He doesn't want to have a "long engagement"??

seeing_glory said:

Yeah I think it's more maturity level than a set number. Some older people aren't mature and some younger people may be. The reason what he said sounded genuine to me is because he explained which I already knew, he's only ever been around either church people, who get engaged after like 6 months and then get married within another 6 months, and then there's his family who is all broken up and divorced. I don't think he really gets what's normal. He originally said that we could do it a year before he graduates school so that we're only engaged for a year. Which is when I started figuring, why not sooner and longer engagement... now he says how about within a year like next spring? Then it would be more like a 2 yr engagement..

He's definitely not as "excited" about the engagement part as I do and when I ask he says it's because there would be absolutely nothing different except a ring and that he's already committed and would be more interested in the wedding part..which is a long way off as we both know

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To men it is just a ring but to us women it's a deeper commitment.

The age thing - oh and btw the OP's BF is 26 not 22 - is something that I have always balked at. I didn't marry very young and was glad that I took my time to look around. However, my eldest son has been married almost a year now, and he was 23 and she 20 when they married. They met in high school, and other than a few glitches, they've been together ever since. Therefore, although they've only been married a year, they've been together for much longer. I see in them a lot of immaturity, even at this point, and I wasn't incredibly happy at first when they said they were getting married, but I hope and pray it will work out for them. I believe that they are determined to stay together and make their marriage work, and that matters. They both talk long term, "in 5 years" "in 10 years" and both have agreed they are not ready for children yet (which is good.) OTOH, one of my other sons recently broke up with a GF of almost 3 years, despite them both discussing marriage as a near certainty. He has determined that it is too soon to be talking about marriage (they are both 19). My husband and I are both very disappointed that they broke up, but also understand that it has to be right for my son, as well as for the girl he marries. It was perhaps too good to be true that the both guys found the ideal girl so early in life, and that it was their first real girlfriend. So, he isn't dating now, and I have told him that he probably shouldn't for a while, because he is still in college and has a long period of study ahead through to doctorate level.

I think that's where I really would draw the line when it comes to waiting for this guy. College is a time for study, and for learning about the world also. College students need to wait to marry until they have graduated - preferably with a good GPA. That is far more important at this age than marriage or engagement. I'm glad that my eldest kid held off getting engaged until he had graduated and actually had started a job, and had an income. My biggest concern about my other kid who was seriously dating was that they didn't get married now, while both are at college, as they wouldn't have any way to support themselves. Sure, as parents we help, but like most parents we have other kids to raise and support through college. When our older kids are getting married, we hope that they are able to start out in their own home and with their own lives, to relieve some of the financial burden from our shoulders.

So, while I understand the OP's concerns, I would really wait until after graduation and see what happens. If he still continues to talk engagement/marriage and not do anything concrete, then he probably never will. Then it would be time cut the losses and move on.

Teslafied said:

To men it is just a ring but to us women it's a deeper commitment.

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That's an unfair generalization. To many men, an engagement is just as important a sign of deep commitment. Your statement makes men sound shallow and women sound committed, and that's unfair to men.

As far as the ages go, no I don't think that's too young to wed if the two people are ready. Does it make sense to wait until there is a greater chance of birth defects? Those are prime child-bearing years.

Maybe its true that he brain doesn't stop developing until 25. But what happens after 25? Don't our bodies start to slowly get worse, deteriorating as we age? So I suppose you can marry someone less than 25 whose brain isn't developed, someone 25 who's brain is at his/her peak, or someone over 25, whose brain is deteriorating. If we get too picky about it, we could say only 25-year-olds should marry.

Back to the OP, if the guy is in school, he probably can't afford a decent ring anyway. He may trust her commitment to him and not be worried about losing her. Does she really have to 'lock him in' with an engagement? A year or less engagement makes sense to me. I wouldn't want to go around for years saying I was engaged without getting married. Then you'd have everyone asking you when you were getting married, not just Grandma and Aunt Sally at the family reunion, and that doesn't start until you get a little older.

I got married to Mr RPD when I was 34. First marriage, first engagement. I'd dated quite a bit and had a few longer term relationships (2-5 years). But, once Mr. RPD and I met and things started to get serious, I told him that he had a year to decide whether or not he was going to put a ring on it...no more messing around. From the beginning of the serious relationship (we were living together) to getting married was just under a year.

I don't advise getting married so young...you have a lot of living to do before you settle down. Finish school, start your career and figure out what you want out of life and a spouse...THEN proceed with an exclusive relationship and perhaps marriage.

LinkH, she is 22. I don't think that chromosomal abnormalities associated with advanced maternal age are really a factor at this point. She has at least 13 years before that risk starts to climb, and they're looking at maybe a couple more years of college. What is with you and rushing women to marry young? It's like all your posts are about how women should hurry up and have children. That's a legitimate point for someone in their thirties who has never had children and plans on it, but geez. Our culture really isn't that conducive to young, uneducated families. Women do their families a big service by being educated and employable, even if they do end up taking time off to raise their families. That's just an economic reality today.

In general I am very opposed to long engagements.
IMO it is an open door to sin sexually. It becomes very easy to say "we are going to be married eventually any way so why not?"

The level of commitment IS important. But without the full commitment of marriage itself, you will either fall into sin or set up 2+ years worth of psychological methods of avoiding sex which will most certainly come back to bite you in the backside after you get married.

If you aren't on the same page; I think it's unwise to force an engagement just to have one..... My husband and I were engaged about 8 months; just long enough to plan the wedding that we wanted; which was nice but small. Also, I had a contracted work commitment and I had to fulfill that before we could get married or else we would be a long distance married couple and neither of us wanted that. Most of my friends that bugged their boyfriends to get engaged constantly ......let's just say none of those relationships ended well.

akmom said:

LinkH, she is 22. I don't think that chromosomal abnormalities associated with advanced maternal age are really a factor at this point. She has at least 13 years before that risk starts to climb, and they're looking at maybe a couple more years of college. What is with you and rushing women to marry young? It's like all your posts are about how women should hurry up and have children. That's a legitimate point for someone in their thirties who has never had children and plans on it, but geez. Our culture really isn't that conducive to young, uneducated families. Women do their families a big service by being educated and employable, even if they do end up taking time off to raise their families. That's just an economic reality today.

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I believe these two are both wanting to finish college, and the issue is engagement, not dropping out of school.

I don't think women have to get married at 22. But it's strange to me that people think that is too young to get married. A lot of people do get married in their 30's now, even later in their 30's when the chance of birth defects is (slightly) higher. I had my first just before I turned 30. My wife was 27, and I've got four. When I was younger, I had more energy to take care of them, and so did my wife. My first was rather high-energy when he was young, so it was good that we were reasonably young.

Psalm 127:4 speaks positively about having children young:
As arrows are in the hand of a mighty man; so are children of the youth.

There is plenty of scripture showing children born to someone old are a blessing, too. I'm not against older couples having children either. Children are a blessing from the Lord.

seeing_glory,

I had some more thoughts on your post. Something I'd like to point out is that if you are just dating, you have the option of dating and marrying someone else. If another man were to propose marriage and you were to accept, you wouldn't be committing adultery against your boyfriend. Laws of boyfriend and girlfriend relationships aren't laws from God. It's just dating.

In the Old Testament, they didn't have our rather weak flimsy engagement. Once a man covenanted with a virgin's father to marry her, that was a serious commitment. He'd have to divorce her to cancel the engagement. It was like an unconsummated marriage.

If your boyfriend asks you to marry him and asks your father for her hand, that's a lot more serious than dating. I can see why that is important to you. But if he really doesn't want to do that now, give him some space. It is better for you if he does it based on his own initiative. I married a wonderful woman, but I had to struggle and wrestle through the issue of proposing. It wasn't because I did not want her or that I was afraid of being tied down or something like that. I really wanted to marry her, but I just wanted to be confident that this was the Lord's will. I had concerns that maybe I wouldn't be the right match for her for what she was called to do in life. Marriage is a life-time commitment. I didn't see marriage as just something I could throw away if it didn't work out. I wanted to hear God, to get His direction, and to make the right decision. I am glad my wife did not pressure me to propose marriage.

My wife is Indonesian. Over there, 'popping the question' is not really a part of their culture. I did the one-knee thing. It was a great moment for her. But she hadn't grown up watching other people experience that. They usually get engaged when one set of parents go meet the other and agree on the marriage. She did tell me while we were dating that if we wanted to get married this year, that we'd need several months to prepare, and how long it took to book a place for a weeding. (Weddings involve large parties over there.) But she did not pressure me.

Your boyfriend may have different concerns than I did. But I think you should give him some space and let him wrestle through whatever concerns he may have to make the big shift from being the single relatively carefree college student, to being the man whose committed to be married for the rest of his life. Proposing is his thing as a man. Women usually choose wedding dresses, flower arrangements. Much of the wedding is set up to satisfy women's desires in our culture. The man gets to propose. Let him have that without undue pressure.

I rarely agree with RedPonyDriver's posts, but I think it's reasonable if a woman in her situation is dating to say if he's serious, he's got a year to propose. But you are young and in college. If he's not ready to marry because of financial reasons, it makes sense that he may want to delay the proposal. But you could also tell him that if he hasn't proposed, then there is no commandment from God, "Thou shalt not break up with thy boyfriend." You don't have to tell him that, but I am just saying dating you don't give him any rights to you.

But I also agree with Dave W_Ohev that long engagements can result in more sexual temptation. If you've already agreed to be married (which means that are supposed to have sex later) it just might be easier to justify to yourselves going ahead and having sex.

One of the advantages, in a way, that Indonesians have in this regard is that engagement is getting parental consent. So a young man and a young woman aren't engaged if they decides they want to get married. While they are both committed to the idea, since they aren't engaged, So they will have agreed on a partner, but it may be easier for them to realize that they don't have a guaranteed partner. So it may be easier for them to realize it's wrong to abstain. And of course, they live in a culture where virginity until marriage is the norm, not this one where boyfriends and girlfriends are expected to fornicate.

Teslafied said:

Yea kind of what my husband pulled on me before I gave him an ultimatum of sorts. He wanted to find a wife yet when we dated and I brought up marriage he wanted to wait and I flat out told him that I wasn't going to wait beyond a year, I was ready to settle down.

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Saying that once early on and then maybe bringing it up every month or so is fair. A man doesn't need a woman constantly pressuring him to get married. But he also needs to realize that if he's dating a woman who wants to gt married and he doesn't want to marry, he's keeping her from her potential husband and could potentially hurt her emotionally by continuing the relationship.

Our culture has gotten really messed up when it comes to dating. Courtship rituals 150 years ago were about finding a spouse. Nowadays, young people engage in recreational dating in middle school and high school. They carry on into adulthood doing the same thing. With fornication being acceptable, most people don't see dating as primarily a means of finding a spouse.

The believer looking for a spouse would do well to clarify this to someone who wants to date to make sure both are playing by the same set of rules.

Speaking from personal experience, I was ready for engagement much earlier than my husband. At first I tried pushing it, and then realized that I didn't want to be engaged if he wasn't ready for it. He eventually proposed when he was ready and it was much better than if I forced him into it. That said, I did periodically mention it, as I didn't want to date for years just to date. He was aware that I wasn't planning to date just to date - without trying to see if he was the one I should marry.

Granted, in our situation, there were some trust issues (his ex-fiancé cheated A LOT, and my ex-boyfriend was emotionally abusive). I believe that made us both more cautious.

When he was ready to be engaged - we both were so excited to be married. Over a year after getting married - I can say that it was well worth the wait.

My advice? Don't push it, but make sure he knows that you are serious about the relationship. If you get to the end of college and he still isn't ready, evaluate if he is still the one you think is right for you. Protect yourself but also respect him. It is so much more special if he proposes when he is ready than if he proposes because you push him to do it.