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hmmmmm.....millenium anybody?

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HisdaughterJen

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No, you and I aren't communicating very well...

#1: That was indeed a scripture citation, it was not a quote.
#2: Don't make that assumption about what I am thinking about how we will reign over the earth during the millenium. I know that when we are in the New Jerusalem, we aren't ever going to leave it because that's what REv 3 says. I also know that we will be like the angels because that's what Jesus said. I also know that we will have glorified bodies like Jesus has. So, if you put 2 and 2 together, then we will be reigning over the earth in glorified bodies like Jesus has from the New Jerusalem which is our home. Now, how God is going to accomplish that and the particulars of that have not been revealed.

So, if I haven't said what I believe about a particular subject or if you don't understand what I said, it's better to ask than assume that I believe something that you made up which I didn't say.
 
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RhodBerth

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Satan wants to gather the nations to battle against the saints and against Jerusalem. That's what happens when Satan has been released from the pit.

When Satan gets released from the pit, the Antichrist comes. EArlier in Rev you read about the Antichrist, who comes out of the pit. (rev 11

The binding of Satan doesn't have effect on our sinning nature. Sin is not caused by Satan. If Satan has been bound, then I still am a sinner.
What Satan wants is release armageddon.
 
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RhodBerth

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Aren't you mixing up The Millenium (Rev 20) with the new Earth (Rev 21/22) ?
 
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HisdaughterJen

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You talk about the millenium as if that's when we're in the new Jerusalem.
Oh, yes...because I fully expect to be in the New Jerusalem during the millenium.

Jhn 14:2 In my Father's house (heaven) are many rooms (abodes); if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you.
Jhn 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me (that's a promise) that you also may be where I am.


Hbr 11:16Instead, they were longing for a better country-a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them.


Hbr 12:22But you have come to Mount Zion, to the heavenly Jerusalem, the city of the living God. You have come to thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly,

Rev 3:10 Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth.
Rev 3:11 I am coming soon. Hold on to what you have, so that no one will take your crown.
Rev 3:12 Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name.



Are we not the Bride of Christ?

Rev 21:1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.
Rev 21:2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.


Rev 21:9 One of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues came and said to me, “Come, I will show you the bride, the wife of the Lamb.”
Rev 21:10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a mountain great and high, and showed me the Holy City, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God.



So, do you think the city is empty and it is the Bride of Christ or do you think the city has us in it and we are coming down from heaven in the city as the Bride of Christ?
 
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heymikey80

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No, you and I aren't communicating very well...

#1: That was indeed a scripture citation, it was not a quote.
It was a Scripture citation that didn't establish what you asserted.
#2: Don't make that assumption about what I am thinking about how we will reign over the earth during the millenium.
Well actually, that's the defining distinction between premillenialism and amillenialism. Are you saying you're not premillenial either? Or that you're amillenial with a premillenial reading on two returns of Christ?

Amillenialism is simply the assertion that the Millenial reign of Christ is not a future, thousand-year, physical reign of Jesus Christ on the earth. Normally amils take the Millenium to be His present Spiritual reign in the lives of people today. But if you're mixing pre&a, that's fine too. Is Christ's Kingdom reigning in people's lives today? Is this reign in some sense different than that during the Millenial Reign?

In what sense?
Mkay. In your view is the Millenium an occasion where Jesus returns to earth?

And you realize ... that I don't put 2 and 2 together because I don't agree with the view of the Millenium that you started with.
 
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RhodBerth

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Jen, you practice cut-and-paste theology.

You cut all kinds of texts from different parts of the scripture, and paste them together to make them fit your theology and opinion. You hardly ever explain them or try to understand them. You just pick them up and place them there were you want to have it.

You have no arguments, you just cut a text and paste it. Such a way of performing theology is most dangerous. you can get everything from the Bible by doing that.

The Bible is not a cut-and-paste book. You must have good reasons to connect different texts from different testaments and different authors together. Ie. because they use the same symbols or refer to the same event. It's not as if every Bible text that refers to peace or love automaticly refers to the millenium. (even more since the literal text about the millenium, rev 20, doesn't even include peace or Jerusalem)
 
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RhodBerth

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There's nothing that tells us that this is about the Millenium or about the New Earth. There's nothing about the New Jerusalem either.

You just cut and paste a text, underline some parts, make some parts a different color. But there's seriously NOTHING that proofs your points.

Hbr 11:16Instead, they were longing for a better country-a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them.

There's NOTHING here that tells us that this is about the Millenium or about the New Earth. We simply can't use this text for or against a physical millenium. We can't, because it's not there. I can't use it, neither can you use it.

Hbr 12:22But you have come to Mount Zion, to the heavenly Jerusalem, the city of the living God. You have come to thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly

Same story.
NOTHING here about the Millenium. It's about the Millenium in your head, because you just paste it together with Rev 20, and make it a nice cut'nd'paste story. But there's nothing here. No evidence for or against a physical millenium.


Nothing here that proofs that thew New Jerusalem comes at the beginning of the Millenium.



Rev 21 is about the New Earth (Rev 21:1)
It's impossible to mix up the New Jerusalem with the Millenium from this text. It's the opposite, this text (about the New Jerusalem) is so clearly AFTER the Millenium, AFTER judgement day, after the last coming of Jesus.


Same story. Rev21 is about the New Earth. John says it himself in Rev21:1. (but that's a part you apparantly aren't eager to cut and paste)

So, do you think the city is empty and it is the Bride of Christ or do you think the city has us in it and we are coming down from heaven in the city as the Bride of Christ?

What does this have to do with the subject?
Obviously will The New Jerusalem (which is an image of the church) not be 'empty'. But what does that have to do with the Millenium? Nothing.

There are many good arguments for a physical millenium, but these are really not among them.
Can you please reflect on yourself and on the way you use the scripture to form your own theology?

I'm sorry, I can't bring up to say it in love anymore. I'm really angry.
 
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HisdaughterJen

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Now, just hold on...no need to get angry...I was trying to demonstrate that the New Jerusalem is in heaven until it comes down at the end of the millenium. I was demonstrating with scriptures that those who believe in Jesus' sacrifice have a home (a city prepared for us) in heaven. We go there before the millenium (prior to wrath which we are not appointed to suffer) and we don't return until the city comes down at the end of the millenium.

Now, if proof that there is death and sin during the millenium is what you want, then, you are right, I posted the wrong scriptures.

Remember that Jesus must reign until He puts everything under His feet and then He hands it all back to the Father...as a perfect existence - heaven and earth together - God tabernacling among us. But that isn't until the end of the millenium.

Here's how I know that there is sin and death during the millenium:

#1. Death is not thrown into the Lake of Fire until the end of the millenium.


Rev 20:10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Rev 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books.
Rev 20:13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done.
Rev 20:14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
Rev 20:15 If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.


#2. Lifespans will be expanding but there will still be death.

Isa 65:20 “Never again will there be in it
an infant who lives but a few days,
or an old man who does not live out his years;
he who dies at a hundred
will be thought a mere youth;
he who fails to reach[fn1] a hundred
will be considered accursed.


#3. There is still sin, death and disobedience.

Zec 13:3 And if anyone still prophesies, his father and mother, to whom he was born, will say to him, ‘You must die, because you have told lies in the Lord's name.’ When he prophesies, his own parents will stab him.


and this...willfull disobedience:

Zec 14:16 Then the survivors from all the nations that have attacked Jerusalem will go up year after year to worship the King, the Lord Almighty, and to celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles.
Zec 14:17 If any of the peoples of the earth do not go up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord Almighty, they will have no rain.


#4. The devil is released at the end of the millenium and gathers some people together to fight against Jerusalem. So, undoubtedly there are people who still do not believe in God even though the Glory filled the Temple and life is better during the millenium.

Rev 20:7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison
Rev 20:8 and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth–Gog and Magog–to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore.
Rev 20:9 They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God's people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them.
Rev 20:10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.







#5. There will be sacrifices and a temple during the millenium.

Zec 14:21 Every pot in Jerusalem and Judah will be holy to the Lord Almighty, and all who come to sacrifice will take some of the pots and cook in them. And on that day there will no longer be a Canaanite[fn5] in the house of the Lord Almighty.

and this...

Ezekiel 40-48 but here is a portion:

Eze 43:26 For seven days they are to make atonement for the altar and cleanse it; thus they will dedicate it.
Eze 43:27 At the end of these days, from the eighth day on, the priests are to present your burnt offerings and fellowship offerings[fn8] on the altar. Then I will accept you, declares the Sovereign LORD.”




By the way, the reason I use scripture is because God told us the truth in His Word. Why should I speak my own words when God has spoken?
 
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RhodBerth

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Now, just hold on...no need to get angry...I was trying to demonstrate that the New Jerusalem is in heaven until it comes down at the end of the millenium.

Phew!
If that's what you meant, then I didn't understand you. I'm sorry for that.
I was really worried for a while.......... (which was most probably visible in my post )

I'll get back on the rest of your post later.
 
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HisdaughterJen

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Phew!
If that's what you meant, then I didn't understand you. I'm sorry for that.
I was really worried for a while.......... (which was most probably visible in my post )

I'll get back on the rest of your post later.
ha ha...no worries...
 
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