In Secondary Communion with Rome?

Like whitewashing a tomb, make the visible all nice and pretty to hide the schisms within.

Man will always lie to himself first.

JR

Andoverpolo said:

I learned something intriguing on wikipedia yesterday - if you check out the article describing which Churches are in communion with each other apparently Presbies in full communion with the Evangelical Lutherans who are presently working out communion agreements with the Methodists and Anglicans - and there's the rub.

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That's only one group of liberal Presbyterians PC(USA) that are in communion with the ELCA. These Presbies in no way represent historic Presbyterianism, and have no connection with the majority of Reformed Christians here in SR.

HiredGoon said:

That's only one group of liberal Presbyterians PC(USA) that are in communion with the ELCA. These Presbies in no way represent historic Presbyterianism, and have no connection with the majority of Reformed Christians here in SR.

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What he said. Basically, PCUSA and ELCA are liberal Christian denominations. And seeing as how liberal Christianity is almost indistinguishable from secular humanism these days, I'm pretty sure the Catholics wouldn't want them.

It doesn't really bother me. These are all just words on paper. Just because a few bishops sign some documents doesn't mean that it will alter the beliefs of the average Christian, either for better or for worse. I'm far more concerned with whether or not Christians know Jesus as their Lord, and ascribe to sound, Biblical doctrine, than I am with their denomination's paperwork.

Andoverpolo said:

Ultimately my concern deals with sacraments - not administration. I became a Catholic because I was expecting to have a family and I wanted us all to go to the same Church and all fully participate - no "Mommy why is daddy not going up for communion" questions.

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Sacraments are within the category of doctrine in the Church.

Doctrine is a totally different matter.

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Impossible. When we deal with sacraments, we are dealing with doctrine.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with pulling the Churchs back into a status where - despite having different doctrines or interpretations we can at least recognize each others sacraments as binding and Christian. It's going to take a great deal of work to get Rome to ever come around but in the mean time Protestants should look past doctrinal issues and at least agree on sacraments.

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I disagree. For instance, Roman Catholicism teaches baptismal regeneration, and Protestantism teaches that Baptism does nothing toward your salvation. All you are doing is identifying with the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, it does not save you in any way, shape, or form (minus sanctification, which can only occur if you are a believer... I guess I'm preaching believer's baptism ) Furthermore, the Lord's Supper in the Roman Catholic view is that of transsubstantiation, but it begs the question, if Jesus has already died on the cross for sins, why does He have to be an actual part of the elements? Totally baffles me, last I read, the work was "finished".

I think our only serious hinderance to that kind of free association between Protestants is the gay marriage heresy. I don't see any compromise there.

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Gay marriage... heresy? Umm... I'd argue whether or not it is a heresy. In fact, I don't believe it's a heresy, though it is a serious doctrinal error, kinda like arminianism or semi-pelagianism.

To the glory of God,

Randy