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Conservatives, let's try a little thought experiment

com7fy8

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So conservatives, how about we try to conduct this test with the Russia evidence that we have available?
I might be some sort of a conservative, but this does not automatically mean I voted for Donald.

First, I expect a candidate to be an example and leader and role model in how to relate with other people and how to communicate while running for office. If a candidate does not meet this basic qualification, the person can't bribe my vote by, for example, bringing up the economy.

And if a candidate is not effectively defending the lives of unborn Americans . . . end of conversation. If a person does not have the basic character to effectively defend our unborn children, Jesus says, "he who is unjust in what is least is unjust also in much", in Luke 16:10. And without Jesus, He says > "you can do nothing," in John 15:5.

So, if a person's character is a mess, to begin with, I don't need to spend my attention and time on a lot of details of the mess which a mess produces.

What about how America has been giving all its work to China? This seems to have a way of not getting much public attention, while ones are calling so much attention to Donald and Russia. I would say there has been some amount of collusion and conspiracy and ignoring voters, if so much work and business has gone to China. But this gets how much attention? ?

"Maybe calling attention to Donald and Russia is part of a conspiracy to keep attention away from the issue of how America is trillions in debt and is one the pole of China because China was allowed to buy that debt."

President Barack Obama was in office for eight years, but how much did he do about China? But I understand ones might say that Congress was Republican and they kept Barack from doing all he could. But . . . voters put in Barack and voters put in the Republicans. And the trillions of America's debt, I think I was told, was purchased by China, and this could have been used to obligate America to give work to China.

And, in any case, how does America pay off its debt while work goes to China, and Americans buy Chinese so their money goes to China so it is not available to pay off the debt?

Maybe it is easier to handle an issue about Russia, so attention is kept from the China thing which could be too hard to handle . . . especially if without Jesus "you can do nothing".

Did Conservatives alone choose to add to the trillions of debt? What sort of character makes people able to keep doing this? I suspect this has been the result of both liberals and conservatives; so why act like they are competing?

Let the one without sin cast the first stone? This goes for me; I have my own correction that I need.
 
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Veritas

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As opposed to just both side listening to what their own media tell them, and ignoring anything that disagrees.

Is that why you used Wikipedia, WAPO, NYT, USAToday, etc. as your sources?
 
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Kentonio

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Is that why you used Wikipedia, WAPO, NYT, USAToday, etc. as your sources?

Since when are the NYT and WAPO considered liberal media? And how is Wikipedia even considered a media source in the sense we're talking about here? It's an online encyclopedia for goodness sake, the clues in the name.
 
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HereIStand

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Since when are the NYT and WAPO considered liberal media? And how is Wikipedia even considered a media source in the sense we're talking about here? It's an online encyclopedia for goodness sake, the clues in the name.
The NYT and WAPO are establishment media. Right now, they're part of the anti-Trump media echo chamber.
 
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Kentonio

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The NYT and WAPO are establishment media. Right now, they're part of the anti-Trump media echo chamber.

Ah I see, like if everyone tells you you're acting crazy, it must mean they're all out to get you..?
 
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HereIStand

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Ah I see, like if everyone tells you you're acting crazy, it must mean they're all out to get you..?
More like, as Gore Vidal once noted, in Soviet times, Russians didn't believe what was in Pravda, but Americans believed what was in the New York Times. Looks like it's still the case, at least as far as the American establishment is concerned. Only now the French have joined them?
 
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Kentonio

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On how many occasions did Pravda issue apologies and corrections for incorrect reporting? It's one of the key indicators of a legitimate media, a willingness to accept responsibility for mistakes and correct the record. Both WaPo and the NYT are respected globally as legitimate news media (although of course with a pro-American stance). The idea that either is an establishment mouthpiece is laughable.

Just remind me again who Woodward and Bernstein worked for during Watergate when they brought down an establishment President?
 
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Tree of Life

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Not really. Your conclusion to this "thought experiment" is: "So conservatives, what's your evidence (preferably with some material corroberation, not just 'Trump said..') that makes you truly believe there is nothing to the Russia story?"

So what you've done here is bait people into thinking this will be an interesting exercise, but then simply feed them your arguments and evidence of your view, and then asked them to, in light of your evidence, defend their view with evidence.
 
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HereIStand

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Establishment mouthpieces is exactly what they are. That they publish corrections doesn't change that.

Nixon was never popular with the establishment. They looked down on him and still do.
 
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Belk

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Since when are the NYT and WAPO considered liberal media? And how is Wikipedia even considered a media source in the sense we're talking about here? It's an online encyclopedia for goodness sake, the clues in the name.


I don't know about WAPO but the NYT has been considered liberal for a long time. That is not to say they are not factual but they support the liberal view of the world.
 
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Landon Caeli

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There is nothing to the Russia story because Russia is not a terrorist sponsored country. They are not the boogyman.

...On the otherhand, it's okay for liberals to copycat the politics of Central and Western Europeans. To talk to them is ok.

Why?
 
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Kentonio

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Not really, the thread just never took off in the way intended. How could I draw a conclusion to anything when other people didn't provide a contrary perspective for me to consider?
 
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Landon Caeli

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...So, an illegal Russian spy got past homeland security and entered the country? Did he use an alias? That should have been big news.

Why do you hate "the Russkies" so intensely?
 
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Kentonio

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There is nothing to the Russia story because Russia is not a terrorist sponsored country. They are not the boogyman.

...On the otherhand, it's okay for liberals to copycat the politics of Central and Western Europeans. To talk to them is ok.

Why?

Give me a call when Germany or France try and interfere with your election process.
 
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Kentonio

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...So, an illegal Russian spy got past homeland security and entered the country?

Why do you hate "the Russkies" so intensely?

I don't hate Russians in the slightest. The reveal of Veselnitskaya as a definite Russian agent was only revealed by the Swiss very recently.
 
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Landon Caeli

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Give me a call when Germany or France try and interfere with your election process.

I still don't get how that's a problem...

...During an election, no foreign governments, or civilians are allowed to speak to Americans! You must wait until the votes are tallied, only then can we talk!
 
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Kentonio

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I still don't get how that's a problem...

...During an election, no foreign governments, or civilians are allowed to speak to Americans! You must wait until the votes are tallied, only then can we talk!

You don't see how a hostile foreign government hacking US citizens and organizations trying to swing an election to their preferred candidate could be an issue?
 
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