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Michelina said:Excellent posts, Grace. Thank you!
we must respect the blessing of fecundity in marriage: entering marriage with the intention of never having children is a grave wrong and more than likely grounds for an annulment because you aren't consenting to be married at all; blocking God out of your fertility, using technology to control it, limiting family size without serious reason are all attacks on the blessing of fecundity, contrary to God's command to "be fruitful and multiply", contrary to the generous love we are called to live every day, contrary to the faith and trust God wants us to have in Him. The atrocity of procured abortion is a direct attack on the fecundity of marriage. Resorting to technology for the conception of children, as Pope Paul VI terms it in Humanae Vitae, deliberately removing the unitive purpose of sexual intercourse, attacks the good of fecundity.
skatepixie said:Is it wrong, then, to get married if you know you cant have a child?
I would say no, because you would still love eachother just as much, plus you could adopt a child, or multiple childern, and give them a home they wouldnt have otherwise had. So, the marrage would be complete that way.
But would it be wrong if a couple decided not to adopt?
Yes and noskatepixie said:Is it wrong, then, to get married if you know you cant have a child?
I would say no, because you would still love eachother just as much, plus you could adopt a child, or multiple childern, and give them a home they wouldnt have otherwise had. So, the marrage would be complete that way.
But would it be wrong if a couple decided not to adopt?
I refuse to believe you are only 17.Irenaeus said:Geo,
Hello! Good questions.
Well, I would have to say that the eating of candy bars and whatnot is okay, as long as it isn't contrary to temperance. I certainly don't eat them solely for their nutritional value. Even St. Teresa of Avila, as Michelina once shared with me, throughly enjoyed a certain bird, saying, "Penance is penance, pheasant is pheasant."
It really is a matter of conscience as to whether or not one is indulging beyond right rule of reason. For example, at weddings you may have wonderful foods and at times of celebration partake of a good meal, and harty company. Even the Book of Ecclesiastes mentions the goodness of a table partaken of with thanksgiving, and with good manners befitting a man in control of his appetites. It is when food becomes an end, and not a means, that a disorder takes place.
If I may go on a personal note, all my life I have been practically indulged to the point of thinking that almost every irrational craving I have for food is a need; now I am more discerning regarding my hungers, trying to offer them up for God, and saying in my heart, "Lord, I will give up these good things to love you. You are the food of my soul." So even though having a brownie after dinner isn't bad, there are different means for different souls. A Priest, Brother of Sister may be able to observe more rigorous abstinence then say a lay person, because of their state in life.
I hope this answers your question.
ShannonMcCatholic said:Marcia I have to say that my heart agrees with what you write- though I don't have the smarts to argue it authoritatively. Emotionally- I wish that I could just be totally open to not regulating my births at all...whenever I am not really able to have a baby it leaves a great, gaping wound in my heart...
Michelina said:The teaching must be understood in a balanced way, not as a reason for postponing marriage. The fact that the Church everywhere accepts the integrity of the intentions of young couples manifests the more balanced interpretation of the intent of the teaching.
It happens every day, Marcia.Marcia said:...many of those couples will find life doesn't go according to their plans and they might be having a child sooner than they expect.
Cosmic Charlie said:It just runs counter-intutative, I think, to most people that love and sex should be so thelogloical complicated and convoluted. And they get turned off to it.
Hi Irenaeus, well said.Irenaeus said:Geo,
Hello! Good questions.
Well, I would have to say that the eating of candy bars and whatnot is okay, as long as it isn't contrary to temperance. I certainly don't eat them solely for their nutritional value. Even St. Teresa of Avila, as Michelina once shared with me, throughly enjoyed a certain bird, saying, "Penance is penance, pheasant is pheasant."
It really is a matter of conscience as to whether or not one is indulging beyond right rule of reason. For example, at weddings you may have wonderful foods and at times of celebration partake of a good meal, and harty company. Even the Book of Ecclesiastes mentions the goodness of a table partaken of with thanksgiving, and with good manners befitting a man in control of his appetites. It is when food becomes an end, and not a means, that a disorder takes place.
If I may go on a personal note, all my life I have been practically indulged to the point of thinking that almost every irrational craving I have for food is a need; now I am more discerning regarding my hungers, trying to offer them up for God, and saying in my heart, "Lord, I will give up these good things to love you. You are the food of my soul." So even though having a brownie after dinner isn't bad, there are different means for different souls. A Priest, Brother of Sister may be able to observe more rigorous abstinence then say a lay person, because of their state in life.
I hope this answers your question.
I just wanted to give you big amarciadietrich said:Over the weekend I pulled out videos of when my guys were young, incredible how time flies and my "baby" is going to be 11 this summer. How many people get their kids raised and think they had too many instead of too few? Can you have too many grandchildren? In my case I may not get any grandchildren. But hey, we've got a computer for everyone in the family.
I don't know that I could or would have ever been able to be totally open and no regulating births ... when it comes down to it most of us will let fear and worry keep us from that sort of openness. I'm probably liberal in a lot of ways relative to many in this discussion ( if Charlie hadn't shown up in the thread I might have said most liberal), so definately not trying to judge anybody.
Marcia
Me, too! My son just told me today that in addition to being a super hero when he grows up he wants to be a priest.geocajun said:If all 3 of my daughters became nuns, i'd be the happiest dad around!
not any that I can think of- a priest eveb gets to wear a super suit (vestments) and sometimes even a cape (humeral veil).geocajun said:is there a difference?
capes are out - their dangerous. Have you seen the movie "The Incredibles" ?ShannonMcCatholic said:not any that I can think of- a priest eveb gets to wear a super suit (vestments) and sometimes even a cape (humeral veil).
Though I know what you're thinking.....no capes!
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