Is it a sin not to do this on the Sabbath?

So then if some jobs are okay to do, what is the purpose to tell some people that they cannot work on sabbath? Again, what is the motivation for some adults to feel like they must tell other adults how to live their lives?

k4c said:

Many Christians have questions regarding what can be done on the Sabbath as it relates to certain jobs.

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]We have to understand that it's not the working or not working that makes any particular day holy, the day is holy in spite of what we do or don't do. God tells us to honor the fact that the day is holy by ceasing labor on that day. Don't we as mankind do the same thing. I have Thanksgiving, Fourth of July off in light of what the day stands for. Having these days off is not what makes them holy, these days are holy because something else made them holy.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]With that in mind, Jesus taught many times about keeping the Sabbath holy in light of necessary needs pertaining to life and service to God.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Farmers need to care for their animals seven days a week, does that make them a Sabbath breaker? Not according to Jesus. As a matter of fact, if you have animals that you care for on the Sabbath and then call someone else a Sabbath breaker for doing necessary things on the Sabbath then you are called a hypocrite by Jesus, not a Sabbath breaker.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Luke 13:10-15 Now He was teaching in one of the synagogues on the Sabbath. And behold, there was a woman who had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bent over and could in no way raise herself up. But when Jesus saw her, He called her to Him and said to her, "Woman, you are loosed from your infirmity.'' And He laid His hands on her, and immediately she was made straight, and glorified God. But the ruler of the synagogue answered with indignation, because Jesus had healed on the Sabbath; and he said to the crowd, "There are six days on which men ought to work; therefore come and be healed on them, and not on the Sabbath day.'' The Lord then answered him and said, "Hypocrite! Does not each one of you on the Sabbath loose his ox or his donkey from the stall, and lead it away to water it? [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]If you're hungry on the Sabbath and need to do something that would otherwise be a violation of a regulation Jesus says our human need overrides that regulation whether it's the Sabbath or not. As a matter of fact, Jesus goes on to say how this was an old testament principle as well.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Matthew 12:1-5 At that time Jesus went through the grain fields on the Sabbath. And His disciples were hungry, and began to pluck heads of grain and to eat. But when the Pharisees saw it, they said to Him, "Look, Your disciples are doing what is not lawful to do on the Sabbath!'' Then He said to them, "Have you not read what David did when he was hungry, he and those who were with him: "how he entered the house of God and ate the show bread which was not lawful for him to eat, nor for those who were with him, but only for the priests? "Or have you not read in the law that on the Sabbath the priests in the temple profane the Sabbath, and are blameless? [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Notice how doing something in violation of regulations due to necessary needs and service to God is not a violation of the Sabbath, this includes people who have to work on the Sabbath such as pastors, police, fire, rescue, doctors, electricians and plumbers on emergency call and so on.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Obeying the teachings of Jesus, which is what the new covenant is founded on, removes all the ritualistic keeping of the Ten Commandments. Having the Spirit of God living within you will cause you to not only obey the Ten Commandments but will lead you beyond just the keeping of the letter and move you into the spirit of the Law, which is love for God and love for mankind. This is where we find ourselves caring for needs pertaining to life in spite of it being a violation of a regulation but this does not do away with the regulation during times when there is no need pertaining to life or service to God.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]God is looking for justice, mercy and faith in our lives as new covenant Christians but not at the expense of forgetting the other things.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Matthew 23:23 "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you pay tithe of mint and anise and cumin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faith. These you ought to have done, without leaving the others undone. [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Many times justice, mercy and faith are not present when people keep the commandments of God out of ritualism or with a legalistic mindset. Obeying Jesus and allowing Him to write these things on our hearts and minds through the indwelling Spirit will cure these flaws in religious man over time. [/FONT]

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You missed the point of Stormy's question in response to this statement by addo:

addo said:

It is true that it is better to save a life than to lose one. These people should at least not get payed with money when they're working on the Sabbath. It's the least they can do. Jesus never asked for money. But asking the same from them would be too much, so the least they can do is at least not getting paid in the Sabbath for doing their work.

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Does that apply to pastors? Should pastors forfeit the payment that they receive for working on the Sabbath?

You know, I keep scratching my head about all of this. There are pieces of this debate that simply don't make sense to me.

I've yet to meet a sabbatarian in this forum who advocates that modern day sabbatarians ought to observe the sabbath as described in the Old Testament (including offering animal sacrifices). Rather, they've expressed loyalty to a new form of sabbath keeping. When I ask questions about the nature of their modern day sabbath behavior, I am told that I am a Pharisee.

So it seems to me that modern day sabbath behavior could encompass any number of things. If this true, it seems that only difference between me and my SDA brothers and sisters is that I do not profess to be a sabbath keeper.

Have I reached an accurate conclusion?

BFA

Byfaithalone1 said:

You know, I keep scratching my head about all of this. There are pieces of this debate that simply don't make sense to me.

I've yet to meet a sabbatarian in this forum who advocates that modern day sabbatarians ought to observe the sabbath as described in the Old Testament (including offering animal sacrifices). Rather, they've expressed loyalty to a new form of sabbath keeping. When I ask questions about the nature of their modern day sabbath behavior, I am told that I am a Pharisee.

So it seems to me that modern day sabbath behavior could encompass any number of things. If this true, it seems that only difference between me and my SDA brothers and sisters is that I do not profess to be a sabbath keeper.

Have I reached an accurate conclusion?

BFA

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Virtually every SDA has their own interpretation of what Sabbath-keeping is. I know literally hundreds of SDA's. I am drowning in an ocean of them daily. For 99% of them turning off the TV on Saturday is all they do. They can still use their computer on Saturday but not for video games. The 4th commandment is little more than a tool to get the kids to stop staring at the TV and go outside for a day. Also, listening to secular music on Saturday is a no-no. That's about it though. And the vast majority of SDA's don't even do these few things. There is no controlling legal authority in the church! It was EGW if it was anyone and they threw out most of her stuff long ago. So now its just one big grey area. Everyone just believes whatever makes their life easiest and lets them sleep at night.

Byfaithalone1 said:

You know, I keep scratching my head about all of this. There are pieces of this debate that simply don't make sense to me.

I've yet to meet a sabbatarian in this forum who advocates that modern day sabbatarians ought to observe the sabbath as described in the Old Testament (including offering animal sacrifices). Rather, they've expressed loyalty to a new form of sabbath keeping. When I ask questions about the nature of their modern day sabbath behavior, I am told that I am a Pharisee.

So it seems to me that modern day sabbath behavior could encompass any number of things. If this true, it seems that only difference between me and my SDA brothers and sisters is that I do not profess to be a sabbath keeper.

Have I reached an accurate conclusion?

BFA

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I agree. I was raised with not very strict standards of Sabbath-keeping. We couldn't go to school activities or sports events or parties on Sabbath--usually, although my parents sometimes made exceptions. My parents didn't care what we watched on TV or listened to on the radio, and they would take us out to eat occasionally on Sabbath. I was allowed to babysit on Friday nights (and accept payment). My dad was even critical of more conservative Adventists for not reading reading the newspaper or opening their mail on Sabbath. My parents and one of my sisters still observe the Sabbath like that. (My other sister is much more strict in her Sabbath observance and thinks that we are on our way to hell for rejecting the Sabbath.) Of course, they still think that we are wrong, but it does seem that professing to keep the Sabbath is really all that matters to them because in practice they don't really do anything differently than we do now, other than going to church on Saturdays.

When my hubby was a pastor, we lived in an area of the country where we were surrounded by very traditional Adventists (which was a big culture shock for me), and most of them were much more strict in their Sabbath observance. The contrast between their practices and my family's practices was one thing that made me notice the inconsistencies among different groups of Adventists. Even there, however, most people didn't follow all of EGW's instructions for Sabbath-keeping.

What initially led me to doubt the official Adventist view of the Sabbath was the realization that the Bible doesn't separate the law into moral and ceremonial components based on the ten commandments, as Adventism teaches. As I continued studying, another thing that I realized was that the modified Sabbath that most Adventists observe today is not actually in accordance with the law, and it is not even in accordance with EGW's instructions. So, while I see value in many of the activities that Adventists recommend for Sabbath, such as worshiping God, fellowshiping with family and friends, reading the Bible, praying, and even resting from work--I also see that if those things can be separated from the commandment itself by customizing the specifics and offering only vague guidelines when teaching people about Sabbath observance, then those things are not dependent on the prescriptions of the law. Adventists have changed the rituals, and if the rituals can be changed, then they are not universally binding moral imperatives. Any moral principles that could apply to the seventh-day Sabbath could apply just as well to any other day or to every day of the week.

k4c said:

There is no reason to scratch your head if you listen to Jesus.

The New Covenant is founded on the words of Jesus with the Spirit of God bringing back to rememberance what Jesus said.

http://looking4jesus.com/Jesussabbath.html

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Then why is there so much confusion within your own church about what one must do, and not do, on Saturday?

k4c said:

There is no reason to scratch your head if you listen to Jesus.

The New Covenant is founded on the words of Jesus with the Spirit of God bringing back to rememberance what Jesus said.

[URL]http://looking4jesus.com/Jesussabbath.html[/URL]

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If it is the words of Jesus that describe modern day sabbath keeping, then I must conclude that modern day sabbath keeping includes work.

If it is the Biblical commands that describe sabbath keeping, then I must conclude that most SDAs are sabbatarians by profession only.

BFA

k4c said:

The seventh day is holy, sanctified, and blessed whether you believe it or not. The seventh day is holy, sanctified whether keep it holy or not. In the same God is real whether you believe of not.

Those who love God will have no problem honoring God will for His people. If you believe the seventh day wasn't blessed and called holy for you then you have no obligation to partake of it's blessing. The first commandments are for God's people only.

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dodge, deflect, distract...

k4c said:

The seventh day is holy, sanctified, and blessed whether you believe it or not. The seventh day is holy, sanctified whether keep it holy or not. In the same God is real whether you believe of not.

Those who love God will have no problem honoring God will for His people. If you believe the seventh day wasn't blessed and called holy for you then you have no obligation to partake of it's blessing.

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I believe you have confused the sabbath with the seventh day. I don't find anywhere in Scripture that God sanctified the 2,160,000th day.

k4c said:

The first commandments are for God's people only.

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I think you mean the first covenant, the one God took away to establish the new covenant (Hebrews 10:9).