Issues in Scienceville.

Jazer · Jun 10, 2011

Inan3 said:
Sometimes it's the society we live in that does the sowing for us.

I knew a pastor that was so grieved that parents do not take better care of their children. Everyone seems to want God to do everything for them and they do not want to take the responsability to do anything for themselves.

Cabal · Jun 10, 2011

Jazer said:
Job came our just fine, he assumed responsability for his actions and he did not try to blame everything on God. It is the enemy of God that trys to accuse God and blame him for the mess man makes out of his life.

Unless God actually WAS responsible, which he certainly was in Job's case. There were no actions for Job to assume responsibility for, he was not responsible for God's wheeling and dealing with Satan.

Cabal · Jun 10, 2011

Inan3 said:
We all reap what we sow in one way or another.

Unless you've bought into God's loophole. Doesn't matter if you manage to avoid being a mass murderer, if your names not on the list, you're not getting in, unlike that dictator behind you in the line who had the sincere deathbed conversion.

Sickening. Absolutely sickening.

Jazer · Jun 10, 2011

Cabal said:
Unless God actually WAS responsible, which he certainly was in Job's case. There were no actions for Job to assume responsibility for, he was not responsible for God's wheeling and dealing with Satan.

Sounds like you speak works without knowledge.

38:1 Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said,
38:2 Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?

Jazer · Jun 10, 2011

Cabal said:
if your names not on the list, you're not getting in.

If you do not have gasoline your engine is not going to run. If you do not have the life of God in you then the end will be death. It's your choice, God does not make your choice for you.

VehementiDominus · Jun 10, 2011

Jazer said:
If you do not have gasoline your engine is not going to run. If you do not have the life of God in you then the end will be death. It's your choice, God does not make your choice for you.

What if you're using an electric motor?

Not only does your engine run without gasoline, but it's also cleaner and more efficient.

Jazer · Jun 10, 2011

VehementiDominus said:
What if you're using an electric motor? Not only does your engine run without gasoline, but it's also cleaner and more efficient.

Whatever engine you use requires fuel.

Inan3 · Jun 10, 2011

Cabal said:
Unless God actually WAS responsible, which he certainly was in Job's case. There were no actions for Job to assume responsibility for, he was not responsible for God's wheeling and dealing with Satan.

Job was responsible for his own problems. He opened the door by walking in fear and not trusting God and gave the devil a place to come in and wreak havoc. If it wasn't for God satan could have taken his life also.

Job 3:25 For the thing which I greatly feared is come upon me, and that which I was afraid of is come unto me.

AV1611VET · Jun 10, 2011

Inan3 said:
Job was responsible for his own problems. He opened the door by walking in fear and not trusting God and gave the devil a place to come in and wreak havoc. If it wasn't for God satan could have taken his life also.

Hey, sis -- my pastor points out that Job did not do one thing wrong.

God even calls him "perfect and upright".

Job 1:1 There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.

He maintained his integrity all throughout his ordeal, and when God showed up at the end, it was his friends he had to make sacrifice for, not the other way around.

Job was a type of Christ.

I love this comparison chart: Jesus and Job Compared.

Mikecpking · Jun 11, 2011

Inan3 said:
Sometimes it's the society we live in that does the sowing for us.

I quite agree. The picture of the starving child while in the western world, there are many obese people is proof what what an unequal society we have.

Belk · Jun 11, 2011

Inan3 said:
Sometimes it's the society we live in that does the sowing for us.

Uh, isn't that kind of the exact opposite of "We reap what we sow"? Isn't that, in point of fact, paying for the sins of someone else?

AV1611VET · Jun 11, 2011

Mikecpking said:
I quite agree. The picture of the starving child while in the western world, there are many obese people is proof what what an unequal society we have.

Then there are people like Gandhi, who institute programs of starvation under the guise of religion; and the people, who chose to follow his religion, rather than what the Bible says:

1 Corinthians 6:13a Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats:

Cabal · Jun 11, 2011

Jazer said:
If you do not have gasoline your engine is not going to run. If you do not have the life of God in you then the end will be death. It's your choice, God does not make your choice for you.

Wrong. Engines do not choose to run without petrol. God chooses to punish people in the ways that he does.

AV1611VET · Jun 11, 2011

Cabal said:
God chooses to punish people in the ways that he does.

What's wrong with that?

When it comes to punishment, would you prefer a judge who punishes according to who won the case; or would you prefer an omniscient judge?

Genesis 18:25 That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?

Cabal · Jun 11, 2011

AV1611VET said:
What's wrong with that?

When it comes to punishment, would you prefer a judge who punishes according to who won the case; or would you prefer an omniscient judge?

Genesis 18:25 That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?

I would prefer a fair judge who does not administer infinite punishment for finite wrongs - not some goon who spares a dictator after a deathbed conversion but will light the honest and well-living individual who didn't find Christianity particularly convincing on fire. Good judges don't let their ego get in the way.

The point is Jazer was making it sound like God doesn't have any other option - and I believe I've pointed out before how ridiculous it is to claim that an omnipotent God has limited options. Certainly God is not a machine like a car engine!

AV1611VET · Jun 11, 2011

Cabal said:
I would prefer a fair judge who does not administer infinite punishment for finite wrongs -

Or infinite Heaven? when should the subscription run out?

And for the record, the Catholics believe in Purgatory, so don't think I'm going to take your point with anything more than a pixel.

You're as see-through as a brand new pane of glass.

Cabal · Jun 11, 2011

AV1611VET said:
Or infinite Heaven? when should the subscription run out?

Infinite heaven if you have a sincere change of heart last second? Where's the justice in that? Where do you pay for everything you've done before you converted?

As for the "subscription", it shouldn't run out - it's the least God could do to make it up to mankind, seeing as he's the responsible for us being in this cosmic joke of a dilemma in the first place. He did, after all, see it coming, and if he could create people with free will who freely chose to do wrong and damn the entire race, there's no reason he couldn't have created people who freely chose to make the right decision instead.

And for the record, the Catholics believe in Purgatory, so don't think I'm going to take your point with anything more than a pixel.

Yes, we know, your fundie backwater church is the true faith, everyone else is wrong.

I'll agree with you that Purgatory is not really Biblical - but it is fairer.

You're as see-through as a brand new pane of glass.

You might want to be less dismissive of this, as it's a reason why many reject your religion. Try not making a Great Commission Fail for one day in your life, hmm?

AV1611VET · Jun 11, 2011

Cabal said:
You might want to be less dismissive of this, as it's a reason why many reject your religion.

I see.

Many 'reject my religion' because I can read you like a book?

Cabal said:
Try not making a Great Commission Fail for one day in your life, hmm?

In other words, take your point with more than a pixel, or I'm committing GC Failure?

No, thanks.

Cabal · Jun 11, 2011

AV1611VET said:
I see.

Many 'reject my religion' because I can read you like a book?

Well you obviously weren't being dismissive of that notion, now were you? Don't be obtuse.

In other words, take your point with more than a pixel, or I'm committing GC Failure?

No, thanks.

You could at least respond to it with something other than sarcasm.

But hey, you clearly have your heart set on enjoying that millstone.

Like I said, the attitudes of people like YOU share in the responsibility for people leaving the church, and if you really practised what you preached, you'd be more concerned about that. Frankly it's pathetic that you sanctimonious types either blame the person they're preaching at, or God for it being his will - without even attempting to respond to the points they're trying to raise with anything other than sarcasm. Own your failures, don't pass the buck onto me when you haven't even attempted to engage.

I at least owned my failures, when I was a Christian, because I actually listened to the people I believed I was commissioned to reach.

But hey, keep it up AV - every time you pull a stunt like this, I'm going to remind you what a failure you are to the God you serve.

AV1611VET · Jun 11, 2011

Cabal said:
Like I said, the attitudes of people like YOU share in the responsibility for people leaving the church, and if you really practised what you preached, you'd be more concerned about that.

[none of my business] Is that why you left the church? or did you 'have questions that your undershepherd couldn't answer'? [/none of my business]

You guys have more excuses for leaving your faith, than Carter has liver pills.

I don't turn my back on God if I have questions my pastor can't answer; nor do I do it because someone steps on my tootsies, or doesn't treat me like Miss Manners would, or park in 'my parking space', or sit in 'my pew', or fails to shake my hand, or whatever.

Cabal said:
But hey, keep it up AV - every time you pull a stunt like this, I'm going to remind you what a failure you are to the God you serve.

You go right ahead -- you're not fooling anyone but yourself -- (and maybe some of your educated contemporaries).

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