharisees, who were "lovers of money" (Luke 16:14), realized that the Messiah was alluding to them with this parable and took offense. They scoffed at Yeshua.

The final part of his response to the derision of the Pharisees and scribes was the parable of Lazarus and the rich man.

Luke 16 YLT
14 And also the Pharisees, being lovers of money, were hearing all these things, and were deriding him, 15 and he said to them, ‘Ye are those declaring yourselves righteous before men, but God doth know your hearts; because that which among men is high, [is] abomination before God; 16 the law and the prophets [are] till John; since then the reign of God is proclaimed good news, and every one doth press into it; 17 and it is easier to the heaven and the earth to pass away, than of the law one tittle to fall.18 ‘Every one who is sending away his wife, and marrying another, doth commit adultery; and every one who is marrying her sent away from a husband doth commit adultery.

19 Yet a certain Man was rich and was clothed purple and fine-linen, making-merry down to a-day shiningly
20 Yet a certain Poor-one was to name Lazarus, who had been cast toward the his gate, having sores-abiding
21 And yearning to be satisfied from the scraps, those falling from the table of the Rich-one, but also the dogs coming licked-upon the sores of him.
22 Became yet to be dying the Poor-one and to be carried away him by the Messengers into the bosom of Abraham.
Yet died also the Rich-one and was entombed.
23 And in the Hades lifting up his eyes existing in torments, he is seeing the Abraham from afar and Lazarus in the bosom of him.
24 And he sounding said "Father Abraham! be you merciful to-me! and send Lazarus! that he should be dipping the tip of the finger of him of water and should be cooling down the tongue of me, that I am being anguished in this flame".
25 Said yet Abraham "Child! be thou being reminded! that thou got the goods of the in the life of thee and Lazarus in like manner the evils,
yet now here he is being comforted and thou art being pained.
26 And upon all of these between us and ye a chasm great hath been established so that those willing to cross-over hence toward ye no may be able, neither thence toward us may be ferrying"
27 Saying yet "I am asking thee then father!, that thou should be sending him into the house of my father,
28 for I am having five brothers which he may be testifying to them that no also they may be coming into the place this of the torment".
29 Abraham is saying to him "they are having Moses and the Prophets let them hear them!".
30 The yet he said: "nay father Abraham!
but if ever any from dead-ones may be going forth toward them they shall be repenting/reforming.
31 Saying yet to him "if Moses and the Prophets not they are hearing, neither if ever anyone out of dead-ones may be rising, they shall be being persuaded".
=============================================
Luke 16:19 Yet a certain man was rich and was clothed in purple and fine-linen, making-merry down to a-day shiningly.

Mat 26:18
And He said, “Go into the city to a certain man, and say to him, ‘The Teacher says, “My time is at hand; I will keep the Passover at your house with My disciples.” ' ”
Mar 15:21
Then they compelled a certain man, Simon a Cyrenian, the father of Alexander and Rufus, as he was coming out of the country and passing by, to bear His cross.

Luke 10:30 Then Jesus answered and said: “a certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among thieves, who stripped him of his clothing, wounded him, and departed, leaving him half dead.
Luk 13:6 He also spoke this parable: “a certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard, and he came seeking fruit on it and found none.
Luk 14:
2 And behold, there was a certain man before Him who had dropsy.
16 Then He said to him, “a certain man gave a great supper and invited many,
Luk 15:11 Then He said: “a certain man had two sons.
Luk 16:
1 And he said also unto his disciples, 'a certain man was rich, who had a steward, and he was accused to him as scattering his goods;
19 'And -- a certain man was rich, and was clothed in purple and fine linen, making merry sumptuously every day,
Luk 19:12 He said therefore, 'a certain man of birth went on to a far country, to take to himself a kingdom, and to return,
Luk 20:9 Then He began to tell the people this parable: “a certain man planted a vineyard, leased it to vinedressers, and went into a far country for a long time.

G444 used in 24 verses of the covenantle book of Revelation......

1st verse used in Revelation:
Rev 1:13 and in the midst of the seven lamp-stands, one like to a son of man, clothed to the foot, and girt round at the breast with a golden girdle,

Last verse used:
Rev 21:17 and he measured its wall, an hundred forty-four cubits, the measure of a Man, that is, of the Messenger;
==================================
Luke 16:19 Commentaries: biblehub

Bengel's Gnomen
Luke 16:19.
Ἄνθρωπος, a man) This parable (for it is a parable, though a true narrative may lie underneath it) not only condemns the abuse of external goods by covetousness and pride, but also condemns a proud contempt of the law and the prophets: comp. Luke 16:14 et seqq. The rich man is the exact representative of the Pharisees: Lazarus is an example of the poor in spirit: The state of both respectively in this life and in that which is to come is shown.—πορφύραν καὶ βύσσον, purple and fine linen) forming a beautifully blending of colours.

==============

Pulpit Commentary

Verse 19. - There was a certain rich man. He is thus introduced by the Lord without any details respecting his age or place of residence - nameless, too! Seems he not to have been reading from that book where he found the name of the poor man written, but found not the name of the rich; for that book is the book of life?" (Sermon 178. 3 of St. Augustine). Tradition says his name was Nimeusis, but it is simply a baseless tradition. Which was clothed in purple and fine linen. The words which describe the life of Dives were chosen with rare skill; they are few, but enough to show us that the worldly hero of the story lived a life of royal magnificence and boundless luxury. His ordinary apparel seems to have been purple and fine linen. This purple, the true sea purple, was a most precious and rare dye, and the purple garment so dyed was a royal gift, and was scarcely used save by princes and nobles of very high degree. In it the idol-images were sometimes arrayed. The fine linen (byssus) was worth twice its weight in gold. It was in hue dazzlingly white. And fared sumptuously every day. With this princely rich man banquets were a matter of daily occurrence.

Luther renders the Greek here, "lebte herrlich und in Freuden." Thus with all the accompaniments of grandeur this nameless mighty one lived, his halls ever filled with noble guests, his antechambers with servants. Everything with him that could make life splendid and joyous was in profusion.
Some have suspected that our Lord took, as the model for his picture here, the life of the tetrarch Herod Antipas. The court of that magnificent and luxurious prince would certainly have well served as the original of the picture; but Herod was still living, and it is more likely that Jesus was describing the earth-life of one who had already been" dismissed" from his earthly stewardship, and who, when he spoke the parable, was in the world to come.

==================

Meyer's NT Commentary

Luke 16:19. After Jesus in Luke 16:15-18 has rebuked the Pharisees, He now justifies in opposition to them the doctrines, Luke 16:9-13, on account of which they had derided Him,—showing them in the following fictitious doctrinal narrative (which is not, as with Hengstenberg, to be transferred to the repast of Bethany) to what riches lead if they are not applied in the manner prescribed in Luke 16:9, to the ποιεῖν ἑαυτῷ φίλους.[206] Comp. Theophylact. De Wette (comp. Holtzmann) wrongly denies all connection with what goes before, and finds set forth only the thought: Blessed are the poor; woe to the rich (Luke 6:20; Luke 6:24), so that there is wanting any moral view of the future retribution, and hence the suspicion arises that in the first portion, Luke 16:19-26, “the well-known prejudice” of Luke, or of his informant, against riches and in favour of poverty, is arbitrarily introduced...
I feel that this is a fairly good vid presentation/commentary on the parable for those interested and comments on it are appreciated:

============================
19 Yet a certain Man was rich and was clothed purple and fine-linen, making-merry down to a-day shiningly

Post #1
Certain Man

Post #6
Purple Fine Linen

Post #16
purple

Post #11
making merry

Post #13
shiningly/sumptuously
=================
20 Yet a certain Poor-one was to name Lazarus, who had been cast toward the his gate, having sores-abiding

Post #21
Lazarus

Post #26
laid at the gate

Post #27
sores
===============
21 And yearning to be satisfied from the scraps, those falling from the table of the Rich-one, but also the dogs coming licked-upon the sores of him.

Post #32
yearning/lusting

Post #33
table

Post #38
dogs

Post #27
sores
TO BE CONTINUED................

Presbyterian Continuist · Aug 27, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
This "Covenantle" parable is probably my largest study of the Bible and would like to go thru it.

This translation of verses 19-31 is by using the T-R, a Greek interlinear, and Lexicon/Concordance.

Luke 16 YLT

Luke 16:
14And also the Pharisees, being lovers of money, were hearing all these things, and were deriding him, 15and he said to them, ‘Ye are those declaring yourselves righteous before men, but God doth know your hearts; because that which among men is high, [is] abomination before God; 16the law and the prophets [are] till John; since then the reign of God is proclaimed good news, and every one doth press into it; 17and it is easier to the heaven and the earth to pass away, than of the law one tittle to fall.
18‘Every one who is sending away his wife, and marrying another, doth commit adultery; and every one who is marrying her sent away from a husband doth commit adultery.

19 Yet a certain Man was rich and was clothed purple and fine-linen making-merry down to a-day shiningly
20 Yet a certain Poor-one was to name Lazarus, who had been cast toward the gate of him, having sores-abiding
21 And yearning to be satisfied from the scraps, those falling from the table of the Rich-one,
but also the dogs coming licked-upon the sores of him.
22 Became yet to be dying the Poor-one and to be carried away him by the Messengers into the bosom of Abraham.
Yet died also the Rich-one and was entombed.
23 And in the hades lifting up his eyes existing in torments, he is seeing the Abraham from afar and Lazarus in the bosoms of him.
24 And he sounding said "Father Abraham! be you merciful to-me! and send Lazarus! that he should be dipping the tip of the finger of him of water and should be cooling down the tongue of me, that I am being pained in the flame, this".
25 Said yet Abraham "child! be thou being reminded! that thou got the goods of the in the life of thee and Lazarus in like manner the evils, yet now here he is being comforted and thou art being pained.
26 And upon all of these between us and ye a chasm great hath been established so that those willing to cross-over hence toward ye no may be able, neither thence toward us may be ferrying"
27 Saying yet "I am asking thee then father!, that thou should be sending him into the house of the father of me.
28 for I am having five brothers which he may be testifying to them that no also they may be coming into the place this of the torment".
29 Abraham is saying to him "they are having Moses and the Prophets let them hear them!".
30 The yet he said: "not! father Abraham, but if ever any from dead-ones may be going forth toward them they shall be reforming.
31 Saying yet to him "if Moses and the Prophets not they are hearing, neither if ever anyone out of dead-ones may be rising, they shall be being persuaded".
============================

There are a plethora of commentaries concerning this parable that can be found doing a google search:

https://www.google.com/search?clien....141.764.2j5......0....1..gws-wiz.S73AQsp5qKI
=============================================
I happen to like the commentary on this site as he delves into the Greek in most places, so I will be using him a lot.

A little background on where the parable was spoken and to whom it was spoken.

Note the reaction by the Judean religious Rulers to this parable:

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

Let's start by getting some background information on the situation in which Yeshua told this parable. Luke tells us that all the tax collectors and sinners were coming to the Messiah to hear what he had to say (Luke 15:1).
This made the Pharisees and scribes jealous and they complained, vehemently criticizing Yeshua for receiving sinners and eating with them (Luke 15:2). They were likely envious of his growing fame, afraid that his popularity would diminish their own authority and prestige.

So the Messiah first spoke a trio of related parables (the lost sheep, the lost coin, and the prodigal son) to those gathered around him.
They were designed to show the tax collectors and sinners (as well as the Pharisees) that God was concerned for them and that He would seek out the lost and welcome them into His family when they repented and turned back to Him.

The self-righteous Pharisees and scribes, acknowledged by Yeshua as the legitimate religious teachers of the Jews (Matt. 23:1-3), should have been the ones telling these people of God's love for them. They should have been the ones teaching these sinners, exhorting them to return to God and receive His love and forgiveness. However, because of their faith in their own righteousness and their contempt for these tax collectors and sinners who didn't measure up to their standards, the Pharisees and scribes excluded them and considered them accursed (John 7:49).

Afterward, speaking primarily to his disciples but with the Pharisees (and probably the crowd) still listening in, Yeshua related the parable of the unjust steward (Luke 16:1-13).
The Pharisees, who were "lovers of money" (Luke 16:14), realized that the Messiah was alluding to them with this parable and took offense. They scoffed at Yeshua.

The final part of his response to the derision of the Pharisees and scribes was the parable of Lazarus and the rich man.
======================================
Luke 16:
19 Yet a certain Man<444> was rich and was clothed in purple and fine-linen, making-merry down to a-day shiningly.

Using a concordance, I fount that the phrase "a certain man" is only found in the parables of the Gospel of Luke.

Genesis 1:1 (YLT)

Luke 10:30
Then Jesus answered and said: “A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among thieves, who stripped him of his clothing, wounded him, and departed, leaving him half dead.
Luk 13:6
He also spoke this parable: “A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard, and he came seeking fruit on it and found none.
Luk 14:2
And behold, there was a certain man before Him who had dropsy.
Luk 14:16
Then He said to him, “A certain man gave a great supper and invited many,
Luk 15:11
Then He said: “A certain man had two sons.
Luk 16:1
And he said also unto his disciples, 'A certain man was rich, who had a steward, and he was accused to him as scattering his goods;
Luk 16:19
'And -- a certain man was rich, and was clothed in purple and fine linen, making merry sumptuously every day,
Luk 19:12
He said therefore, 'A certain man of birth went on to a far country, to take to himself a kingdom, and to return,
Luk 20:9
Then He began to tell the people this parable: “A certain man planted a vineyard, leased it to vinedressers, and went into a far country for a long time.
===============================
G444 used in 24 verses of the covenantle book of Revelation......

Genesis 1:1 (YLT)
G444 ἄνθρωπος (anthrōpos), occurs 559 times in 504 verses

1st verse used in Revelation:

Rev 1:13
and in the midst of the seven lamp-stands, one like to a son of man, clothed to the foot, and girt round at the breast with a golden girdle,

Last verse used:

Rev 21:17
and he measured its wall, an hundred forty-four cubits, the measure of a Man, that is, of the Messenger;
==================================
Commentaries from "biblehub"
Luke 16:19 Commentaries: "Now there was a rich man, and he habitually dressed in purple and fine linen, joyously living in splendor every day.
======================
I feel that this is a fairly good vid presentation/commentary on the parable for those interested and comments on it are appreciated:

TO BE CONTINUED................

When it is all boiled down, the account of the rich man and Lazarus is the Lord's teaching on hell. Firstly, Jesus teaches that there is a hell, although not everyone is rich will go there, and not every poor person will go to heaven. He teaches that it is a place of torment, unsatisfied thirst, agony and flame. Also, there is an impassible chasm between hell and paradise, therefore there is no escape from hell. Once a person is there, they are there for keeps.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 27, 2019

Oscarr said:
When it is all boiled down, the account of the rich man and Lazarus is the Lord's teaching on hell. Firstly, Jesus teaches that there is a hell, although not everyone is rich will go there, and not every poor person will go to heaven. He teaches that it is a place of torment, unsatisfied thirst, agony and flame. Also, there is an impassible chasm between hell and paradise, therefore there is no escape from hell. Once a person is there, they are there for keeps.

The parable is perhaps how the early Church came up with the doctrine of eternal torture in hell. I have a few threads on "Gehenna and Lake of Fire" mentioned in the NT

Reve 19:3 "The smoke of the tormenting them/Her ascending Ages of the Ages"

GEHENNA<G1067> "Lake of Fire" "Valley of Hinnon/Slaughter" 1st century Judea/Jerusalem

EZEKIEL 22 "GATHER HOUSE OF ISRAEL INTO JERUSALEM TO MELT IN FURNACE/GEHENNA/LAKE OF FIRE"

And a thread created by my dear friend "Fine Linen"

Matt. 25:46 Everlasting Punishment

The Righterzpen · Aug 27, 2019

I also found this person's commentary on the parable lacking.

I will concur that there is possibly a correlation between the rich man (being religious leaders) and Lazarus (being some one / other representation).

I'm not convinced Lazarus is Christ; because what would the leaders of the nation have to offer Him for food? We're talking about God incarnate who's sustenance (especially spiritually speaking) came from the Father. Man has absolutely nothing to offer Christ as far as spiritual food goes.

Now if we compare this idea to the cursing of the fig tree. The fig tree is equated to Israel. (He cursed it because it had no fruit, and it died!) The fig tree had no fruit because the time of figs had passed. Now I'm sure Jesus had an understanding of when a fig tree would have fruit on it. Ironically though, passages that speak of the fig tree bearing figs; "fig" is in the singular. The fig tree had only ever born one fig and that fig was Christ.

So Jesus is looking for "fruit" in Israel, which He's never going to find any because the law can not save.

Also Jesus makes a statement; when the disciples come back and find Him talking to the Samaritan woman at the well. He makes a statement about having food they don't know about and then states it is His "meat" to do the will of the Father.

So that whole thing doesn't "ring true" to me as far as Jesus being Lazarus in that parable.

Also, when Jesus makes a reference to Himself in a parable; He'll use a recognizable title. "The son of man went on a journey....." The owner of the vineyard sent his son and the workers killed him. Those types of references are the most common.

Lazarus is a name given to a character in the story and nowhere does Jesus ever give Himself a name such as that. All "exterior" names that I'm aware of; are all specific direct references and not contained in parables. "You shall call his name Emmanuel...." There's no ambiguity there that you know who it's talking about.

Also, Lazarus in "Abraham's bosom". "Paradise" is the third heaven. There'd be no reason for Christ to be any place other than the 3rd heaven. "They shall see the son of man coming in the clouds of glory..." He's going back to heaven and taking all of the redeemed with Him; who died on the Old Testament side of the cross.

The other theory is that "Abraham's bosom" represented the "holding place" for the redeemed of deceased humanity until the atonement was completed. Once the atonement was accomplished, then the redeemed dead have direct access to heaven. Sheol, thus being the holding place for the unregenerate.

Now the biggest hugest error in this guy's commentary had to do with eternal punishment.

I agree with him that Sheol is a holding place for the dead. Yet in the end; it stats that death and hell are cast into the lake of fire. This of course indicates that this is a permanent arrangement. So, I don't know where he gets this nonsense of "universal redemption" from? The Scripture is very clear that there are those who will receive condemnation for their transgression and that this condemnation is eternal.

So who would Lazarus represent then?

I think the most likely candidate is/are believers in Christ. And this is why I think the symbolism that sounds so familiar to Jesus is present. We are "in him"; yet obviously things that apply to us; do not apply to Him. (Such as needing to be fed.)

And here is where I think the rich man extrapolates from not just the leaders of Israel, but also the leaders of the church too. There's lots of language in the epistles that parallels this "failure to minister as God has commanded" that applies to both Old and New Testaments.

Now does this parable have a literal application to it? It could be? It could be that it's both a parable and a real event.

The other major error I see of this commentator is the phrase "My God, My God why have You forsaken me." Jesus did't say that so the pharisees would recognize the psalm. He said that because that was a real experience. He was forsaken. And for someone who does not believe in an eternal punishment; yeah, he would have screwed that up too.

Which if you really think about it; if no one ends up in eternal punishment; what really is the point of the atonement? How can Christ pay for sin, when there's no retribution? The cross then becomes pointless.

Presbyterian Continuist · Aug 27, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
The parable is perhaps how the early Church came up with the doctrine of eternal torture in hell. I have a few threads on "Gehenna and Lake of Fire" mentioned in the NT

Reve 19:3 "The smoke of the tormenting them/Her ascending Ages of the Ages"

GEHENNA<G1067> "Lake of Fire" "Valley of Hinnon/Slaughter" 1st century Judea/Jerusalem

EZEKIEL 22 "GATHER HOUSE OF ISRAEL INTO JERUSALEM TO MELT IN FURNACE/GEHENNA/LAKE OF FIRE"

And a thread created by my dear friend "Fine Linen"

Matt. 25:46 Everlasting Punishment

The early church believed in hell because Jesus said there was a place, and He gave a vivid description of it. I guess that being God, Jesus would be the one to know.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 27, 2019

Purple and Fine Linen

19 Yet a certain Man was rich and was clothed purple and fine-linen making-merry down to a-day shiningly
==========================
I have heard that in the past this rich man symbolized the Pope because of the clothing.

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

We begin by scrutinizing the description Yeshua gives us of the rich man. First, he tells us that this man was clothed in purple and fine linen.

This type of clothing would not have been out of the ordinary for one of considerable wealth during this time period. However, this attire also has symbolic meaning. The Eerdmans Bible Dictionary says: "The wearing of purple was associated particularly with royalty . . ." (p. 863, "Purple"). In addition, the New Bible Dictionary tells us:
"The use of linen in OT times was prescribed for priests (Ex. 28:39). The coat, turban and girdle must be of fine linen." (p. 702, "Linen").

The clothing of the rich man identifies him symbolically with the people of Israel, chosen by God to be His special people. They were called to be a witness to the nations surrounding them, confirming the blessings available to those who would obey God and keep His laws.
Unfortunately, they frequently did not live up to the high calling given to them by God. Eventually He sent them into captivity for their refusal to honor their part of the covenant ratified at Mount Sinai.
At the time of Yeshua, only the House of Judah continued to have a covenant relationship with God. The rich man in this parable represents the religious Jews of Yeshua's day, exemplified by their teachers, the Pharisees and scribes.
======================================

"purple" AND "fine" AND "linen" occurs 103 times in 34 verses
2 verses in Revelation

Revelation 18:16 "woe! woe! the great City arrayed with PURPLE AND FINE LINEN / JERUSALEM

Revelation 17:4
And the Woman was having been arrayed with purple and scarlet/crimson<2847> and gilded<5558> to gold, and precious<5093 stone, and pearls<3135>, having a golden Cup in Her hand, replete of abominations and uncleanness<169> of Her whoredom,

Revelation 18:
7 ‘As much as She glorifies Herself and indulges so much, be giving to Her torment and sorrow. That in Her heart She is saying: 'I am sitting a Queen, and a Widow not I am being, and sorrow not no I shall seeing.'
12 Cargo of gold and silver, and precious stone and pearl and fine linen and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyne wood, and every vessel of ivory, and every vessel of most precious wood and brass and iron and marble
16 and saying, Woe! woe! the great City, that was having been arrayed with fine linen and purple, and scarlet, and have been gilded in gold and precious stone and pearls, That to one hour was desolated the so much riches.

"fine linen" (NKJV)
"fine" AND "linen" occurs 110 times in 49 verses in the NKJV.

Last 3 times used in OT:

Eze 16:13
“Thus you were adorned with gold and silver, and your clothing was of fine linen, silk, and embroidered cloth. You ate pastry of fine flour, honey, and oil. You were exceedingly beautiful, and succeeded to royalty.

Eze 27:7 Fine embroidered linen from Egypt was what you spread for your sail; Blue and purple from the coasts of Elishah was what covered you.

Eze 27:16 “Syria was your merchant because of the abundance of goods you made. They gave you for your wares emeralds, purple, embroidered fine linen, corals, and rubies.

=========================
1 other time outside of Revelation:

Mar 15:46 Then he bought fine linen, took Him down, and wrapped Him in the linen. And laid Him in a tomb which had been hewn out of the rock, and rolled a stone against the door of the tomb.

=======================

Rev 19:
8 And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.
14 And the armies in heaven clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses.

The Righterzpen · Aug 27, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
I have heard that in the past this rich man symbolized the Pope because of the clothing.

LOL -

(Throw a protestant preacher in there for good measure!)

LittleLambofJesus said:
At the time of Yeshua, only the House of Judah continued to have a covenant relationship with God.

Benjamin too. Judah and Benjamin were the only tribes that came out of the Babylonian captivity with any semblance of still being "intact". I think Benjamin was actually more intact than Judah. But yeah, it's correct that only a very small percentage of the nation was left.

LittleLambofJesus said:
Eze 16:13
“Thus you were adorned with gold and silver, and your clothing was of fine linen, silk, and embroidered cloth. You ate pastry of fine flour, honey, and oil. You were exceedingly beautiful, and succeeded to royalty.
Eze 27:7 Fine embroidered linen from Egypt was what you spread for your sail;
Blue and purple from the coasts of Elishah was what covered you.
Eze 27:16
“Syria was your merchant because of the abundance of goods you made. They gave you for your wares emeralds, purple, embroidery, fine linen, corals, and rubies.

This would require some research to figure out the symbols.

LittleLambofJesus said:
Revelation 18:7 ‘As much as She glorifies Herself and indulges so much, be giving to Her torment and sorrow. That in Her heart She is saying: 'I am sitting a Queen, and a Widow not I am being, and sorrow not no I shall seeing.'
12 Cargo of gold and silver, and precious stone and pearl and fine linen and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyne wood, and every vessel of ivory, and every vessel of most precious wood and brass and iron and marble
16 and saying, Woe! woe! the great City, that was having been arrayed with fine linen and purple, and scarlet, and have been gilded in gold and precious stone and pearls, That to one hour was desolated the so much riches.

As far as Babylon the mother of harlots; that's clearer both in connection to purple linen as well as being Jerusalem. I.E. the corrupted Judaic religious system; and that more specifically the city.

Now what specifically about the city? Can't say I know; at least from God's perspective. The chunk of land though is certainly of idolatrous magnitude to certain populations! Zionists come in more than just the Jewish variety. Which this would also fit with the notion of the rich man being religious leaders.

Obviously though to be dressed in linen has more than one meaning as well as purple for royalty having more than one application.

All this being said though; I still lean toward this being a literal typology of the afterlife. Because if you think about in the light of the totality of the truth of Scripture; Jesus would not present a picture of the afterlife that simply was pulled out of His imagination someplace.

1213 · Aug 28, 2019

Oscarr said:
When it is all boiled down, the account of the rich man and Lazarus is the Lord's teaching on hell. ...

The place is Hades, which is really not the same as hell, because in the end, Hades will also been thrown to the hell.

In Hades, he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and saw Abraham far off, and Lazarus at his bosom.
Luke 16:23

...Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. If anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.
Revelation 20:12-15

The Righterzpen · Aug 28, 2019

1213 said:
The place is Hades, which is really not the same as hell, because in the end, Hades will also been thrown to the hell.

In Hades, he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and saw Abraham far off, and Lazarus at his bosom.
Luke 16:23

...Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. If anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.
Revelation 20:12-15

"Hades" is the Greek word for the Hebrew word "Sheol". Both are translated "hell" in English.

There is another description of torment called "Valley of Hinnon" / or "Genna" Which I believe is also translated "hell" in some passages in the OT. It was the place where trash was burned. Thus the imagery of a fire pit / "lake of fire". I believe that was an earthy depiction of the "lake of fire"; which is a different "place" than "hades" / "Sheol".

Presbyterian Continuist · Aug 28, 2019

1213 said:
The place is Hades, which is really not the same as hell, because in the end, Hades will also been thrown to the hell.

In Hades, he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and saw Abraham far off, and Lazarus at his bosom.
Luke 16:23

...Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. If anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.
Revelation 20:12-15

I understand that. But Hades is divided into two places - Sheol and Paradise. The rich man is in Sheol and in the second resurrection he will be raised to Judgment, while Paradise will be emptied at the Rapture when the bodies of the converted will be raised and they will meet the Lord in the air, along with those who are alive who will be caught up the meet the Lord; and then they will go to heaven to be with the Lord until He comes again to the world in person.

Those in Sheol is will be raised after the Lord's 1000 year reign on earth, and they will appear in the judgment, and then afterward be cast into the lake of fire.

So, Jesus is describing Sheol, where the unconverted are bound in chains, in agony, being tormented in the flame, and will unsatisfied thirst. They are able to see over the impassable chasm to Paradise and see the more pleasurable state of the converted, and this will add to their torment, knowing now that the Christians they hooted at, ridiculed, and killed, are now in the presence of Lord while they are suffering in this horrible place where there is no escape and looking for only to final judgment and the eternal wrath of God.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 28, 2019

The Righterzpen said:
As far as Babylon the mother of harlots; that's clearer both in connection to purple linen as well as being Jerusalem. I.E. the corrupted Judaic religious system; and that more specifically the city.

Obviously though to be dressed in linen has more than one meaning as well as purple for royalty having more than one application.

Great post. This parable indeed has a plethora of links to 1st century Jerusalem and the Temple/Priesthood.
OC Jerusalem vs NC Jerusalem........

LittleLambofJesus said:
I have heard that in the past this rich man symbolized the Pope because of the clothing.
That aside let's look at the fine linen and purple used I could do a whole thread just on "fine linen"............
19 Yet a certain Man was rich and was clothed purple and fine-linen making-merry down to a-day shiningly

The Righterzpen said:
LOL -
(Throw a protestant preacher in there for good measure!)

Benjamin too. Judah and Benjamin were the only tribes that came out of the Babylonian captivity with any semblance of still being "intact". I think Benjamin was actually more intact than Judah. But yeah, it's correct that only a very small percentage of the nation was left.

Yes..........

Next word is making "merry".

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

19 Yet a certain Man was rich and was clothed purple and fine-linen making-merry<2165> down to a-day shiningly/

2165. euphraino from 2095 and 5424;
to put (middle voice or passively, be) in a good frame of mind, i.e. rejoice:--fare, make glad, be (make) merry, rejoice.

Verse 19 also tells us that the rich man "fared sumptuously every day." Figuratively, this represents the magnificent spiritual feast available only to the Jews, who were the sole remaining part of God's called people, Israel. In the 1st century CE, they were the only people on earth who had the true religion. Indeed, Paul recounts the glorious station of the House of Judah in Romans 9:3-5
The Jews were truly rich, feasting on God's spiritual blessings. Yet these very gifts caused them to stumble because they prompted them to self-righteousness.
They gloried in the gifts, without glorifying the Eternal God who gave them. Instead of being a "royal priesthood" that was a blessing to all nations, they instead loathed and despised the surrounding peoples. Certainly, as Paul wrote, "their table become a snare and a trap, a stumbling block and a retribution for them" (Romans.11:9).
=========================================================
Amazingly, this word is used only Luke of the Gospels!

1st time used is in this rather solemn passage. Much like the Rich Man.....

Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon
G2165 εὐφραίνω (euphrainō), occurs 16 times in 14 verses

Luke 12:
19 ‘And I will say to my soul, “Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years; take your ease; eat, drink, and be merry.” ’
20 “But God said to him, ‘Fool! This night your soul will be required of you; then whose will those things be which you have provided?’

Oh my. This is getting fascinating..........used in 3 verses Revelation and another link to the Harlot

Rev 11:10
And those who dwell on the earth will be cheering<5463> over Them, rejoicing, and send gifts to one another,
because these two Prophets tormented those who dwell on the land.
Rev 12:1
“Therefore be rejoicing, O heavens, and you who dwell in them!
Woe to the inhabitants of the land and the sea!
For the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, because he knows that he has but a short time.”

Rev 18:20
“Rejoice over Her, O heaven, and you holy Apostles and Prophets,
for God has avenged you on Her!

4 times HalleluYah is mentioned concerning the downfall of the OC Levitical Priesthood, Temple and City:

The Great City/Harlot/Queen Revelation chapts 17-19

1 After these I hear as a great sound of a vast throng in the heaven, saying,
"HalleluYah!
the salvation and the glory and the honor, and the power of our God; 2 That true and righteous His judgings, that He judges the great harlot who corrupts the earth in Her whoredom, and avenges<1556> the blood of His bond-servants out of Her hand".
===================================

.......................................

ebedmelech · Aug 28, 2019

"The Rich Man and Lazarus" is clearly a parable...but I don't think it ties at all into Revelation. The parable is directed at the Pharisees though. They were certainly guilty many times of turning their backs of the poor.

It was they who were guilty of burdening people with their rules of the Sabbath Day, they went after Jesus for healing on the Sabbath. When Jesus would crush their "legalism", all they could do was plot against Him.

This is a parable speaking to the Old Covenant. As Abraham stated "They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them."...this tells us this is under the Old Covenant.

As a young Christian the church I went to was an Independent Fundamental Baptist. That pastor didn't think "The Rich Man and Lazarus" was a parable. I'm glad I grew to see it for what it is

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 28, 2019

ebedmelech said:
"The Rich Man and Lazarus" is clearly a parable...but I don't think it ties at all into Revelation.
The parable is directed at the Pharisees though. They were certainly guilty many times of turning their backs of the poor.
It was they who were guilty of burdening people with their rules of the Sabbath Day, they went after Jesus for healing on the Sabbath. When Jesus would crush their "legalism", all they could do was plot against Him.
This is a parable speaking to the Old Covenant. As Abraham stated "They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them."...this tells us this is under the Old Covenant.
As a young Christian the church I went to was an Independent Fundamental Baptist. That pastor didn't think "The Rich Man and Lazarus" was a parable. I'm glad I grew to see it for what it is

Hello and thanks for that post.
I believe it does, but we will know as we go thru this.
============
G2988 used just in this one verse:
I looked at the derivatives of it and found something interesting.

19 Yet a certain Man was rich and was clothed purple and fine-linen making-merry<2165> down to a-day shiningly/sumptuously<2988>

2988. lampros adverb from 2986; brilliantly, i.e. figuratively, luxuriously:--sumptuously.
2989. lampo a primary verb;
to beam, i.e. radiate brilliancy (literally or figuratively):--give light, shine.
2987. lamprotes from 2986; brilliancy:--brightness.
2986. lampros from the same as 2985;
radiant; by analogy, limpid; figuratively, magnificent or sumptuous (in appearance):--bright, clear, gay, goodly, gorgeous, white
2985. lampas from 2989;
a "lamp" or flambeau:--lamp, light, torch.

The Great City/Harlot/Queen Revelation chapts 17-19

Revelation 18:14
‘And the fruition<3703> of Thee of the yearning of Thy soul passed away<565> Thee,
and all the dainty and the splendid/shiningly<2986> things perished<622> from Thee, and no longer Thou shall be finding them.

The Righterzpen · Aug 28, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
19 Yet a certain Man was rich and was clothed purple and fine-linen making-merry<2165> down to a-day shiningly/

I'll have to look this up. I never thought too much about the "make merry" aspect of this parable.

LittleLambofJesus said:
The Jews were truly rich, feasting on God's spiritual blessings. Yet these very gifts caused them to stumble because they prompted them to self-righteousness.

True!

They were the only nation who had the written revelation of God in Scriptural form. But this goes back at least to Moses and possibly to Abraham.

I studied this out once about historical documentation concerning the book of Job. Abraham came out of Ur of the Chaldees and ancient Summer had in their libraries primitive account records of both the flood and the book of Job. Both of which I conclude that Abraham and his father Terra were both familiar with.

Now we know Moses "compiled" the Torah; likely having written at least some of it. Had Job and elements of Genesis been passed down since Abraham? (Good question.)

Yet we see this self righteousness of Israel through out the Old Testament; not just in the New Testament. Even though the NT is compiled upon with a lot of false religion that was no longer Mosaic.

The thing the Hebrews missed; which I think much of the church misses too, is that those who have not the revelation of written Scripture, still have both revelation written on their conscience as well as the witness of the creation.

One could still come to a rudimentary understanding of God through those things; yet someone having not that witness, has no means of articulating what they come to understand, because there is no direct revelation from God. They are left to figure it out in parabolic form what the written word declares.

This is why God punished the unbelievers of ancient Israel for their arrogance. They failed to see how they were more accountable because of the revelation they had!

LittleLambofJesus said:
They gloried in the gifts, without glorifying the Eternal God who gave them. Instead of being a "royal priesthood" that was a blessing to all nations, they instead loathed and despised the surrounding peoples. Certainly, as Paul wrote, "their table become a snare and a trap, a stumbling block and a retribution for them" (Romans.11:9).

They still do this. Of all the religions in the world who do not have the truth; who is the most hostile to Christ?

Ask Buddhists; Jesus was a teacher. To Hindus; he was a "saint" (They have a different understanding of the word saint than we do.) To Muslims; he was a prophet. To humanists; he was a historical figure that taught nice morals. To atheists; he was a historical figure who started a religion and taught certain things that moral atheists would agree with. To Jews.... ???

Rabbinic Judaism is the only religion who's teachings are hostile to Jesus personally. Even Satanists will admit the morality of Jesus Christ; even in opposition to the righteousness of God. Only Rabbinic Judaism declares Jesus as evil; (although not all individual Jews agree with that).

LittleLambofJesus said:
Luke 12:
19 ‘And I will say to my soul, “Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years; take your ease; eat, drink, and be merry.” ’
20 “But God said to him, ‘Fool! This night your soul will be required of you; then whose will those things be which you have provided?’

Interesting similarities of this parable to the rich man and Lazarus.

You're aware there are 2 beasts in Revelation 13. The 2nd beast has horns of a lamb; but speaks as a dragon. It also tells the people of the world to worship the 1st beast. Now if the 1st beast represents the apostate religious system from the OT; what do you think the 2nd beast represents? (The apostate religious system(s) that become evident in the New Testament era.) If one is apostate Judaism; the other is apostate Christianity (which is not singled out by any one particular denomination - the mistake the dispensationalists make!)

What's the "hallmark" of the 2nd beast telling the world to worship the 1st? (Zionism!)

Now compare what Paul speaks of as being "signs of the end times" to the Judaic religious system of the 1st century; because you see a rehash of those same issues in the church at the end of time.

LittleLambofJesus said:
Rev 11:10
And those who dwell on the earth will be cheering<5463> over Them, rejoicing, and send gifts to one another,
because these two Prophets tormented those who dwell on the land.

Did a study on these "two witnesses" at one point. I came to the conclusion that they are the collective entities of believers on both OT and NT sides of the cross.

The "church" consisting of the eternal body of believers existed in the OT; just as the "church" (still consisting of true believers) exists today. Both groups of people are and have been surrounded by a cooperate body of unbelievers who exhibit religiosity that mimics the truth.

It's really a fascinating paradox / parallel when you recognize it.

LittleLambofJesus said:
Rev 12:1
“Therefore be rejoicing, O heavens, and you who dwell in them!
Woe to the inhabitants of the land and the sea!
For the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, because he knows that he has but a short time.”

This "casting out of Satan" is connected to either the cross or Jesus's preaching. I haven't quite figured it out yet.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 29, 2019

Oscarr said: ↑
When it is all boiled down, the account of the rich man and Lazarus is the Lord's teaching on hell. ...

1213 said: ↑
The place is Hades, which is really not the same as hell, because in the end, Hades will also been thrown to the hell.
Luke 16:23 In Hades, he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and saw Abraham far off, and Lazarus at his bosom.

Revelation 20:12-15...Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. If anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.

Hades:
Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

Most likely, hades originally meant "unseen." Later, it came to refer to the hidden state of those buried in the earth. Symbolically, this parable shows that a point would come when the House of Judah would become "unseen" by God, out of favor because of their unbelief. There would come a time when the Jews as a whole would no longer be God's favored nation. God would harden their hearts, leading them to reject their Messiah (John 1:11).

The Righterzpen said:
"Hades" is the Greek word for the Hebrew word "Sheol". Both are translated "hell" in English.
There is another description of torment called "Valley of Hinnon" / or "Genna" Which I believe is also translated "hell" in some passages in the OT. It was the place where trash was burned. Thus the imagery of a fire pit / "lake of fire". I believe that was an earthy depiction of the "lake of fire"; which is a different "place" than "hades" / "Sheol".

Good post.
I was going to get into "hades" when we get to verse 23

23 And in the Hades lifting up his eyes existing in torments, he is seeing Abraham from afar and Lazarus in the bosom of him.

That aside, I actually have a thread on "VofH/Gehenna"
GEHENNA<G1067> "Lake of Fire" "Valley of Hinnon/Slaughter" 1st century Judea/Jerusalem

LittleLambofJesus said:
Matthew 23:33 "Serpents! brood of vipers!
how? ye may be fleeing from the judging<2920> of the Gehenna
===============================
Below I put up some links as well as a few maps concerning Gehenna/Valley of Hinnon

Hinnom, Valley Of Definition and Meaning - Bible Dictionary

The meaning of "Hinnom" is unknown; the expressions ben Hinnom and bene Hinnom would suggest that it is a proper name; in Jeremiah 7:32; 19:6 it is altered by the prophet to "valley of slaughter," and therefore some have thought the original name must have had a pleasing meaning.

The Valley of Hinnom has been located by different writers in each of the three great valleys of Jerusalem. In favor of the eastern or Kidron valley we have the facts that Eusebius and Jerome (Onom) place "Gehennom" under the eastern wall of Jerusalem and the Moslem geographical writers, Muqaddasi and Nasir-i-khusran, call the Kidron valley Wady Jahamum. The Jewish writer Kimchi also identifies the Valley of Jehoshaphat (i.e. the Kidron) with Hinnom. These ideas are probably due to the identification of the eastern valley, on account of its propinquity to the Temple, as the scene of the last judgment--the "Valley of Jehoshaphat" of Joel 3:2--and the consequent transference there of the scene of the punishment of the wicked, Gehenna, after the ancient geographical position of the Valley of Hinnom, had long been lost.
In selecting sacred sites, from the 4th Christian century onward, no critical topographical acumen has been displayed until quite modern times. There are three amply sufficient arguments against this view:

(1) the Kidron valley is always called a nachal and not a gay' (see KIDRON); (2) the "Gate of the Gai" clearly did not lie to the East of the city; (3) En-rogel, which lay at the beginning of the Valley of Hinnom and to its East (Joshua 15:8; 18:16) cannot be the "Virgin's fount," the ancient Gihon (2 Samuel 17:17).

Encyclopedias - International Standard Bible Encyclopedia - Hinnom, Valley Of
HINNOM, VALLEY OF

hin'-om (ge hinnom, Joshua 15:8; 18:16; "valley of the son of Hinnom" (ge bhen hinnom), Joshua 15:8; 18:16; 2 Chronicles 28:3; 33:6; Jeremiah 7:31; 19:2,6; 32:35; "valley of the children (sons) of Hinnom" (ge bhene hinnom), 2 Kings 23:10; or simply "the valley," literally, the "hollow" or "ravine" (ha-gay'), 2 Chronicles 26:9; Nehemiah 2:13,15; 3:13; Jeremiah 31:40 and, perhaps also, Jeremiah 2:23 (the above references are in the Hebrew text; there are some variations in the Septuagint)):

The meaning of "Hinnom" is unknown; the expressions ben Hinnom and bene Hinnom would suggest that it is a proper name; in Jeremiah 7:32; 19:6 it is altered by the prophet to "valley of slaughter," and therefore some have thought the original name must have had a pleasing meaning.

The exact location of the Valley of Hinnom is disputed. Older commentaries give the location as below the southern wall of ancient Jerusalem, stretching from the foot of Mount Zion eastward past the Tyropoeon to the Kidron Valley. However the Tyropoeon Valley is usually no longer associated with the Valley of Hinnom because during the period of Ahaz and Manasseh, the Tyropoeon lay within the city walls and child sacrifice would have been practiced outside the walls of the city. Smith (1907),[7] Dalman (1930),[8] Bailey (1986)[9] and Watson (1992)[10] identify the Wadi ar-Rababi, which fits the description of Joshua that Hinnom valley ran east to west and lay outside the city walls. According to Joshua, the valley began at En-rogel. If the modern Bir Ayyub is En-rogel, then Wadi ar-Rababi, which begins there, is Hinnom.[11]
=====================
Jerusalem's Hinnom Valley

Jerusalem's Hinnom Valley marked the western and southern edges of Jerusalem, beginning along the Western Hill and ending where the Tyropean and Kidron Valleys meet. In the Old Testament, it was often the site where people of Judah sacrificed their children to Baal (2 Kings 23:20; 2 Chron. 28:3,4; Jer. 7:31; 19:5, 6; 32:35).

By Jesus' time, the Greek translation of Hinnom Valley, gehenna, became a synonym for hell. Thus the English versions of the Bible translate "Valley of Hinnom" in the New Testament as "hell." With its pagan history and its burning sewer stench, Jerusalem's Hinnom Valley serves as a vivid metaphor for both the Christian and Jewish concept of hell

King Manasseh of Judah added to the negative reputation of the Hinnom Valley by sacrificing some of his own sons in Baal worship there (2 Chron. 33:6). He also practiced sorcery and witchcraft in defiance of God's law. King Josiah, Manasseh's grandson, later destroyed many of these pagan structures and practices. But by that time, Israel was so involved in paganism that God's judgment soon fell upon the people.

Jerusalem's Hinnom Valley also became the perpetual burning-garbage dump and city sewer. Residents sometimes called it the "valley of the sewer" or "the valley of the pagans."
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LittleLambofJesus · Aug 29, 2019

Next we look at where "purple" is used in the Bible:
Luke 16:19 Yet a certain Man<444> was rich and was clothed in purple and fine-linen, making-merry down to a-day shiningly.

Now we will look into the color "purple" as used in the OT and NT

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

We begin by scrutinizing the description Yeshua gives us of the rich man. First, he tells us that this man was clothed in purple and fine linen. This type of clothing would not have been out of the ordinary for one of considerable wealth during this time period. However, this attire also has symbolic meaning.
The Eerdmans Bible Dictionary says: "The wearing of purple was associated particularly with royalty . . ." (p. 863, "Purple"). In addition, the New Bible Dictionary tells us: "The use of linen in OT times was prescribed for priests (Ex. 28:39). The coat, turban and girdle must be of fine linen." (p. 702, "Linen").

So we see that the garments worn by this rich man were symbolic of royalty and the priesthood. With that in mind, let's see what God told Moses just before giving the Israelites the Law on Mount Sinai:
EXODUS 19:6 And ye shall be to me a royal priesthood and a holy nation: these words shalt thou speak to the children of Israel. (Brenton's LXX)
=================================
Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon

"purple" occurs 53 times in 53 verses in the NKJV.

NKJV)

Exo 39:1 Of the blue, purple, and scarlet thread they made garments of ministry,[fn] for ministering in the holy place, and made the holy garments for Aaron, as the LORD had commanded Moses.

Used only in only 8 verses of the Prophets of Jeremiah, Ezekiel and Daniel

Jer 10:9
Silver is beaten into plates; It is brought from Tarshish,
And gold from Uphaz, The work of the craftsman And of the hands of the metalsmith;
Blue and purple are their clothing; They are all the work of skillful men.

Eze 23:6
Who were clothed in purple, Captains and rulers,
All of them desirable young men, Horsemen riding on horses.
Eze 27:7
Fine embroidered linen from Egypt was what you spread for your sail;
Blue and purple from the coasts of Elishah was what covered you.
Eze 27:16
“Syria was your merchant because of the abundance of goods you made.
They gave you for your wares emeralds, purple, embroidery, fine linen, corals, and rubies.
Eze 27:24
“These were your merchants in choice items—in purple clothes, in embroidered garments, in chests of multicolored apparel, in sturdy woven cords, which were in your marketplace.

Dan 5:7
The king cried aloud to bring in the astrologers, the Chaldeans, and the soothsayers. The king spoke, saying to the wise men of Babylon, “Whoever reads this writing, and tells me its interpretation, shall be clothed with purple and have a chain of gold around his neck; and he shall be the third ruler in the kingdom.”
Dan 5:29
Then Belshazzar gave the command, and they clothed Daniel with purple and put a chain of gold around his neck, and made a proclamation concerning him that he should be the third ruler in the kingdom.

=========================================
"purple" occurs 53 times in 53 verses in the NKJV.

NT
Used in 8 verses, 4 of those concerning the Lord Jesus at His Crucifixion.
This is beginning to look like the Rich Man is a type of false "Christ/OC Priest/King/Joshua"

Mar 15:17
And they clothed Him with purple; and they twisted a crown of thorns, put it on His head,
Mar 15:20
And when they had mocked Him, they took the purple off Him, put His own clothes on Him, and led Him out to crucify Him.
Luk 16:19
“There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day.
Jhn 19:2
And the soldiers twisted a crown of thorns and put it on His head, and they put on Him a purple robe.
Jhn 19:5
Then Jesus came out, wearing the crown of thorns and the purple robe. And Pilate said to them, “Behold the Man!”

Jesus was a High Priest according after the order of Melchizedek, Whom was condemned by them.

A good study on Him:
http://www.kingdombiblestudies.org/priest/RP24.htm

One of the most intriguing descriptions of the unique character of the High Priesthood of Jesus is found in Heb. 7:17 wherein it is stated, "Thou art a priest forever after the order of Melchizedek." This one grand statement shows that Jesus is not like any of the other priests who the people of Israel knew so much about. The entire seventh chapter of Hebrews is about THE MELCHIZEDEK CONNECTION,

===============
1 verse in Acts concerning a woman who was a seller of purple in Thyatira.
Both Thyatira and Purple are mention in Revelation as is Queen Jezebel

Acts 16:14
Now a certain woman named Lydia heard us. She was a seller of purple from the city of Thyatira, who worshiped God. The Lord opened her heart to heed the things spoken by Paul.

Kindgdom Bible Studies Revelation Series

Revelation 2:
18 And to the Messenger of the church in Thyatira write!…”
20 “But I am having much<4183> against thee, that thou suffer Jezebel. the woman/wife of thee, the one saying Herself to be a prophetess and she is teaching and deceiving<4105> My bondslaves to prostitute and to be eating idol sacrifices<1494>

Revelation 18:7 ‘As much as She glorifies Herself and indulges so much, be giving to Her torment<929> and sorrow<3997>. That in Her heart She is saying: 'I am sitting a Queen, and a Widow not I am, and sorrow not no I shall be seeing.'

4 verses in the Covenantle book of Revelation [OT Priesthood vs NT Priesthood]
===============================
The Great City/Harlot/Queen Revelation chapts 17-19

Rev 17:4 The woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls, having in her hand a golden cup full of abominations and the filthiness of her fornication.[fn]
Rev 18:12 “merchandise of gold and silver, precious stones and pearls, fine linen and purple, silk and scarlet, every kind of citron wood, every kind of object of ivory, every kind of object of most precious wood, bronze, iron, and marble;
Rev 18:16 “and saying, ‘Alas, alas, that great City that was clothed in fine linen, purple, and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls!

========================
Purple and scarlet are also mentioned in the OT concerning the clothing of Priests and only used together only in Exodus and Revelation

Exo 39:
1 Of the blue, purple, and scarlet thread they made garments of ministry,[fn] for ministering in the holy place, and made the holy garments for Aaron, as the LORD had commanded Moses.
5 And the intricately woven band of his ephod that was on it was of the same workmanship, woven of gold, blue, purple, and scarlet thread, and of fine woven linen, as the LORD had commanded Moses.

The Righterzpen · Aug 29, 2019

LittleLambofJesus said:
Most likely, hades originally meant "unseen." Later, it came to refer to the hidden state of those buried in the earth. Symbolically, this parable shows that a point would come when the House of Judah would become "unseen" by God, out of favor because of their unbelief. There would come a time when the Jews as a whole would no longer be God's favored nation. God would harden their hearts, leading them to reject their Messiah (John 1:11).

"Hades" (I don't know what the Greeks defined the word as?) In the Scripture though, it is equated to "Sheol" which means "place where they are not seen or heard". So the Scriptural carry over is there; even if the Greeks themselves did not define "Hades" as such (or had not done so originally).

There is a phenomena that when cultures "bump up against" each other; they begin to adopt interchanges of ideas. The Greeks were very big on that; which is how they became so predominant so quickly. So it would not surprise me if the Greeks adopted "Hades" to have very similar meaning as "Sheol" from the Hebrew concept.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 29, 2019

The Righterzpen said:
"Hades" (I don't know what the Greeks defined the word as?) In the Scripture though, it is equated to "Sheol" which means "place where they are not seen or heard". So the Scriptural carry over is there; even if the Greeks themselves did not define "Hades" as such (or had not done so originally).

There is a phenomena that when cultures "bump up against" each other; they begin to adopt interchanges of ideas. The Greeks were very big on that; which is how they became so predominant so quickly. So it would not surprise me if the Greeks adopted "Hades" to have very similar meaning as "Sheol" from the Hebrew concept.

Thank you for posting that.
Like I said earlier, I was going to get into that when I got to verse 23.

Hell, Sheol, Hades, Paradise, and the Grave
*snip*

Hades is the New Testament equivalent of the Old Testament word Sheol. The Greek and Hebrew words speak of the same place, the present Hell. However, this is problematic because Sheol has been translated “grave” as often as it has “hell” and some have mistakenly taught that Sheol and Hades are only references to the grave rather than Hell.
This erroneous teaching leads to the denial of the existence of an immediate or present Hell. The false doctrine of soul-sleep, and other ideas that teach the unconscious state of the dead between death and resurrection, spring from this error.

The common word for “grave” in the Old Testament is queber. Of the sixty-four times it is used, it is translated “grave” thirty-four times, “sepulcher” twenty-six times, and “burying place” four times. Queber is used five additional times as part of a place name, Kibroth-hattaavah, which means “graves of lust.” As we said earlier, Sheol is found sixty-four times, being rendered “grave” thirty-one times, “hell” thirty-one times, and “pit” three times.

A comparison of how Sheol and queber are used reveals eight points of contrast that tell us that they are not the same thing.

Sheol is never used in plural form. Queber is used in the plural 29 times.

It is never said that the body goes to Sheol. Queber speaks of the body going there 37 times.

Sheol is never said to be located on the face of the earth. Queber is mentioned 32 times as being located on the earth.

An individual’s Sheol is never mentioned. An individual’s queber is mentioned 5 times.

Man is never said to put anyone into Sheol. Individuals are put into a queber by man (33 times).

Man is never said to have dug or fashioned a Sheol. Man is said to have dug, or fashioned, a queber (6 times).

Man is never said to have touched Sheol. Man touches, or can touch, a queber (5 times).

It is never said that man is able to possess a Sheol. Man is spoken of as being able to possess a queber (7 times). (These eight points of comparison are adapted from “Life and Death” by Caleb J. Baker, Bible Institute Colportage Ass’n, 1941).

From the differences between how Sheol and queber are used in Scripture, it is obvious that they are not the same thing. The Greek word Hades in the New Testament would fit into the Sheol column of our chart, strongly indicating that it is the same thing as Sheol. Hades is used eleven times, being rendered Hell ten times and grave once.

Words associated with queber are quabar and qeburah. Quabar is a verb meaning to bury or to be buried and qeburah is a noun meaning a grave or place of burial. The use of these related words helps to reinforce the difference between queber and Sheol, as they clearly have to do with the grave as a burial place, while Sheol does not.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 29, 2019

There is actually a Lazarus that was resurrected, but not taken up, like the one in the Parable. Just thought this was interesting before I start on the next verse

John 10:
38 Then Jesus, deeply moved again, came to the tomb. It was a cave, and a stone lay against it.
39 Jesus said, “Take away the stone.” Martha, the sister of the dead man, said to him, “Lord, by this time there will be an odor, for he has been dead four days.”
40 Jesus said to her, “Did I not tell you that if you believed you would see the glory of God?”
41 So they took away the stone. And Jesus lifted up his eyes and said, “Father, I thank you that you have heard me.
43 When he had said these things, he cried out with a loud voice, “Lazarus, come out.”
44 The man who had died came out, his hands and feet bound with linen strips, and his face wrapped with a cloth. Jesus said to them, “Unbind him, and let him go.”

LUKE 16:22 "So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom.The rich man also died and was buried."

com7fy8 · Aug 29, 2019

The meaning is not only what is symbolized, but Jesus is warning us not to love money. But a main problem is not having money, but if our love for it keeps us from caring about others.

LittleLambofJesus said:
The parable is perhaps how the early Church came up with the doctrine of eternal torture in hell. I have a few threads on "Gehenna and Lake of Fire" mentioned in the NT

There is also how there is torment in the lake of fire, plus torment with fire and brimstone, for whoever takes the mark of the beast > Revelation 14:9-11 < this is in Revelation, where John has personally shared with Jesus and he is having the vision of Revelation. So, this is not only coming from his impression of the parable Jesus gave while Jesus was on this earth!

This says how ones will be tormented "with fire and brimstone" . . . in the presence of Jesus who is the Lamb of God; they will not just be annihilated.

Luke 16 "Rich Man/Poor Man" parable.....The most misunderstood/misinterpreted Parable in the NT?

The parable

It is a parable

It is a true story

The Rich Man symbolizes Judah

The Poor man represents the Gentiles/House of Israel

I never thought about it

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