Doctrine of Impartation

Citizen of the Kingdom · May 26, 2008

The Lord is my banner said:
Simon the sorceror, a pagan magician, not Simon Peter the Lord's disciple, is the one who offered money for the gift he saw the apostles using.

Actually the facts are that he was a former sorceror who had become a believer that was also baptised. He was seeking the anointing of the Spirit and had suggested monetary means of aquiring it rather than seeking it as a free gift of grace. The believers in that area had recieved the infilling of the Spirit (downpayment) but not the power of the Spirit, which the disciples layed hands on them as the means of aquiring that. I believe it was a proof of the power to come to them for their outflowing but they already had the gift of impartation of the Spirit.

JimB · May 26, 2008

So, we get our words (and sometimes people’s names) mixed up from time to time. We just need to practice a little patience mixed with a good deal of grace.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=h_BWzQW8pWE

~Jim

It has taken me all my life to understand that I don’t have to understand everything.

imperfectchristian · May 26, 2008

Jimbeaux said:
So, we get our words (and sometimes peoples) mixed up from time to time. We just need to practice a little patience mixed with a good deal of grace.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=h_BWzQW8pWE

~Jim

It has taken me all my life to understand that I dont have to understand everything.

Oh goodness...

Citizen of the Kingdom · May 26, 2008

t1wGl said:
I was ignoring it.

willful ignorance is no excuse

imperfectchristian · May 26, 2008

Evangelica said:
willful ignorance is no excuse

ignore, ignore, ignore...lalalalalalala...did you say something?

Citizen of the Kingdom · May 26, 2008

nay, I'll just shut it down

GothPuppet · May 26, 2008

Jimbeaux said:
I keep hearing about the "doctrine of impartation." Apparently it is a new doctrine. Can someone tell us, from your understanding, just what the Doctrine of Impartation actually is?

Do you believe in it? Why? Why not?

~Jim

Whenever you are asked if you can do a job, tell them "Certainly I can!"

and get busy and find out how to do it. ~Theodore Roosevelt

The "Doctrine Of Impartation" is the title of the new book you can buy until the publisher can come up with yet another translation of the Bible to sell you.

GothPuppet · May 26, 2008

justsurfing said:
I am a Spirit-filled believer who was born-again in a full face to face salvation with the Lord. The Lord uses me in the gift of impartation. The Lord uses me in the gift of impartation in that, for example, I can read the Bible out loud to people and they can receive impartation of my doctrinal understanding without me teaching or speaking anything but the Word -- which is a gift of impartation.

Since you started the thread on the gift in which the Lord uses me, I thought I'd join the thread.

Grace and peace.

Max McLean must have that same gift, cause I listen to him reading the Bible on my computer every day and he (not the Holy Spirit, apparently) imparts to me the Word of God.

Elijah2 · May 26, 2008

Evangelica said:
Well, it hasn't happened yet and the Lord is the watchman in these end days.

Boy, if you have been to some churches that I've been to, then I would begin to wonder. Many of them were like dry bones.

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

Elijah2 · May 26, 2008

Jimbeaux said:
I can agree with this kind of impartation.

But what I am talking about is the kind of impartation when a person lays their hands on someone to impart from one to another a calling, or spiritual gift, or anointing. This seems to be counter to my understanding of NT Christianity in that it presumes on the part of the impart-er a special calling/gifting/anointing that they can impart at will to the impart-ee. That smacks of spiritual pride to me, especially when it is done with an audience.

~Jim

If the first step in an argument is wrong everything that follows is wrong.

~C.S. Lewis, The Problem of Pain

Hi Jim,

There are only two verses in His Word that speaks of "impart", and nothing about what you want to know.

What the other poster said about impartation from those revivalist churches is the impartation of their words and beliefs, and I have seen that before, but those words and beliefs were false, and dangerous.

As I said in my boring long posting, there is NO Scriptural evidence of laying-on-of-hands by members of His flock. Have a read of my posting.

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

Elijah2 · May 26, 2008

Jimbeaux said:
I understand.

What I have in mind, though, is a specific incident (which will go unmentioned) of one well-known minister publicly imparting his special anointing to another well-known minister.

~Jim

Ignorance is not innocence; it is a crime.

Well this does happen, but more sor in the family as the father passes his mantle down to his son, when his time has come.

So I guess that this well-know minister was on his way out, and was passing on his mantle to the person who is following him, is that correct.

Otherwise if it was just one of those charismatic passing on, then we need to test the spirits, whether they are Holy or unholy?

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

Elijah2 · May 26, 2008

Evangelica said:
It pains me to disagree with this, but the apostles felt they needed to lay hands on new believers placed in atalics in the bible. This is still a contraversial topic as it implies that more is needed than the working of the Holy Spirit. In fact the apostles brought out this very thing when they accused Simon the magician turned new baptised Christian. They cursed that anyone would try to that and yet that's exactly what they were doing.

btw it wasn't Peter it was Simon (not the same)

I'm only quoting Scriptures, and it doesn't cause me any pain, because I agree with it. Sorry that you feel this pain, and that the Holy Spirit will take it from you.

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

Elijah2 · May 26, 2008

Evangelica said:
Originally Posted by Elijah2

The ability to impart, to share, to give charismatic gifts was the sole realm of an Apostle. We see Philip preaching to the Samaritans but when the time came fro them to receive the Holy Spirit, Philip had to allow Peter to do this ministry by saying, Give me this power also, that anyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit. But Peter said to him, Your money perish with you, because you thought that the gift of God could be purchased with money! You have neither part nor portion in this matter, for your heart is not right in the sight of God. Repent therefore of this your wickedness, and pray God if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you (Acts 8:19-22).

From this we can see that Philip wasnt an Apostle, he was being presumptuous, and he thought that he could buy this ability.

It really annoys me when people fabricate things to make some point. That is lying and false teaching. That was not said to Phillip at all. I'm not saying anymore b/c it seems to be acceptable to everyone else to fabricate scripture. Facts are facts but that's just bs./

Sorry that you have accused me of being a liar and false, but what I posted is the exact Scriptures from the NKJV.

Therefore, show me where I am lying, or I have misunderstood those Scriptures.

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

Citizen of the Kingdom · May 26, 2008

Let's just say you got the names mixed up. Shouldn't have called it lying since it could have been an honest mistake. It's better not to think you can read someone's mind as to content of thought that goes into things said.

Citizen of the Kingdom · May 26, 2008

cyberlizard · May 27, 2008

i briefly made a post this morning (before going to work)..... i said i would look at a few things.

is there a doctrine of impartation.... i think there is, depending on how you see things.

i would say there are the following aspects.... impartation, ordination, identification.

here are some scriptures....

Exodus 29v10 - the consecration and ordination of the priest. The priest was appointed into a specific office by the laying on of hands. See also 1 Tim. 4v14 where Timothy is encouraged regarding his gifting into his office/calling.

Lev. 4v15 - Identification. Hands were laid on a bull in transference of sin(s). This is a form of identification. See also 1 Tim. 5v22, this one is an interesting one. It says basically that you should be wary of whom you lay hands on, and also who lays hands on you. This text draws heavily on OT passages whereby a state of uncleaness can be transferred between people (this is difficult for some anti-law people to accept). There is also an interesting snippet in Num. 8v10 where the people lay hands on the levites, transferring their sins, who then laid hands on the sacrifice transferring it there, this is interesting as it shows a 'chain of contamination. The converse is true though, but there is only evidence of this really applying to Messiah. Where he touches a woman in a state of being unclean, rendering her (ceremonially, socially and physically) clean by his own power (this is not a laying on of hands per se' but a contact based transfer).

Num. 27v23/Deut. 34v9 - here Moses lays hands on Joshua in the impartation of a blessing. We see the impartation of a blessing in Matt. 19v13 & Luke 18v35.

There are loads of verses, but these are first instance verses (OT).

So next time you lay hands on someone, think before you do it. The scriptures say be holy as I am holy. Walk a holy life, do not become polluted by contact (like with the dead, thinking OT style).

for those wanting to know more about Jewish ideas on this subject, simply google 'semichah' (there are various spellings)

Steve

Elijah2 · May 27, 2008

Evangelica said:
Let's just say you got the names mixed up. Shouldn't have called it lying since it could have been an honest mistake. It's better not to think you can read someone's mind as to content of thought that goes into things said.

Well E, you did accuse me of fabricating, then lying and then false teaching. Yep, I made in error with their names, but it doesn't change the principle of my belief, whoever names they should be. By the way, what does b/c mean, and bs???

It really annoys me when people fabricate things to make some point. That is lying and false teaching. That was not said to Phillip at all. I'm not saying anymore b/c it seems to be acceptable to everyone else to fabricate scripture. Facts are facts but that's just bs./

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

Citizen of the Kingdom · May 27, 2008

let's just avoid the report=go=round and put each other on ignor, ok

JudgeDeborah2 · May 27, 2008

The Bible is full of 'impartation'. One I will share is Moses praying for and laying hands on Joshua. There are many others, but I will let some just shoot this one down.

JimB · May 27, 2008

JudgeDeborah2 said:
The Bible is full of 'impartation'. One I will share is Moses praying for and laying hands on Joshua. There are many others, but I will let some just shoot this one down.

Was that “impartation” or a ceremony? I say it was a ceremony to publicly and officially transfer leadership to Joshua like they still do today in corporations. I think it’s call installation ceremonies.

~Jim

It has taken me all my life to understand that I don’t have to understand everything.

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