How is baptism performed correctly, and can it be performed incorrectly?

JohnB445 said:

What denominations believe that this is crucial for salvation? Is there any exceptions? For example someone believes in Jesus, and drives on his way to get baptized but passes away before he could go there because of a car accident.

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Catholics consider baptism to be crucial. And yet there is an exception for the person in the car crash on the way to be baptized. We call that 'baptism by desire' and we think God honors the intent to be baptized. We don't know exactly how. That's up to the abundant mercy of God. We know baptism is the ordinary and expected way to put on Christ.

JohnB445 said:

And then there are those who believe in Jesus who never got baptized for some reason.

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They really should be baptized. They really should. What's their excuse?

JohnB445 said:

What I really want to know is who can perform the baptism, can someone who is not a Christian perform the baptism? Can a Christian perform the baptism by himself, what happens if he tries?

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You can't baptize yourself. It has to be done TO you and not BY you. Just as you do not earn the graces given in baptism. They are given to you, done to you, not earned. This is even more richly understood in the baptism of infants who have not even asked for or arranged for their own baptism.

Technically it is Jesus who baptizes you, using someone to say the words and get you all wet. The sacrament is effective through the power of Christ. Normally a minister does it, standing in for Jesus Christ. One of my children was baptized by a deacon. However there are some special circumstances where other people CAN baptize validly. In an emergency YOU can baptize someone else if they ask for it. In an emergency anyone, even someone who is not a Christian, can baptize another person. All they need is the intent to do what the Church does, say the Trinitarian words for baptism, and use natural water. Thus a Jewish or even an atheist doctor, for example, trying to be a nice guy, can validly baptize a dying person. Or two unbaptized people on a desert isle can baptize each other one at a time.

The proper formula is: "I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." The intent has to be what the Church does. Not what the Mormons intend with their odd conception of God, or what the Jehovah's Witnesses intend with their anti-Trinitarian understanding of God, but what normal Lutherans and Catholics and Orthodox and Baptists intend. Not some odd substitute “Creator, Redeemer, and Sanctifier” or “Creator, Liberator, and Sustainer” stuff but "Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

Notice I didn't even mention sprinkling or pouring or immersion. All OK. If you get the chance, see if you can be baptized by immersion. Whichever way it works the same but the symbolism of drowning and being pulled up to new life in Christ is powerful.

So you could find just about anybody to baptize you, and even get it done tomorrow. But I would advise learning more and meditating on your choice because living the faith once you are baptized is a huge decision. I'd suggest checking out either Alpha or Sycamore (two multi-week programs) to get your feet wet, and then proceeding on to a baptismal class such as the 'Order of Christian Initiation for Adults' (which could be multiple months).

JohnB445 said:

What denominations believe that this is crucial for salvation? Is there any exceptions? For example someone believes in Jesus, and drives on his way to get baptized but passes away before he could go there because of a car accident.

And then there are those who believe in Jesus who never got baptized for some reason. What I really want to know is who can perform the baptism, can someone who is not a Christian perform the baptism? Can a Christian perform the baptism by himself, what happens if he tries?

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Do you want to know the extreme one can go to in equating being outwardly baptized, as a testimony, to the actual moment of salvation?

I recieved Jesus as my Lord and Savior alone in my apartment one night. The next morning I wrote out a flawless statement of faith as a written reminder to refer to.

Started praying each day and quickly God led me to buy a good Bible. Began consuming it voraciously, I couldn't get enough, it was turning my worldview upside down. My awe and love for God was growing.

Then something amazing started to happen. I realized that my prayers began to include spiritual truths that I didn't know beforehand, and I didn't understand where they were coming from.

Then a day or week later I would come across those very truths in Scripture. Hmm...

Finally I came across Scripture about the Holy Spirit. Who is that? I began studying about Him specifically until the day it dawned on me - that is Who is praying with and for me. By golly, I am sealed, indwelt, and filled.

I was baptized by the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit alone in that apartment, and NO mere man can tell me otherwise, or ever will.

Soon found a Bible-believing, Spirit-filled Church and after a few months - then I got outwardly baptized as a testimony to the world. Yes, dunked, ok? But sprinkled woulda been just fine. And yes, the Pastor pronounced that I was baptized in the Name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.

Now to the ridiculous part. At times in my walk through the years, when I'm weak in the faith, and starting to doubt my security as a believer, I start to listen to folks that you gotta be saved this way or that way - down to the nth degree like straining a gnat.

And you know what enters my mind when I'm at my weakest? One little detail I left out.

The pastor mispronounced my last name. And I think, man, maybe I'm doomed on a technicality!!!

Guess who that temptation comes from, folks? The Accuser himself.

What permanently set me free was two portions of Scripture.

One, the fact that Jesus Himself was perfectly fine with the one crucified thief's declaration of faith and declared him saved with his own lips. We got a problem with that, go tell it to Jesus.

Two, this wee bit of Scripture right here:

Romans 8:16 NIV

"The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God."

If ever there is a must, this is it. Believe His voice directly to us, because He has taught us how to recognize it through exhaustive study of His Word.

And as we die to self each day, and seek Him diligently, He reinforces as much by revealing more of Himself, confiding in us as friends as Jesus promises, and even allowing us a glimpse now and then of the fruit He is bearing through us.

Ya know, almost as if we have a living, breathing relationship with Him or something!

Let the debaters and legalists rage on into eternity.

God bless us all!

chevyontheriver said:

Catholics consider baptism to be crucial. And yet there is an exception for the person in the car crash on the way to be baptized. We call that 'baptism by desire' and we think God honors the intent to be baptized. We don't know exactly how. That's up to the abundant mercy of God. We know baptism is the ordinary and expected way to put on Christ.

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What if a new Christian doesn't know/realize they need to be baptized?

JohnB445 said:

What denominations believe that this is crucial for salvation? Is there any exceptions? For example someone believes in Jesus, and drives on his way to get baptized but passes away before he could go there because of a car accident.

And then there are those who believe in Jesus who never got baptized for some reason. What I really want to know is who can perform the baptism, can someone who is not a Christian perform the baptism? Can a Christian perform the baptism by himself, what happens if he tries?

Click to expand...

Denominations are man made entities and are not where you want to look for truth, but to God's Word, test everything by God's Word alone.

You have heard of the man on the cross next to the Lord Jesus? He was unable to be baptised, yet the Lord Jesus granted him eternal security from his sins. This demonstrates how baptism is not necessary for salvation:

Luke 23:39-43
Now one of the malefactors who had been hanged spoke insultingly to him, saying, Art not thou the Christ? save thyself and us. But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost *thou* too not fear God, thou that art under the same judgment? and *we* indeed justly, for we receive the just recompense of what we have done; but this [man] has done nothing amiss. And he said to Jesus, Remember me, [Lord,] when thou comest in thy kingdom. And Jesus said to him, Verily I say to thee, To-day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

Baptism is something a person should do once they are saved, not in order to be saved. This is what the Bible shows forth, if you read it carefully. No works (including religious works, such as baptism, or taking part in the Lord's Supper) can save us. Only what Christ has done in those 3 hours of darkness on the cross can save us, for it was then that he became sin for us.

Who should perform the baptism? Again, what does the Bible tell us? Here is one verse to consider:

Matthew 28:19
Go [therefore] and make disciples of all the nations, baptising them to the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit

1. It is disciples of Christ that are to baptise - those who follow Him - fellow christians! Not yourself, or an unbeliever.
2. It is brothers in Christ, not sisters who do the baptising.
3. We know from John the Baptist's ministry, that he immersed people in the Jordan (Matthew 3:6, Matthew 3:16). So, full immersion is the preferred method, as that is what is demonstrated to us from the Bible, same with the Ethiopian Eunuch (Acts 8:38)
4. We are to baptise in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit

God would have all those that believe in Him to be baptised. I hasten to add, however, we do not lose our salvation (which is impossible) for not being baptised, but it would be improper for us not to be baptised. It would also mean you are not taking your place, formally, with Christ and his people (in an outward sense), for this is what baptism does.

JohnB445 said:

What denominations believe that this is crucial for salvation? Is there any exceptions? For example someone believes in Jesus, and drives on his way to get baptized but passes away before he could go there because of a car accident.

And then there are those who believe in Jesus who never got baptized for some reason. What I really want to know is who can perform the baptism, can someone who is not a Christian perform the baptism? Can a Christian perform the baptism by himself, what happens if he tries?

Click to expand...

Have you received the baptism of His Holy Spirit spoken of by John the Baptist?

"I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire."

This is the Baptism that saves.

Be blessed.

ozso said:

What if a new Christian doesn't know/realize they need to be baptized?

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How could they NOT know? If they pick up and read a Bible they would know. If they join the Church they would know. If they read anything of the teachings of the vast majority of teachings from who knows what Christian groups they would know. So they should get baptized. It’s only a rare bird that wouldn’t be able to figure it out. An even rarer bird who would insist against baptism.

I knew a member of the PCA who swore up and down he would NEVER be baptized as it was totally unnecessary. After he did this for a long time his wife told him that he was indeed baptized and they had the proof of it at home. Note: As far as I know the PCA has nothing against baptism.

chevyontheriver said:

How could they NOT know? If they pick up and read a Bible they would know. If they join the Church they would know. If they read anything of the teachings of the vast majority of teachings from who knows what Christian groups they would know. So they should get baptized. It’s only a rare bird that wouldn’t be able to figure it out. An even rarer bird who would insist against baptism.

I knew a member of the PCA who swore up and down he would NEVER be baptized as it was totally unnecessary. After he did this for a long time his wife told him that he was indeed baptized and they had the proof of it at home. Note: As far as I know the PCA has nothing against baptism.

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I knew Jesus throughout my childhood, but I wasn't baptized until I was 18. I just didn't understand how important it was.

ozso said:

I knew Jesus throughout my childhood, but I wasn't baptized until I was 18. I just didn't understand how important it was.

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How did you figure it out? Did somebody eventually tell you?

chevyontheriver said:

How did you figure it out? Did somebody eventually tell you?

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I had moved in with an older cousin and his family and I attended church with them. The church was having a baptism service and their child was getting baptized. Which led to me getting baptized that day too.

Baptism never saved anyone, it is good to get it done and be obedient though. If you failed it will not keep you out of heaven. I'd say at least half of Protestant churches do not think that baptism is required to be saved. Why Do Baptists Baptize? (Part 2) | First Baptist Church Jacksonville
I have heard of isolated cases where the believer baptized themself. One I recall was a believer that lived in a place where there was no church or other believers.
There are about 7 different types of baptism. What are the seven baptisms mentioned in the Bible, and what do they mean? | GotQuestions.org

JohnB445 said:

What denominations believe that this is crucial for salvation? Is there any exceptions? For example someone believes in Jesus, and drives on his way to get baptized but passes away before he could go there because of a car accident.

And then there are those who believe in Jesus who never got baptized for some reason. What I really want to know is who can perform the baptism, can someone who is not a Christian perform the baptism? Can a Christian perform the baptism by himself, what happens if he tries?

Click to expand...

There are some interesting things about "water" that I have learned, which helps me understand why God used it in examples HE had written for our admonition. When I jump in a lake, the water influences every inch of my body. Behind my ears, between my toes, all the follicles of my hair. (both of them, LOL) I believe God uses water as a symbol of influence. The whole world was flooded and was influenced by water in Noah's time. A water that would kill them, if they lived in it. But Noah and His Family were not influenced by this water at all, protected from this influence by the Ark of God.

There is also living water, and the same would be true concerning this water as well, Yes? We are not to just stick a finger in it, or a toe. But we are to be completely influenced by it. This water doesn't cause death, rather, it causes life. Spiritually speaking, this would be the Teaching of Christ, Yes? The "Way of the Lord". We would want to be emersed, completely influenced by it, rejecting any other influence, as this is the only "Living water" and the Lord's Christ is the only source of this water.

I can receive this living water, from the closet of my home, in a private conversation with the God and Father of the Lord's Christ. Jesus Himself said the Words HE gave to us, are from His Father. That these Same Words are Spiritual, therefore the "Living Water" is also Spiritual. I don't believe a man should seek this water from the Synagogues built of wood and stone, by the hands of men. Doesn't this same Jesus warn of this very thing in Matt. 6?

For me, I went to Jesus for instruction concerning these matters through the Holy scriptures that Paul said were trustworthy for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

And Jesus said in these Holy Scriptures, Inspired by His Father, to "Seek first, the Kingdom of God and HIS Righteousness". There is no instruction by Him at all to seek out this world's Synagogues to be baptized into their religious sect or influences, or as you stated, "denominations".

It seems this is a highly private matter between a man and God, as Jesus teaches.

Matt. 6: 5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. 6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father "which seeth in secret" shall reward thee openly.

A man might say, "How will others know then, that I am baptized into Christ's Living water, if I follow Christ's instructions here, and no other men see the baptism"?

And the Jesus "of the bible" answers this question as well, "By their fruits you shall know them".

Great question, and great topic, and worthy of discussion. But if I had the Oracles of God in my own home, and believed what was written therein, I would not drive to one of the literally hundreds of different religious businesses and sects, AKA "Denominations" of this world, to be baptized, I would follow the instructions of the source of the Living Water instead.

JohnB445 said:

What denominations believe that this is crucial for salvation? Is there any exceptions? For example someone believes in Jesus, and drives on his way to get baptized but passes away before he could go there because of a car accident.

And then there are those who believe in Jesus who never got baptized for some reason. What I really want to know is who can perform the baptism, can someone who is not a Christian perform the baptism? Can a Christian perform the baptism by himself, what happens if he tries?

Click to expand...

There is no Biblical basis for "self-baptism". Even Jesus was baptized by John the Baptist instead of doing it himself. There are no specific commands regarding what sort of person ought to baptize,

However ,according to scripture those who did baptize were followers of Christ ... so it's logical to follow that example ... that is .... being baptized by someone who is a follower of Christ.

Baptism don't save you .... Jesus does. It's an outward ceremony of a change that has already taken place inside.

The Greek word baptizo is transliterated into English as "baptize". The Greek word meany immersion such as a ship that sinks or dishes put in water to wash. The practice of infant baptism came t be practiced fairly early in church history. By the time of the bible translated into English the practice of infant baptism was so firmly established the translators opted for a transliteration rather than an actual translation of the word as immerse.

When a church considers a baptism as a sacrament or ordinance, it is usually only done by someone who is ordained. At the time of the reformation the anabaptists began by baptizing each other.

John the Baptist preached the baptism of repentance for the nation of Israel for the forgiveness of sins. Some believe that water baptism is only for Israel. They consider that gentiles (the church today in the age of grace) only has one "baptism", the immersion of a believer into the body of Christ.

You will have to consider what the bible says and make your own mind up.

Rom 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

The protestant view is being represented well enough.

Here is the Catechism on the Vatican's Website regarding the Sacrament of Baptism. Click Next to flip pages.

If I had a link for the Orthodox teachings, I'd post it too.

fm107 said:

Denominations are man made entities and are not where you want to look for truth, but to God's Word, test everything by God's Word alone.

You have heard of the man on the cross next to the Lord Jesus? He was unable to be baptised, yet the Lord Jesus granted him eternal security from his sins. This demonstrates how baptism is not necessary for salvation:

Luke 23:39-43
Now one of the malefactors who had been hanged spoke insultingly to him, saying, Art not thou the Christ? save thyself and us. But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost *thou* too not fear God, thou that art under the same judgment? and *we* indeed justly, for we receive the just recompense of what we have done; but this [man] has done nothing amiss. And he said to Jesus, Remember me, [Lord,] when thou comest in thy kingdom. And Jesus said to him, Verily I say to thee, To-day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

Baptism is something a person should do once they are saved, not in order to be saved. This is what the Bible shows forth, if you read it carefully. No works (including religious works, such as baptism, or taking part in the Lord's Supper) can save us. Only what Christ has done in those 3 hours of darkness on the cross can save us, for it was then that he became sin for us.

Who should perform the baptism? Again, what does the Bible tell us? Here is one verse to consider:

Matthew 28:19
Go [therefore] and make disciples of all the nations, baptising them to the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit

1. It is disciples of Christ that are to baptise - those who follow Him - fellow christians! Not yourself, or an unbeliever.
2. It is brothers in Christ, not sisters who do the baptising.
3. We know from John the Baptist's ministry, that he immersed people in the Jordan (Matthew 3:6, Matthew 3:16). So, full immersion is the preferred method, as that is what is demonstrated to us from the Bible, same with the Ethiopian Eunuch (Acts 8:38)
4. We are to baptise in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit

God would have all those that believe in Him to be baptised. I hasten to add, however, we do not lose our salvation (which is impossible) for not being baptised, but it would be improper for us not to be baptised. It would also mean you are not taking your place, formally, with Christ and his people (in an outward sense), for this is what baptism does.

Click to expand...

But what if you were on a desert island or something? And there is a chap who becomes a believer, and you, a woman, wants to baptize him? Surely there must be exceptions to the 'general rule'

tansy said:

But what if you were on a desert island or something? And there is a chap who becomes a believer, and you, a woman, wants to baptize him? Surely there must be exceptions to the 'general rule'

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So, the scenario you are presenting is that there is a only one man on a desert island who has become a christian and there is no other christian brother on that island who could baptise him? Not even a young christian boy (a younger brother).

I believe the answer would be simply to wait upon the Lord. The Lord can bring another brother to the island who can baptise him, or the Lord could arrange circumstances in such a way that the man would need to leave the island for a period of time, and in that time get baptised.

God has set out His order of how things ought to be done in His Word. Where we come up against a difficulty such as this where the circumstances are a bit out of the norm, this doesn't permit us to then deviate from doing God's will as it is known to us, it simply means we have to exercise patience and wait upon the Lord.

This principle can be found in 1 Samuel, where the Prophet Samuel was supposed to be the one to offer up the Burnt Offering but wasn't around to do it. So King Saul took it upon himself to offer the Burnt Offering. He should have been patient and wait. Instead, he sinned by doing so.

1 Samuel 13:8-12

Doing God's will is one thing, but it needs to be done in the way God prescribes in His Word.