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Dead Sea Scrolls - Question of importance!

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français

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Hello,

I was wondering.. Do the Dead Sea Scrolls affirm the Mesoretic Text more, or the Septuagint?

I have heard that whenever The Mesoretic is in conflict with the Septuagint, that 95% of the time the Septuagint is in conflict with the DSS (meaning that the Mesoretic and DSS are more similar then the Septuagint.) But, then there are Orthodox sites that say the opposite, that the Septuigant is closer to the DSS then the DSS is to the Mesoretic. So I am confused..

Any good Biblical fundie know the answer?!

Also, one more question.. Why was the Tanakh not preserved, as god promised in the Torah? If it was, then there would not be 6,000 differences between the Septuagint and the MT!!
 

disasm

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Fr. John Whiteford wrote this on his blog:


site: http://fatherjohn.blogspot.com/2006_08_01_archive.html
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Interesting. I used this fairly good Hebrew/English interlinear word for word and here is how it appears:

http://www.scripture4all.org/

1 Samuel 14:41 And Sha'uwl is saying to YHWH, Elohiym of Yisra'el, "grant perfect/whole/tamiym 08549", and is being seized Yownathan and-Sha'uwl and the people are going forth.

08549 tamiym {taw-meem'} from 08552; TWOT - 2522d; adj
AV - without blemish 44, perfect 18, upright 8, without spot 6,
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Hi. I do not really trust the Septuagint if it tries to "shoehorn" a translation to harmonizie the Greek NT to the Hebrew OT.

I gererally go by the Tex-Rec or Byzantine Majority Greek texts, as I feel those are fairly accurate Greek MSS. Just my most humble view.

http://www.olivetree.com/cgi-bin/EnglishBible.htm

Acts 7:43 And ye took up the booth/tabernacle of the Moloch, and the star of the god of ye Rephan, of the figures ye made to worship them: And I shall be exiling ye beyond of-Babylon.

[Tex-Rec] Acts 7:43 kai <2532> {AND} anelabete <353> (5627) {YET TOOK UP} thn <3588> {THE} skhnhn <4633> {BOOTH/TABERNACLE} tou <3588> {OF THE} moloc <3434> {MOLOCH,} kai <2532> {AND} to <3588> {THE} astron <798> {STAR} tou <3588> {OF THE} qeou <2316> {GOD} umwn <5216> {OF YE} remfan <4481> {REMPHAN,} touV <3588> {OF THE} tupouV <5179> {MODELS} ouV <3739> {WHICH} epoihsate <4160> (5656) {YE MAKE} proskunein <4352> (5721) {TO WORSHIP} autoiV <846> {THEM;} kai <2532> {AND} metoikiw <3351> (5692) {I WILL REMOVE} umaV <5209> {YOU} epekeina <1900> {BEYOND} babulwnoV <897> {BABYLON.}

Amos 5:26 And you bore booth of king of you and pedastal/03594 Kiyuwn of images of you, star of Elohiym of you, which you made to you,
27 and I deport you from beyond to Dammeseq He says, YHWH, Elohiym of hosts, name of Him.

04428 melek {meh'-lek}
from 04427; TWOT - 1199a; n m
AV - king 2518, royal 2, Hammelech 1, Malcham 1, Moloch 1; 2523
1) king
03594 Kiyuwn {kee-yoon'} from 03559;; n pr dei
Chiun = "an image" or "pillar"
1) probably a statue of the Assyrian-Babylonian god of the planet
Saturn and used to symbolise Israelite apostasy
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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français;39772908 said:
Hello,

I was wondering.. Do the Dead Sea Scrolls affirm the Mesoretic Text more, or the Septuagint? ...........

......Any good Biblical fundie know the answer?!
Hey francais. Weren't you one of those before you became an atheist? I still remember you giving the Muslims a run for their money awhile back.

http://foru.ms/t6186100-why-arent-you-a-christian.html
 
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français

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Hey littlelamb - Yes, I am an atheist! But, I still am fascinated by Biblical history and all. And I am trying to see is the Maseretic Text is more hand in hand with the DSS then the Septuigant.

From the one article by the Priest, they lean towards the Septuagint. But, I have seen many sites that say that the Maseretic and the DSS are a lot closer then the Septuigant(LXX) and the DSS. So, I see some contradicting answers here and there. It is interesting.

I think all can agree that the hebrew Maseretic Text is definetely ancient, because the style is written in ancient styles (and in different time periods, as the Documentary Hypothesis holds.) So I think there is a lot of authenticity in that, but who knows!
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Thanks for that respectful response. I am really ignorant on the different MSS of the Greek and Hebrew. I just love reading the Bible, though I now prefer more literal word-for-word reading of it.

Anyway, glad to see ya again and hope to see more of ya on the NCR board with those pesky Muslims!!

Here is good Hebrew study site along with links to many others if you are interested.

http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/
 
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disasm

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Ancient as in when? The most recent copy we have is from the 11th century AD, isn't it? The Septuagint was translated in the BC era. Which one is more ancient? In addition, as it notes in the article, all the quotes from the OT in the Textus Receptus and Byzantine Majority Text are quoted from the Septuagint. They don't always line up with the Masoretic Text.

Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me the sinner.
 
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français

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Thanks for the link! I will check it out!

For the most part, the Maseretic Text(Hebrew) is the same as the LXX(Greek version.) There are however some changes here and there. However, very few are significant to classify as a "corruption" or such.

The oldest copy of the Maseretic Text that we have is from a late date, yes. However, that does not mean that it did not exist before.

Looking at the style of the Hebrew in the Torah, it was significantly different then that of the 11th Century. This proves that the Meseretic was not just made up in the 11th century. It had always existed. We know that people like the RamBam, who was born in 1135, wrote an entire commentary on the Torah. The Torah he quotes is word for word the same as that today. Same with the excellent scholar Rashi.

Now it is true that Jesus quoted from the LXX, and we can tell by how some of what he quotes is different from the Maseretic, but consistent with the LXX. However, there are other times when the author quoted the verse, but it lines up with the Maseretic and not the LXX. I saw a list yesterday, and if you want I can fetch it up for you.
 
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français

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After doing a bit of research, I found this..

What that basically means is this.. Where there are differences between the Masaoretic and the Septuigant, there are also differences between the Septuigant and the DSS.. Hence, it is saying that the Masaeretic is more authentic then the Septuigant!!


Conclusion: The vast majority of texts agree with the Masoretic over the Septuigant.
 
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