Dad Arrested for Taking Tween Daughter's Phone

PreachersWife2004 · Jan 28, 2016

Stanfordella said:
I read the article yesterday and felt that it was shoddily written with a clickbait title, but ultimately a worthwhile read for me because it renewed the profound gratitude I have for my amicably divorced parents. Any molecule of compassion towards the father evaporated when I read that he had terminated his relationship with his daughter because of the situation. There is absolutely nothing that would ever lead my parents (or my stepparents) to contemplate for a nanosecond severing their ties with me or my siblings. It is sacred to all of us. They certainly would not jeopardize it over a disciplinary lesson or a material object. We are far more valuable than that. You are precisely right that it was about a power play between divorced parents. I think the punishment perhaps was genuine and warranted initially, but merely became thinly veiled guise. Both parents were responsible for the grotesquely disproportionate escalation, and their mutual egocentricity.

Over the years there have been numerous times when possessions were confiscated by one of my parents when another had purchased the item. They always simply explained the reason for the punishment and gave the item to the other parent when custody was exchanged. The majority of the time that parent then enforced whatever consequence had been given. They resolved any conflict or disputes privately, and then presented a united front to us. This wasn't just about respect between them, but a desire for us to have stability, a refined moral compass, and respect for all of them. It's much harder for a kid to respect their parent's authority when the other parent demeans it.

You are very blessed to have this type of situation. Many kids aren't, and are used as pawns against their exes.

I believe the mom was/is doing just that.

He could have returned the phone to the mother rather than to his daughter since it was actually the mother's possession. Since the parents clearly were not cooperative with one another she likely would not have upheld his punishment while the daughter was with him, but when she returned to his home he could have taken it away again for the duration of the stay if he felt she still needed to learn a lesson about the text. Any positive lesson that was to be taught by confiscating the phone was then canceled out by the series of subsequent negative lessons (abysmal conflict resolution, keeping a possession that doesn't belong to you).

My son bought his own XBox when he was 17 and still lived at home. I've confiscated that thing a few times, and every time it was indefinitely. He bought it, sure, but it was in my house, under my roof, using my resources. Had he moved out while it was confiscated, he wouldn't have taken it with him.

I get the feeling, given this women's petty reaction, that had the father given her the phone back, she would've given it to the daughter and mocked the father somehow. I just get a vibe from everything I've read that she's the one causing the turmoil. This was two years in the running, and no sane person calls the police for a phone.

Out of curiosity, how would you react if the price point was higher than that of the phone? Where is the line drawn? As an example, last August my stepdad took away my car that my dad had bought for me. He simply gave the keys to my dad, who then kept them from me for the agreed upon time. I thought it was ridiculous overkill but at least there wasn't a feud between them, and my relationship with each remained sturdy. What if my stepdad and mom had decided to just indefinitely keep my car that my dad had bought, despite his protests? Would that be acceptable to you?

Depends on the why. You say it was overkill. Overkill for what?

PreachersWife2004 · Jan 28, 2016

Xalith said:
I'm curious of what the "inappropriate text" was.

That could be anything from swearing to sexting.

If the latter... yeah, I think the dad was justified.

I believe most of the sources said that she was being mean to someone else, or being rude to a woman or something like that. Let me see if I can verify that.

PreachersWife2004 · Jan 28, 2016

Meh, most of them just say "rude and inappropriate texts". Someone commented that the texts were arranging a beatdown after school for some girl, but who knows. I don't know how privacy acts figure in here - could they even share the texts of a minor?

CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN · Jan 28, 2016

PreachersWife2004 said:
It's sort of a "duh" that it's the mom's phones. Kids can't go buy cell phones and have their own contracts.

We're missing the bigger picture here. She wrote something that the father felt was inappropriate. We don't know what that is, but I bet dollars to donuts that if she had been bullying someone who then killed herself, most people would be hollering about her having the phone in the first place.

Still if the mother bought the phone. The father should have gave it back to the mom. How long is a punishment supposed to last . He's seems to be teaching the daughter. You can steal the mothers phone and get away with. I'm sure the mother will cancel the phone and get her daughter another phone. Since the father still has after 3 months.

Butterfly99 · Jan 28, 2016

NightHawkeye said:
You seem to have left out some critical information from your link ...

After just a two-day trial — in which Jackson’s daughter, now 15, testified — Dallas County Criminal Court Judge Lisa Green ordered the jury to find Jackson not guilty, citing insufficient evidence to prove a theft charge.

Of course it was his ex-wife's phone. How many teenagers do you know who buy their own phones? After all the time involved here, the wife can't even claim she was still paying for the phone on her cell plan.

The mom, ex-wife, ex-girlfriend, whatever, was simply being vindictive. Not that the father was any great example for society. When two idiots collide ... the results are sometimes ugly.

Well I bought my 1st iPhone when I was 13, & then an iPad & a laptop when I was 14. All from money I saved up babysitting & doing tailoring stuff. The phone I have now was a bday present from my grandparents. Sure my parents have taken that stuff away b4 but not for over a YEAR. The longest it was taken away was for a month. They sure as heck wouldn't take it away when if it was gonna cause that much trouble.

I think it was the dad who was super vindictive & petty. I mean good grief, he kept the phone for NINETEEN MONTHS because of an "inappropriate text"? He ended his relationship w his 15 yr old daughter cause of all this? No man worth his salt would do that. Now I think the mom was totally ridiculous too but he def. played his part. She owned the phone, not him. Like Ella said he could've just taken the phone away when the girl was @ his house if he really truly felt he needed to keep on punishing her over that text. There were so many ways to handle it besides what he picked. Both parents oughta be ashamed of themselves imo. Poor girl. For real can you imagine how much it would mess your head up that you lost your dad cause of stuff that snowballed out from a text?

keith99 · Jan 29, 2016

The court did NOT side with the father. The court determined there was insufficient evident to sustain a criminal charge of theft.

The dad sounds like Cartman on one of his power trips. It was 19 months later when this action was taken. 19 months for one text seems excessive, well unless the text was setting up a drug buy.

keith99 · Jan 29, 2016

PreachersWife2004 said:
Meh, most of them just say "rude and inappropriate texts". Someone commented that the texts were arranging a beatdown after school for some girl, but who knows. I don't know how privacy acts figure in here - could they even share the texts of a minor?

Who is they? Not the court as that would never have come up as it is irrelevant to a charge of theft.

The Cadet · Jan 29, 2016

PreachersWife2004 said:
I still don't blame him for not returning the phone.

But it wasn't his. It didn't belong to him. It wasn't even his daughter's phone. Imagine if this was a crappy used car that belonged to the mother, she lent to the daughter, and the father just took the keys and refused to give them back for more than a year and a half. To me, this would seem to be both a clear overreach of parental authority and outright theft.

PreachersWife2004 said:
My son bought his own XBox when he was 17 and still lived at home. I've confiscated that thing a few times, and every time it was indefinitely. He bought it, sure, but it was in my house, under my roof, using my resources. Had he moved out while it was confiscated, he wouldn't have taken it with him.

Yeah, see, you can't do that. If he lets you confiscate it while he's living under your roof, that's perfectly understandable (your house, your rules, if he doesn't like it he can move out etc. etc.), but you cannot indefinitely keep his stuff like that. Merely the fact that he lives in your house does not give you the right to steal his possessions, or equal ownership in all of his possessions.

But this wasn't even that. The phone didn't belong to the daughter, it belong to the ex-wife. And not giving it back for 19 months, even long after she demanded that he give it back, makes it an issue of theft.

Tallguy88 · Jan 29, 2016

Mayzoo said:
Yeah, really odd to me that people can have sex with each other, but not civil conversations with each other after they create a child or two. Sad reality of the times I guess.

Oh man, I get to deal with this kind of crap every single day at work.

NightHawkeye · Jan 29, 2016

Butterfly99 said:
I think it was the dad who was super vindictive & petty. I mean good grief, he kept the phone for NINETEEN MONTHS because of an "inappropriate text"? He ended his relationship w his 15 yr old daughter cause of all this? No man worth his salt would do that. Now I think the mom was totally ridiculous too but he def. played his part.

I agree. It's what happens frequently when two idiots collide.

One suspects that there may be more to the story still. For example, perhaps the dad set conditions on when and how the girl could EARN the return of her cell phone ... but the girl never made any effort to comply. Just speculation of course but as others keep saying, there has to be more to this story.

Butterfly99 said:
There were so many ways to handle it besides what he picked. Both parents oughta be ashamed of themselves imo. Poor girl. For real can you imagine how much it would mess your head up that you lost your dad cause of stuff that snowballed out from a text?

Most likely this was just one more conflict involving both parents and her. I'd equate it at the level of a couple who get divorced because one of them never puts dishes in the dishwasher.

Still, despite having idiot parents there is hope that the girl might turn out OK. The immense struggles some endure in childhood can actually help create strong and resilient adults. Not sure that's likely in this case, but one can always hope.

rambot · Jan 29, 2016

Stanfordella said:
I read the article yesterday and felt that it was shoddily written with a clickbait title, but ultimately a worthwhile read for me because it renewed the profound gratitude I have for my amicably divorced parents. Any molecule of compassion towards the father evaporated when I read that he had terminated his relationship with his daughter because of the situation. There is absolutely nothing that would ever lead my parents (or my stepparents) to contemplate for a nanosecond severing their ties with me or my siblings. It is sacred to all of us. They certainly would not jeopardize it over a disciplinary lesson or a material object. We are far more valuable than that. You are precisely right that it was about a power play between divorced parents. I think the punishment perhaps was genuine and warranted initially, but merely became thinly veiled guise. Both parents were responsible for the grotesquely disproportionate escalation, and their mutual egocentricity.

Over the years there have been numerous times when possessions were confiscated by one of my parents when another had purchased the item. They always simply explained the reason for the punishment and gave the item to the other parent when custody was exchanged. The majority of the time that parent then enforced whatever consequence had been given. They resolved any conflict or disputes privately, and then presented a united front to us. This wasn't just about respect between them, but a desire for us to have stability, a refined moral compass, and respect for all of them. It's much harder for a kid to respect their parent's authority when the other parent demeans it.

He could have returned the phone to the mother rather than to his daughter since it was actually the mother's possession. Since the parents clearly were not cooperative with one another she likely would not have upheld his punishment while the daughter was with him, but when she returned to his home he could have taken it away again for the duration of the stay if he felt she still needed to learn a lesson about the text. Any positive lesson that was to be taught by confiscating the phone was then canceled out by the series of subsequent negative lessons (abysmal conflict resolution, keeping a possession that doesn't belong to you).

Out of curiosity, how would you react if the price point was higher than that of the phone? Where is the line drawn? As an example, last August my stepdad took away my car that my dad had bought for me. He simply gave the keys to my dad, who then kept them from me for the agreed upon time. I thought it was ridiculous overkill but at least there wasn't a feud between them, and my relationship with each remained sturdy. What if my stepdad and mom had decided to just indefinitely keep my car that my dad had bought, despite his protests? Would that be acceptable to you?

I'm not understanding how people are coming to the conclusion that the father was solely responsible for ending the relationship.

PreachersWife2004 · Jan 29, 2016

The Cadet said:
Yeah, see, you can't do that. If he lets you confiscate it while he's living under your roof, that's perfectly understandable (your house, your rules, if he doesn't like it he can move out etc. etc.), but you cannot indefinitely keep his stuff like that. Merely the fact that he lives in your house does not give you the right to steal his possessions, or equal ownership in all of his possessions.

Ah, but you see, I CAN do that. That's the beauty of parenthood.

We tell our kids that they have their own rooom, they have their dresser, they have their closet, their bed, their clothes, but we have a right to go through that stuff at any given time. They live under our roof and they will follow our rules. If I found them watching inappropriate stuff on the TV they bought, I don't care if they bought it.

And I don't let my kids dictate to me how I'm going to parent them. I think that's a HUGE problem with society today - they think kids run the show.

But this wasn't even that. The phone didn't belong to the daughter, it belong to the ex-wife. And not giving it back for 19 months, even long after she demanded that he give it back, makes it an issue of theft.

Apparently not, since the court said there wasn't enough evidence to show that it was theft.

rambot said:
I'm not understanding how people are coming to the conclusion that the father was solely responsible for ending the relationship.

Because that is how the media has portrayed it. I would be interested to hear what the daughter said in court.

SnowyMacie · Jan 29, 2016

One thing that article does actually leave out is that the father was actually fairly estranged from the mom and daughter, and that the phone was the mom's property. I will admit that the mom's husband getting the cops involve was a bit too far for a first reaction, but it wasn't the fact he refused to return to the daughter, he was refusing to return it to her mother.

The Cadet · Jan 29, 2016

PreachersWife2004 said:
Ah, but you see, I CAN do that. That's the beauty of parenthood.

You can just take your child's posessions, which they bought with their own earned money, if they choose to move out? Wow, what a bizarre legal system they have where you live.

coloradoguy · Jan 29, 2016

PreachersWife2004 said:
Nope, it's not an onion headline, although it's slightly misleading. I'm getting the sense that he was arrested because he wouldn't hand the phone over to the authorities, which is a bit of a different deal.

http://www.wilx.com/home/headlines/Dad-Arrested-For-Taking-Teen-Daughters-Phone-366837061.html

From the article:

Ronald Jackson says he took his tween daughter's phone away from her in 2013 after he found an inappropriate text message on it.
But when his ex-wife, who is a police officer, found out he took the phone and refused to give it back, she ordered officers to his home.

Thus far, most of the comments I've seen were in the dad's favor, although a few did ask about who owned the phone, etc etc. I just can't believe he was arrested over the phone.

I heard about this on the news here, I did think getting the police involved was too much, they did mention the fact that it was the mother's phone and he was arrested for refusing to return it to her. It didn't seem like he was arrest simply because he took the phone or because he refused to get it to the daughter, it was between the mother and him and it was just simply the daughter that was using the phone.

PreachersWife2004 said:
We tell our kids that they have their own rooom, they have their dresser, they have their closet, their bed, their clothes, but we have a right to go through that stuff at any given time. They live under our roof and they will follow our rules. If I found them watching inappropriate stuff on the TV they bought, I don't care if they bought it.

I'm not going to tell you how to parent, but my parents had pretty much an identical mentality. I sort of never developed a concept of "mine" and "not mine" because everything was either my parents' or our family's. I remember when I was a freshman in college, I tried to take a slice of this guy's pizza he was eating in the common room because growing up thinking he would be totally okay with it (I managed to laugh it off as a joke). Later in college, I found it unfathomable when I had a roommate that didn't use any of what I thought was "our stuff", which was mine. Now, I'm in my mid-20s, married, and live in a different state. To this day, I still have a pretty skewed concept of ownership, even with the things that I have bought with my own money that I personally made. While I don't really feel like I anything is "mine", I'm also incredibly possessive of things that I are not really meant to be shared, i.e. my cell phone, laptop, etc. On the other hand, I'll be the first let you practically use anything without asking.

Mayzoo · Jan 29, 2016

rambot said:
I'm not understanding how people are coming to the conclusion that the father was solely responsible for ending the relationship.

Because the only comment made about ending the relationship was made by the father who said (paraphrase) he simply cannot have a relationship with either of them ever again because of this issue.

I quoted his actual comment on page one of this thread.

Mayzoo · Jan 29, 2016

coloradoguy said:
I heard about this on the news here, I did think getting the police involved was too much, they did mention the fact that it was the mother's phone and he was arrested for refusing to return it to her. It didn't seem like he was arrest simply because he took the phone or because he refused to get it to the daughter, it was between the mother and him and it was just simply the daughter that was using the phone.

I'm not going to tell you how to parent, but my parents had pretty much an identical mentality. I'm in my mid-20s, married, and live in a different state. To this day, I still have a pretty skewed concept of ownership, even with the things that I have bought with my own money that I personally made. While I don't really feel like I anything is "mine", I'm also incredibly possessive of things that I are not really meant to be shared, i.e. my cell phone, laptop, etc. On the other hand, I'll be the first let you practically use anything without asking.

Yeah my folks were similar. Us kids owned nothing no matter who paid for it. We were told we may leave their house any time we wished, but we left only with the clothes on our backs and do not ever come back.

I wonder if hoarders were raised this way. Once they feel they can actually own something they go way overboard.

Tallguy88 · Jan 29, 2016

My mom never wanted me to be estranged from my dad. Even though they didn't get along much and he could be a prig to her, she never tried to keep me from him, even when he didn't pay his child support. She saw those as separate issues. I just don't understand how people can be petty with the kids.

Mayzoo · Jan 29, 2016

The Cadet said:
You can just take your child's posessions, which they bought with their own earned money, if they choose to move out? Wow, what a bizarre legal system they have where you live.

I was raised under the strict fact that minors have NO rights period (other than a right to not be killed). A parent can take anything the child buys with their "own" money for any reason (minors can legally own nothing). Then that parent can do whatever they want with said item. They can keep it, sell it, break it, give it back or whatever strikes their fancy.

The issue here is that the phone belonged to another adult. You cannot just take another adults possessions.

coloradoguy · Jan 29, 2016

Mayzoo said:
Yeah my folks were similar. Us kids owned nothing no matter who paid for it. We were told we may leave their house any time we wished, but we left only with the clothes on our backs and do not ever come back.

Oh wow. Mine weren't that extreme, and I left with more than the clothes on my back.

Mayzoo said:
I wonder if hoarders were raised this way. Once they feel they can actually own something they go way overboard.

It could be, my wife has noticed that I do have some "hoarding tendencies", but don't really hoard.

Dad Arrested for Taking Tween Daughter's Phone

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