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otan de elqh ekeinoV to pneuma thV alhqeiaV odhghsei umaV eiV pasan thn alhqeian ou gar lalhsei af eautou all osa an akoush lalhsei kai ta ercomena anaggelei umin
The Church was based in Jerusalem at the time.
Yep!!
Exactly. The Christian church is everywhere.That is irrelevant. The location of the Church has nothing to do with its authority.
What is relevant is that the Christians at Antioch didn't split and they didn't just make up their own doctrine.
Where does it say that they were splitting? The issue is one of false teachers. Please read the verses in context.
They consulted the leaders of the Church who were authorized by Jesus to issue a statement of truth.
Yes and no. They consulted with the apostles who were taught by Jesus His gospel. The apostles had the truth as revealed by Jesus himself. The authority comes from the word of God not from fallible men.
He may need an Orthodox there to translate it for himGreat. Get it in the mail.
Make sure to include some of Squint and Otto's posts so the Holy Father can witness my trials and tribulations for the faith.
Thanks!
Great. Get it in the mail.
Make sure to include some of Squint and Otto's posts so the Holy Father can witness my trials and tribulations for the faith.
Thanks!
Yep!!
Exactly. The Christian church is everywhere.
Where does it say that they were splitting? The issue is one of false teachers. Please read the verses in context.
Yes and no. They consulted with the apostles who were taught by Jesus His gospel. The apostles had the truth as revealed by Jesus himself. The authority comes from the word of God not from fallible men.
The word of God didn't exist in written form at the time.
The Church is not fallible because it is guided by the Holy Spirit. All men are fallible.
The problem was caused by those teaching with apostolic authority.
It was solved by apostolic authority.
Katholikos,,,,please remove the u tube video. We are not talking about conversions or prosylizing denominations...Start your own thread on that...thks
yes, as it is HIS Spirit that makes this household one moment a person gets added by being born again of the Spirit and adopted into the family of God.Does this household believe that abortion is OK with God? no. it's is the taking of innocent lives = murder
Does this household believe in infant baptism? it believes in repentance and being born-again
Does this household believe once saved always saved? it believes that adoption is a legal and insoluble act initiated and upheld by the Parent.
Does this household believe that the real body and blood of Christ are present in the Eucharist? it believes that Christ died once and for all, the ultimate sacrifice and is now seated at the right hand of the Father
Whose household is this? Is it one as Jesus and the Father are one?
Then I will report it since you failed to honor a respectful request I made.i will not
Yep!!
Exactly. The Christian church is everywhere.
Where does it say that they were splitting? The issue is one of false teachers. Please read the verses in context.
Yes and no. They consulted with the apostles who were taught by Jesus His gospel. The apostles had the truth as revealed by Jesus himself. The authority comes from the word of God not from fallible men.
The word of God didn't exist in written form at the time.
Exactly. If you notice from Acts 15 Paul, the NT writer responsible for most of it, was still alive. The word of God was fully written down by the end of the 1st century but quite a bit of it including the synoptics were circulating the churches a lot earlier. It is perfectly natural for new churches to seek the advice of the apostles then.
The Church is not fallible because it is guided by the Holy Spirit. All men are fallible.
We have a fundamental difference as to what composes the church. Biblically the church is the body of believers which are not infallible, however, are guided by the Holy Spirit. Just like your church, some will listen to the HS and some will not.
No. That is not what the verses say. The problem was with those attempting to preach the law versus the gospel.The problem was caused by those teaching with apostolic authority.
It was solved by apostolic authority.
The apostolic authority ended when they died and the NT was fully written. That is why they wrote it.
Most of it did.The word of God didn't exist in written form at the time.
The problem was caused by those teaching with apostolic authority.
It was solved by apostolic authority.
But, I still think that the reconciliation of the various branches of Christ's church is what we ought to be addressing, not merely airing our doctrinal differences. We KNOW that they exist. Question is, how can we draw closer together despite that.
Weren't we going to look into any possibilities of moving us all in that direction?
Along that line, I really appreciate the efforts of our forum administrator, Hentenza, to help steer the discussion in that direction. Part of making that work is addressing some of the issues which have been brought up, and that has been done with diplomacy and skill. And I appreciate, also, the civil direction this discussion is going now. Yes, there are differences in points of view and belief. But I see less of the 'h' epithet! Less name-calling and settling down to look at the issues. Good progress, I would say.
Now, could you summarize what you see as potential common ground for the parties, Albion? And, what can be done to help us all affirm each other and validate each one's Christian experience and practice?
Dave
If something is going to be fixed, it will be GOD doing the fixing. There will be divisions to show who is approved and who is not, it is quite biblical. Jesus brought a sword for that division in the first place.
The sword of the word divides between believers and unbelievers. But as for believers, which are what is on this GT forum, Jesus' prayer was "that they may all be one, that the world may believe that Thou hast sent Me." (Jn. 17) That is how important unity is. And the bickering, accusing and the like are NOT a good witness to those looking on!
Dave
quote=chestertonrules;You mean in your fallible interpretation, right?
You mean from your interpretation of a more divine source?Let's see what we get from a more divine source!
LOL, you can't be serious, Chez. They (the community, not the apostles)were choosin' waiters, not priests! LOLActs 6
They chose Stephen, a man full of faith and of the Holy Spirit; also Philip, Procorus, Nicanor, Timon, Parmenas, and Nicolas from Antioch, a convert to Judaism. 6They presented these men to the apostles, who prayed and laid their hands on them.
The only work to which the rest of the whole chapter refers to about what they were sent off to do, is preaching the gospel. No sacrament is mentioned. Miracles worked, but no priestly duties mentioned.Acts 13
1In the church at Antioch there were prophets and teachers: Barnabas, Simeon called Niger, Lucius of Cyrene, Manaen (who had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch) and Saul. 2While they were worshiping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, "Set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them." 3So after they had fasted and prayed, they placed their hands on them and sent them off.
Acts 14
23Paul and Barnabas appointed elders for them in each church and, with prayer and fasting, committed them to the Lord, in whom they had put their trust.
That doesn't establish an authorization as necessary, it just clarifies that the troublemakers weren't one of Paul's people.Acts 15
23With them they sent the following letter: The apostles and elders, your brothers, To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia: Greetings. 24We have heard that some went out from us without our authorization and disturbed you, troubling your minds by what they said.
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