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God allowing Satan to challenge Him about Job

JustAsIam77

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In the first chapter of Job:

5 And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.

6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.

7 And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

8 And the Lord said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?

9 Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?

10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.

11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face.

12 And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the Lord.

Why did God let Satan persecute Job? To what purpose? I think I know the answer & it may be in my signature.

What say you?
 

heymikey80

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In Job's case the answer may be easier. We can see Job emerged with a deeper relationship with God.

Some are tough cases. I would caution anyone not to use Job as generic. Some cases may be redeemed after the Resurrection, even. Job mentions this as a possibility, but it is clear he grows even further after making that comment.

We can become like Jobs accusers if we try to go too far, without having been through deep adversities.

Other cases are deep in God's inscrutability.

But I have seen enough crazy things happen that put the Spirit's people in opportune places as well.
 
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nobdysfool

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I've always believed that Satan is a mad dog, and God holds the leash....Satan can do only as much as God allows him to, for God's own purposes. God may allow Satan to think he has a measure of control, but only so long as God doesn't yank on that leash.
 
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Meanstreak

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Nothing happens outside of God's sovereign design. If something happens, God willed it so. Evil exists so that God can be glorified with the eventual destruction of it.

In that regard, Satan is God's devil. He is no true free agent. All the works of Satan and his demons will eventually work to glorify God.
 
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abacabb3

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This is the answer.
 
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stenerson

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The book of Job shows us God's sovereignty in all things. Over all creation, fallen and unfallen. All things work together for His purposes. He not only knew what Satan was going to do to Job. He called the meeting and more or less challenged Satan.
We also see in the book of Job that those forgiven and justified, those seen as "perfect" and "blameless" in the eyes of Christ through faith are bought into a closer relationship with Him via blessings and trials.
I also love to hear God boasting.. It's funny how He boasts concerning all the marvels and intricacies and quirks in His creation, the creation that modern day idolaters use deny His existence.
 
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moonbeam

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This conversation between Satan and his Creator must be of profound significance, as it is the most extensive dialogue recorded in scripture between God and Satan, with both parties speaking in the first person.

I have always found this particular portion of that conversation intriguing

The And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou movedst me against him, to destroy him without cause. …(Job 2:3)

It would appear (by the choice of words that the Spirit has caused to be recorded) that Satan exerted influence upon God "thou movedst me against him"

What say you ?


Regarding your signature "The deceived and the deceiver are His"

Eve was deceived…was she not ?………And by the deceiver…yes ?
 
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gord44

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Satan seems to be a servant of the Almighty. He carries out the divine will of his Creator as he does in all his tasks. In essence, Satan is an agent of God, and has no free will or independent existence.

I can't seem to find an example in the Jewish Scriptures where any angel, Satan included, ever opposes God’s will. It isn't until the New Testament where he takes on a more sinister appearance.

Interesting discussion!
 
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twin1954

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The word means to instigate or seek to influence. It in no way implies control. To understand the passage as Satan making God do what He had not already ordained and purposed is a denial of the teaching of the passage and the Scriptures as a whole.
 
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moonbeam

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The word means to instigate or seek to influence. It in no way implies control. To understand the passage as Satan making God do what He had not already ordained and purposed is a denial of the teaching of the passage and the Scriptures as a whole.


The word does mean to instigate or seek to influence with underlying connotations implying causation and evil intent.

While the use of the word does not, necessarily, imply actual control (over God)...it most certainly implies the desire (in Satan) to control the outcome of the decision yet to be made by God. And it follows necessarily than that the person who instigates the incitement, must persuade the person whom they are inciting, if they are to achieve their desired outcome. This requires a degree of control (from Satan’s perspective).

I certainly do not deny that God had purposed and ordained this conversation from before the world was made...I hold to an absolute exhaustive determinism, inclusive of every thought ever thought and the motives and actions associated with them by all and any of God’s creatures.

I believe that the Father gives Satan the very thoughts that he thinks are his own creation and the word’s he uses to frame them (along with the rest of us)

Therefore the conversation was yesterdays old news for God...though I suspect Satan must have felt elated and somewhat enamoured of his own intelligence and cunning...as he departed from the LORD’s presence to destroy Job’s possessions and cause the death of his servants and children in his attempt to elicit a curse against God from Job.

Where the scripture reads "although thou movedst me against him" I also perceive the grounds for a shifting of responsibility in regards causation to Satan, even though God ordained and purposed it, and acknowledges His active engagement to "destroy him without cause."

.
 
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twin1954

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If the bold and underlined potion is true then it appears that Satan has an Arminian view of God.
 
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moonbeam

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If the bold and underlined potion is true then it appears that Satan has an Arminian view of God.


Of course…even that was given to him by the Father.

Perhaps it helps in that it aids in the inflation of the ego and development of a prideful and boastful heart.

No one can accuse Satan of being a Calvinist and holding to a pre-eminent appreciation of God's sovereignty over all His creation.


For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
 
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abacabb3

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I am in the middle of writing a commentary on Job, we'll see where that goes...but here are my in depth comments.

 
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abacabb3

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the commentary continues:
 
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abacabb3

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Final part of commentary on this section:

 
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stenerson

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We (believers) must certainly do war with Satan and his fiery darts.
I'm not sure I would call the controversy between God and Satan a massive war.
In Job I see a infinitely wise God almost amused by a mere creatures efforts at discrediting or opposing Him.
Reminds me of the psalm concerning the conspiring kings and peoples and God sits in the Heavens laughing.
 
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