Dennis Prager's Are You A Liberal Quiz?

fragmentsofdreams · Aug 17, 2004

La Bonita Zorilla said:
Jesus Christ is a liberal.

I think Jesus transcends labels such as liberal or conservative. Labeling him as one or the other will capture some of what he is, but it will also associate with many things that he is not.

Anastasis · Aug 17, 2004

Now, now - Sharp is just trying to put all Liberals in a box so he can try to understand them.

Which is fine with me - because if I'm in a box I don't have to go to work.

*puts self in box*

Now if only CaDan will bring the Ice Cream we can have a party in here.

UberLutheran · Aug 17, 2004

Next question: what, specifically, are we getting from this kind of manipulation? There has to be some sort of incentive for people to keep posting responses to someone who keeps throwing verbal Molotov cocktails.

seebs · Aug 17, 2004

Well, it's simple. We're responding so the lurkers see the truth.

Loki · Aug 17, 2004

Pinata, I commend you for taking the time to knock down those straw men.

I don't really see what liberal politics has to do with liberal christianity. One of the most devout Catholics I know votes liberal. There appear to be liberal Christians here who are politically conservative.

Hey, I can bring tomato sandwiches and a pot of Earl Grey to the box. We should have a regular ol' party!

Victorian Rose · Aug 17, 2004

Why not just ignore him?

seebs · Aug 17, 2004

Rainbow Rose said:
Why not just ignore him?

Because the lurkers might otherwise be misled.

Sharp · Aug 17, 2004

seebs said:
If he's banned, how will he learn anything?

Thanks Peter. I know I can usually count upon you to speak up for real dialog. And, yes, I have certainly learned from discussions here already and from you in particular, as I sincerely hope others have learned from what I had to share.

I don't insult, post nonsense or spam, or use rudeness or reply to the same. My posts are honest and I do reply and engage in dialog.

I also reply to my personal mail. Perhaps that is where some posters should direct their ire. I suspect some liberals are not accustomed to having their views challenged or contradicted. They are usually the ones eager to censor conservatives.

The Liberal Theology forum is under the Discussion and Debate general forum. One need not be a Liberal to participate, and one need not agree with Liberal Theology to discuss it, else how would we ever discuss and debate? That would be as ludicrous as separating the politics forum into democrat and republican halves.

My wording is biased but respectful. I really appreciate Pinata's effort to actually answer the survey. I was so impressed that I emailed the answers to Dennis Prager. Thanks for helping.

Lastly I don't read or post here everyday. Sometimes depending upon work and family I am unable to visit for three days. Please don't be offended if I don't reply immediately to anyone. No disrespect.

Sharp · Aug 17, 2004

Rainbow Rose said:
Why not just ignore him?

Why not take the test yourself and see your myths / beliefs challenged? That takes intellectual courage to risk having what you believe questioned.

If the topic is of no interest to you, do what the Tony Soprano advises: "Furgedabouddit!" There are some of us, however, who choose to question liberalism's hold on truth. No one is compelling you to participate.

But first one last burning question which only you can answer.
SchmoopsiePoo? No wait! Don't tell me. I don't think I can take the explaination this late.

seebs · Aug 17, 2004

Sharp said:
Thanks Peter. I know I can usually count upon you to speak up for real dialog. And, yes, I have certainly learned from discussions here already and from you in particular, as I sincerely hope others have learned from what I had to share.

Indeed.

That said... I really think you should maybe listen a little more, and talk a little less, because you've made it very clear that you know next to nothing about the actual beliefs of liberals; you're going off of what conservatives say about them, and it's just as frustrating coming from you as Roz's constant slams on "fundagelicals" were coming from him.

Slow down a little, ask some questions with a little more asking and a little less accusing in the tone, and I think you'll find that many of us are good old-fashioned Jesus Freaks, just focusing on a different part of the Great Commission than you are.

Sharp · Aug 17, 2004

Karl - Liberal Backslider said:
I disagree, Seebs. Sharp has no interest in two-way debate or discussion. His reason for being here is simply to rubbish people he disagrees with.

Not at all. I intend to warn off conservatives who wrongly believe they are liberals. Many more people read these posts than reply. Many Bible-believers are uncomfortable with trends in their liberal churches and know something isn't right. They are ready for change, and I am pleased to be a humble player on God's team providing the encouragement they need.

Why not discuss the substantive issues. Dennis Prager's list contains 23 assertions suitable for debate. Or why not post your own questionairre?

He needs a spell sitting on the naughty stair in my view.

Oh no, not that! "Please," Br'er Rabbit says, "don't send me into the briar patch."

CaDan · Aug 17, 2004

Sharp said:
Why not take the test yourself and see your myths / beliefs challenged? That takes intellectual courage to risk having what you believe questioned.

If the topic is of no interest to you, do what the Tony Soprano advises: "Furgedabouddit!" There are some of us, however, who choose to question liberalism's hold on truth. No one is compelling you to participate.

But first one last burning question which only you can answer.
SchmoopsiePoo? No wait! Don't tell me. I don't think I can take the explaination this late.

Here's the problem: It's not a "quiz"--it is a poorly disguised polemic. It is full of false dilemnas and complex questions. I will not dignify it by treating it as a "quiz" or "test".

seebs · Aug 17, 2004

The problem, Sharp, is that Prager's list is a willful strawman, carefully crafted as an attack to drive people away from the word "liberal".

Look at it this way.

Imagine, if you will, that a proselytizing atheist were to post "Randi's list of questions to see if you're a real Christian", and it had things on it like:

4. Do you believe that gay people should be summarily executed by anyone who discovers them?

and

18. Do you believe that God loves you, but hates most people?

...

Would you, at some point, say "hang on, this is not a true description of Christianity, this is a straw man", and choose to act to reassert your claim on the term, rather than shuffling away saying "I guess I was never a real Christian, because I can't hold with most of that stuff"?

We are the real liberals. You can tell 'cuz people hate us for being liberal, and you can tell because we match up nicely with real live dictionary definitions. We hang out with sinners, we listen to music that many people think is unacceptable... And we praise God with everything we do, all the time.

So... Prager is about as qualified to tell me what a "real" liberal is as Roz was to tell us all what a "real" Conservative is. Did you know that, if you don't support removing all workplace protections in the aim of increasing profit for CEOs, you're not a "real" conservative? I didn't either, and I've been told, and I still don't know it, 'cuz it ain't so.

Also, be aware of the distinction between a liberal approach to disagreement, and liberal positions. Many liberals hold conservative positions. There are a number of points on which my personal moral standards are much, much, much stricter than those of the majority of the conservatives I've ever met; it's just that, unlike them, I don't think it's my job to convict people in their sins.

tulc · Aug 17, 2004

You say you are a liberal.

Do you believe the following?

1 Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be lowered for people of color.
no
2 Bilingual education for children of immigrants, rather than immersion in English, is good for them and for America.
yes
3 Murderers should never be put to death.
yes
4 During the Cold War, America should have adopted a nuclear arms freeze.
yes
5 Colleges should not allow ROTC programs.
no
6 It was wrong to wage war against Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War.
the first one no, the second one yes
7 Poor parents should not be allowed to have vouchers to send their children to private schools.
?
8 It is good that trial lawyers and teachers unions are the two biggest contributors to the Democratic Party.
yes
9 Marriage should be redefined from male-female to any two people.
yes
10 A married couple should not have more of a right to adopt a child than two men or two women.
no
11 The Boy Scouts should not be allowed to use parks or any other public places and should be prohibited from using churches and synagogues for their meetings.
yes and no
12 The present high tax rates are good.
yes
13 Speech codes on college campuses are good and American values.
?
14 The Israelis and Palestinians are morally equivalent.
yes
15 The United Nations is a moral force for good in the world, and therefore America should be subservient to it and such international institutions as a world court.
yes and no
16 It is good that colleges have dropped hundreds of men's sports teams in order to meet gender-based quotas.
yes
17 No abortions can be labeled immoral.
no
18 Restaurants should be prohibited by law from allowing customers to choose between a smoking and a non-smoking section.
no
19 High schools should make condoms available to students and teach them how to use them.
yes
20 Racial profiling for terrorists is wrong -- a white American grandmother should as likely be searched as a Saudi young male.
yes
21 Racism and poverty -- not a lack of fathers and a crisis of values -- are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.
yes
22 It is wrong and unconstitutional for students to be told, "God bless you" at their graduation.
no
23 No culture is morally superior to any other.
yes
Those are all liberal positions. How many of them do you hold?
15 yes 9 no so does that make me semi-liberal? half saved? quasi-ok?
tulc(I heard there was ice cream!)

Sharp · Aug 17, 2004

fragmentsofdreams said:
I love that little guy. So happy and bouncy.

I think we need a .

Yep, cute, isn't he?

Anyway I just saw Pinata's answers and was impressed enough to forward them to <self-censored> (You can get the email address to which to reply to Dennis simply by clicking on the CONTACT US icon on his website. See the original post for the Dennis Prager website.)

This is not Dennis Prager's email. It is the email address of the radio production office and is listed on his website for contacting the program.
He asked for feedback about his liberal questionaire. Feel free to send him your helpful suggestions. Treat Dennis Prager with the same respect you accorded me.

I do read all the replies to my posts. I don't always reply to all messages, and sometimes it is not convenient to go online for days. And yeah, the little priest is cute.

Sharp · Aug 17, 2004

UberLutheran said:
Next question: what, specifically, are we getting from this kind of manipulation? There has to be some sort of incentive for people to keep posting responses to someone who keeps throwing verbal Molotov cocktails.

Are you feeling manipulated? Really? Is it too much to suppose that some of your fellow posters might actually be interested in a discussion of liberalism (theology)?

You need not participate if you feel uninclined. But please don't spoil it for the rest of us. Oh and I do read all replies, but I may not be able to reply daily. Sorry. If you want to engage in civil dialog, feel free to join in. Thanks for courtesy should you choose to reply.

Trivia Fact: Did you know the name of Walt Disney's first cartoon business partner was Ub Iwerks? I thought of that when I read Uber. Maybe he was German and Ub is a nickname for Uber meaning 'hyper' or 'over'. That does it. I am going to bed. Later, dudes.

redheadmt · Aug 17, 2004

Actually, I know a lot of people in "real life" who remind me of Sharp. To them, it's all about judgements and proving themselves to be superior Christians. They believe that they are in an exclusive "club" and spend most of their time pointing out why almost all other people are not worthy of being in their "club."

Seeing really impressive, intelligent responses to Sharp's posts that voice how I feel and even give me new perspectives about Christianity, has been quite helpful. In other words, Sharp's stereotypical Christian intolerance, and the awesome responses in this forum have been great food for thought. Thank you!

CaDan · Aug 17, 2004

redheadmt said:
Actually, I know a lot of people in "real life" who remind me of Sharp. To them, it's all about judgements and proving themselves to be superior Christians. They believe that they are in an exclusive "club" and spend most of their time pointing out why almost all other people are not worthy of being in their "club."

Seeing really impressive, intelligent responses to Sharp's posts that voice how I feel and even give me new perspectives about Christianity, has been quite helpful. In other words, Sharp's stereotypical Christian intolerance, and the awesome responses in this forum have been great food for thought. Thank you!

We try.

CaDan · Aug 17, 2004

Sharp said:
Are you feeling manipulated? Really? Is it too much to suppose that some of your fellow posters might actually be interested in a discussion of liberalism (theology)?

I am uninterested in defending a straw man. Would you like to present a proposition to debate? The only one I see in this thread is that some who call themselves "liberals" may not ascribe to all the beliefs a certain "Prager" assigns to them.

Wow.

What a silly proposition. OF COURSE not all liberals hold those beliefs! Of course, since your list of beliefs is filled with false dilemnas, complex questions, and various shibboleths and undefined terms, the results of any such quiz would be not only statistically unreliable, but misleading.

How about some ice cream?

fragmentsofdreams · Aug 17, 2004

CaDan said:
We could get very silly with that very quickly--to the point where we could SERIOUSLY offend people. (But I still like to imagine it!). Suffice to say there would be a lot of REALLY FAT Catholics!

I'll stop there.

Daily Ice Cream Socials!!!!

Dennis Prager's Are You A Liberal Quiz?

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