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Why would I believe that? I do believe the position I articulated is indisputably the correct Christian position, for the reasons I stated.
That's preposterous. (and very ignorant comments)To anyone who takes the Bible even halfway seriously, there couldn't possibly be a more false and dangerous doctrine than universalism.
Can you take this scripture at face value, or do you have to explain it away?What's not to like is that it's completely unbiblical and as dangerously misleading as a doctrine could possibly be.
Well, OK. It seems to me that "It seems to me" should be implied in every post, unless the poster is under the illusion he's the Pope or a prophet. When I am speaking ex cathedra, I'll try to make that clear.It's good you're now framing it in terms of your personal belief
Well, OK. It seems to me that "It seems to me" should be implied in every post,
If we don't like it, the solution is to find a different religion.
Aren't you the guy that just wrote this? (yup)The hypothesis argues that John was reworked over the years to address specific theological concerns and issues. This would explain why parts are so theological in nature and why the thought and Greek seem rather sophisticated (to put it mildly) for a Galilean fisherman. The proponents identify the original Gospel and the revisions on literally a line-by-line basis, and I must say I find it quite convincing.
Yet now you claim that the gospel of John was cobbled together.Christianity is what it is. It's either true or it isn't.
Come on, Saint Steven, I've been to a few rodeos before. Universalists are a breed of fanatic that Flat Earthers would envy for their zealotry. I know all the verses that universalists love to pull out of context and fling in my face, blithely ignoring not only the context but the vast number of other verses that are diametrically opposed, not to mention what 99.99% of all Christians have believed and taught for 2000 years. It's the universalists who must do the tap-dancing and explaining away, in spades.Can you take this scripture at face value, or do you have to explain it away?
1 Corinthians 15:22
For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.
Why?I believe you are doing a disservice to Christianity and skating on very dangerous ice.
Are you a Damnationist, or an Annihilationist?Come on, Saint Steven, I've been to a few rodeos before.
I fail to see the inconsistency you apparently see. The Gospel of John says what it says. Whether it had multiple authors is irrelevant to its content or authority as Gospel.Aren't you the guy that just wrote this? (yup)
Yet now you claim that the gospel of John was hobbled together.
So I was right.You know as well I do how 1 Corinthians 15:22 is analyzed by mainstream NT scholars.
I'll ask again then, since you are dodging my questions.Check my profile. You aren't going to win the silly "Gotcha!" game with soimeone who spent nearly 40 years as an appellate lawyer. This doesn't make me better than you in any way, shape or form, but it is fair warning that your attempts at "Gotcha!" are only going to backfire.
Check your spelling. - lolCheck my profile.
You aren't going to win the silly "Gotcha!" game with soimeone who spent nearly 40 years as an appellate lawyer.
Universalists are a breed of fanatic that Flat Earthers would envy for their zealotry.
Shouldn't you call it the Gospel of "John", then? (in name only)The Gospel of John says what it says. Whether it had multiple authors is irrelevant to its content or authority as Gospel.
I am one who believes the unsaved will suffer undesirable eternal consequences quite different from the bliss of the saved. Whatever the biblical teachings actually mean, and whatever those eternal consequences actually are, I trust we will see that the fate of the unsaved is worthy of the God in whom we believe. This is true even if the fate of the unsaved is one that might now seem to me, from my human perspective, to be ghastly.Are you a Damnationist, or an Annihilationist?
Well, if false it deludes the unsaved into believing they have no obligation to repent and turn to Christ, which seems like a fairly big deal to a mainstream Christian. I feel confident you have some creative version of universalism whereby this isn't true at all, but I'm really not interested.Why?
What's so dangerous about UR ?
That would make you a Damnationist.I am one who believes the unsaved will suffer undesirable eternal consequences quite different from the bliss of the saved. Whatever the biblical teachings actually mean, and whatever those eternal consequences actually are, I trust we will see that the fate of the unsaved is worthy of the God in whom we believe. This is true even if the fate of the unsaved is one that might now seem to me, from my human perspective, to be ghastly.
More ignorance. Thanks.Well, if false it deludes the unsaved into believing they have no obligation to repent and turn to Christ, which seems like a fairly big deal to a mainstream Christian. I feel confident you have some creative version of universalism whereby this isn't true at all, but I'm really not interested.
If ONLY they knew the translations that disagree with the theology of spiritually and nominal NEW Christianity.Can you take this scripture at face value, or do you have to explain it away?
1 Corinthians 15:22
For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.
No, no, no. The forum I just left, which wasn't predominantly even a Christian forum, got so tired of the universalist proselytizing that they relegated any and all discussion to a single thread. It had something like 20,000 posts last time I looked. The handful of universalists posted every day, day after day, saying the same things over and over and doing their best to shout down any disagreement. They weren't nasty, but they were one-dimensional fanatics.My experience, and we see it exemplified on this and the other similar threads, are that Christian universalists are calm and rational people who have concluded after careful study that universal restoration, or at least the hope of it, is more in tune with scripture when read through the lens of Christ than eternal torture is. Your accusation of fanaticism doesn't wash unfortunately.
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