• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Finding limitations in Naturalism

Status
Not open for further replies.

pjnlsn

Newbie
Jan 19, 2012
421
3
✟23,074.00
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Single
Does that not apply to your position too?

John
NZ

That it applies to something else doesn't change what it already applies to.

What you wrote was, and was described by you as, generally a combination of suggestions and the listing of things that might be the case. As such it may not matter, for suggestions are many, as well as things that "might" be the case.
 
Upvote 0

Johnnz

Senior Veteran
Site Supporter
Aug 3, 2004
14,082
1,003
84
New Zealand
✟119,551.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed

Please elaborate.

John
NZ
 
Upvote 0

Heissonear

Geochemist and Stratigrapher
Site Supporter
Dec 21, 2011
4,962
982
Lake Conroe
✟201,642.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
"Naked assertions"

Another nice try. You have exposed yourself once again, before all on this forum.

What an answer for replying to the real weaknesses of Naturalism.

The foundation of Naturalism is based on faith. Got it?

There is NO EVIDENCE that what is applied to the Scientific Method WAS NOT CREATED. Got it?

The entire foundation of Naturalism is one of trust and faith. You have built your"evidence-based" knowledge of this world from physical matter and natural properties that were created.

You have no proof otherwise.

Your inability to answer this by use of the Scientific Method is noticeable to all on this forum.

No evidence of origin forces Naturalists to walk by faith.

Enough diversion!
 
Upvote 0

KCfromNC

Regular Member
Apr 18, 2007
30,256
17,181
✟553,130.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private

When tested against reality, it works. What other justification could one hope for?

b) There is an assumption that reason is sufficient to discover and compile all that is knowable.
Is there now? I think at best there's a working conclusion that naturalism does produce knowledge. Is there any other way of generating knowledge? So far, no one has been able to demonstrate one, but that doesn't mean it is impossible - just that there's no reason to assume there is one.

But what if reason has limitations?
If a frog had wings...

Philosophers recognise the difference between fact based information and personal knowledge. Michael Polanyi has exposed the fallacy of a truly objective science, social constructivism relativises all knowledge.

This is why it is best to keep philosophers working on nonsense like this rather than letting them muck up actual science.

Maybe, at some point, science will undeniably point to a Creator? That's possible.
Talk about baseless assumptions...
 
Upvote 0

KCfromNC

Regular Member
Apr 18, 2007
30,256
17,181
✟553,130.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
Wrong origin of source of the experience.

What is the origin of my personal experience that you owe me money, and how do you know?

You have witnessed many things and did not have to make it up what you experienced.

What am I making up, and how do you know this?

You still think negative about personal experience and "God".

Just like you seem to have a negative reaction to my personal experience and your $10,000 debt to me. Funny how that works.

You have second hand experience knowledge, no firsthand understanding. You appear to never been with yourself on this subject. No honest real effort on your part to know "if" He exists.

You got all of that out of a description of my personal revelation that you owe me money? Wow.
 
Upvote 0

Heissonear

Geochemist and Stratigrapher
Site Supporter
Dec 21, 2011
4,962
982
Lake Conroe
✟201,642.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married

Nice try. You also have no proof - no evidence-based knowledge that the physical matter and natural processes of this world were not created. So you divert the subject. This happens to be about Naturalism and ITS LIMITATIONS.
 
Upvote 0

Heissonear

Geochemist and Stratigrapher
Site Supporter
Dec 21, 2011
4,962
982
Lake Conroe
✟201,642.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married

What an answer to the weaknesses of Naturalism.

It is interesting what Naturalists resort to without having evidence.

There is no evidence that what you apply the Scientific Method to WAS NOT CREATED.

You have built your "evidence-based" knowledge of this world from physical matter and natural properties that were created.

You have no proof that this physical realm was not created.

Your inability to answer this by use of the Scientific Method is obvious.

Enough diversion. This is about Naturalists and Naturalism. Got it?
 
Upvote 0

Heissonear

Geochemist and Stratigrapher
Site Supporter
Dec 21, 2011
4,962
982
Lake Conroe
✟201,642.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
"Naked assertions"

Another nice try. You have exposed yourself once again, before all on this forum.

What an answer for replying to the real weaknesses of Naturalism.

The foundation of Naturalism is based on faith. Got it?

There is NO EVIDENCE that what is applied to the Scientific Method WAS NOT CREATED. Got it?

The entire foundation of Naturalism is one of trust and faith. You have built your"evidence-based" knowledge of this world from physical matter and natural properties that were created.

You have no proof otherwise.

Your inability to answer this by use of the Scientific Method is noticeable to all on this forum.

No evidence of origin forces Naturalists to walk by faith.

Enough diversion!
 
Upvote 0

BarryDesborough

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2010
1,150
17
France
✟1,473.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
Nice try. You also have no proof - no evidence-based knowledge that the physical matter and natural processes of this world were not created. So you divert the subject. This happens to be about Naturalism and ITS LIMITATIONS.
Your crowing is just empty noise without proof yourself. It's somewhat irritating too. Bzzzt! Bzzzt!
 
Upvote 0

BarryDesborough

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2010
1,150
17
France
✟1,473.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
Isn't this exactly the same as another recent post of yours? What's the matter? Not getting enough attention?

And please use the quote feature consistently. For some reason, this thread will only come up for me in linear mode. Without quotes, it's hard to see who is responding to whom. Thank you.
 
Upvote 0

Heissonear

Geochemist and Stratigrapher
Site Supporter
Dec 21, 2011
4,962
982
Lake Conroe
✟201,642.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Your crowing is just empty noise without proof yourself. It's somewhat irratating too. Bzzzt! Bzzzt!

This is about Naturalism and its weaknesses.

There is no evidence that what is applied to the Scientific Method WAS NOT CREATED. You have no proof to indicate otherwise. Your inability to answer this by use of the Scientific Method is noticeable to all. Got it?
 
Upvote 0

Heissonear

Geochemist and Stratigrapher
Site Supporter
Dec 21, 2011
4,962
982
Lake Conroe
✟201,642.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married

Enough diversion! Naturalism is based on faith. No evidence of origin forces Naturalists to walk by trust and faith. Got it?
 
Upvote 0

BarryDesborough

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2010
1,150
17
France
✟1,473.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
Its "weakness" is relative.

There's stuff we don't know. So what? There is a lot less we don't know than when the scientific method first emerged. What has Unnaturalism accomplished?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

BarryDesborough

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2010
1,150
17
France
✟1,473.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
Enough diversion! Naturalism is based on faith. No evidence of origin forces Naturalists to walk by trust and faith. Got it?
Are you a 'bot? Might just as well be...

If there's no evidence of origin forces, there's no evidence of origin forces. There. Happy now? Going to stop your meaningless bleating?
 
Upvote 0

Tomk80

Titleless
Apr 27, 2004
11,570
429
45
Maastricht
Visit site
✟36,582.00
Faith
Agnostic
Enough diversion! Naturalism is based on faith. No evidence of origin forces Naturalists to walk by trust and faith. Got it?

You seem to be under the impression that repeating your assertions over and over again makes them true. Unfortunately for you, your impression in incorrect.
 
Upvote 0

Heissonear

Geochemist and Stratigrapher
Site Supporter
Dec 21, 2011
4,962
982
Lake Conroe
✟201,642.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
 
Upvote 0

Heissonear

Geochemist and Stratigrapher
Site Supporter
Dec 21, 2011
4,962
982
Lake Conroe
✟201,642.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You seem to be under the impression that repeating your assertions over and over again makes them true. Unfortunately for you, your impression in incorrect.

Tom,

This is about the limitations of Naturalism.

You do not have EVIDENCE of the origin of this physical realm. No EVIDENCE that the physical matter WAS NOT CREATED. Zero.

Your response of "assertion" is EXTREMELY WEAK. You do no provide EVIDENCE THAT IS BASED ON THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD.

Your inability to answer this by use of the Scientific Method is noticeable to all.

No evidence of origin FORCES Naturalists to walk by faith. The foundation of Naturalism is based on faith. Got it?
 
Upvote 0

BarryDesborough

Well-Known Member
Jul 11, 2010
1,150
17
France
✟1,473.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
You really are becoming quite a pain. I have no evidence that Russell's Celestial Teapot does not exist either. And none that it does. Neither do you. Enough of this drivel. I've got better things to do, even if you haven't.
 
Reactions: Split Rock
Upvote 0

Heissonear

Geochemist and Stratigrapher
Site Supporter
Dec 21, 2011
4,962
982
Lake Conroe
✟201,642.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Are you a 'bot? Might just as well be...

If there's no evidence of origin forces, there's no evidence of origin forces. There. Happy now? Going to stop your meaningless bleating?

"Meaningless bleating"? No evidence of origin FORCES Naturalists to walk by faith. Got it?
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.