Freewill or not; a headcount

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

Which or the four options are you?

Poll coming, patience grasshopper.....

Davian · Mar 10, 2015

Ignostic Atheist + deterministic free will

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

Don't be awkward, click the closest....

Chesterton · Mar 10, 2015

Oh good, it's been 24 hours since a free will thread. We should start a new drinking game...

I'm theist free-willer.

Davian · Mar 10, 2015

Inkfingers said:
Don't be awkward, click the closest....

Polls should always have an 'other'.

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

I'm just after the poll and cannot make one without a thread...

Chesterton · Mar 10, 2015

Wait it just occurred to me that this thread is a clever joke, right? We're being asked to choose whether we can choose...?

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

Chesterton said:
Wait it just occurred to me that this thread is a clever joke, right? We're being asked to choose whether we can choose...?

Ah, no. You are asked to choose whether you can choose freely as opposed to choose as a bird chooses which bug to eat.

And, of course, you could not have done differently than you did

Chesterton · Mar 10, 2015

Inkfingers said:
Ah, no. You are asked to choose whether you can choose freely as opposed to choose as a bird chooses which bug to eat.

And, of course, you could not have done differently than you did

To "choose un-freely" would be a contradiction in terms. The poll, like life itself, would be pointless. Resistance is futile. All your base are belong to us...

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

Chesterton said:
To "choose un-freely" would be a contradiction in terms. The poll, like life itself, would be pointless. Resistance is futile. All your base are belong to us...

Not at all; animals choose but very few try to claim a worm has freewill. A choice is merely a selection.

And anyway, for a choice to be a choice it has to be driven by something or it is just random.

Oh nooooo, another freewill thread!

Back to the poll with you, now!

Chesterton · Mar 10, 2015

Inkfingers said:
Not at all; animals choose but very few try to claim a worm has freewill. A choice is merely a selection.

And you've discussed this with birds and worms often?

And anyway, for a choice to be a choice it has to be driven by something or it is just random.

Did God ever choose anything?

Oh nooooo, another freewill thread!

Back to the poll with you, now!

I like freewill threads.

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

Chesterton said:
Did God ever choose anything?

Yes.

Determinism allows for choice. It just doesn't allow for free choice - in other words, each being choses as its nature directs it to.

Freewill is just random by another name.

I like freewill threads.

Well, you can't help that.

Chesterton · Mar 10, 2015

Inkfingers said:
Yes.

Determinism allows for choice. It just doesn't allow for free choice - in other words, each being choses as its nature directs it to.

Freewill is just random by another name.

So God is controlled by physical nature?

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

Chesterton said:
So God is controlled by physical nature?

God acts as His nature directs. He is not random.

Chesterton · Mar 10, 2015

Inkfingers said:
God acts as His nature directs. He is not random.

Yes He acts as His nature directs. I'm asking if His nature is determined by physical factors, or anything other than Himself.

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

Chesterton said:
Yes He acts as His nature directs. I'm asking if His nature is determined by physical factors, or anything other than Himself.

God isn't physical. God is spirit (John 4:24).

Chesterton · Mar 10, 2015

Inkfingers said:
God isn't physical. God is spirit (John 4:24).

That means "no"? So He is sovereign, or no?

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

Chesterton said:
That means "no"? So He is sovereign, or no?

God is sovereign over all that occurs.

He is not random though; he acts in accord with His nature.

Chesterton · Mar 10, 2015

Inkfingers said:
God is sovereign over all that occurs.

He is not random though; he acts in accord with His nature.

Why do you keep mentioning randomness? The exercise of will is not equated with randomness. I'm sure you're familiar with the word logos, the principle of divine reason and creative order.

Inkfingers · Mar 10, 2015

Chesterton said:
Why do you keep mentioning randomness? The exercise of will is not equated with randomness. I'm sure you're familiar with the word logos, the principle of divine reason and creative order.

FREE will is randomness.

There is only determinism; and God acts as His nature directs.

Why do you keep asking me what is in essence the same question?

Events, and that includes choices, either happen because they are caused or they happen independently of being caused.

If they happen because they are caused, they are determined and not Free.

If they happen independently of being caused, they are random and not Will.

There is no evidence that randomness exists; everything that happens does so under cause and effect.

Thus, there is no Free Will and no Randomness.

Hence, there is only determinism, and everything acts as its nature directs.

Freewill or not; a headcount

Which are you?

Deist/Theist + believes in freewill

Deist/Theist + determinist

Atheist/Agnostic + believes in freewill

Atheist/Agnostic + determinist

Somebody's heretic

fallible

Somebody's heretic

Whats So Funny bout Peace Love and Understanding

fallible

Somebody's heretic

Whats So Funny bout Peace Love and Understanding

Somebody's heretic

Whats So Funny bout Peace Love and Understanding

Somebody's heretic

Whats So Funny bout Peace Love and Understanding

Somebody's heretic

Whats So Funny bout Peace Love and Understanding

Somebody's heretic

Whats So Funny bout Peace Love and Understanding

Somebody's heretic

Whats So Funny bout Peace Love and Understanding

Somebody's heretic

Whats So Funny bout Peace Love and Understanding

Somebody's heretic

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