• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Being saved the beginning or end?

S

SeventhValley

Guest
Should a already saved Christian then work towards "theosis" or the more modern term "entire sanctification" in which after being saved a person should continue to strive to be more and more like Christ?

2 Corinthians 3:17-18
Good News Translation (GNT)
17 Now, “the Lord” in this passage is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is present, there is freedom. 18 All of us, then, reflect the glory of the Lord with uncovered faces; and that same glory, coming from the Lord, who is the Spirit, transforms us into his likeness in an ever greater degree of glory.
 

jamespyles

Active Member
Jun 30, 2011
260
81
Boise, ID
Visit site
✟24,948.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Just my personal opinion, but salvation is the beginning of the journey, not the end. Too many people answer an altar call and then figure they're set for life. They go to church on Sunday, maybe attend a class at church on Wednesday, but otherwise, Christian faith is a passive activity.

My Pastor told me that a person isn't really saved unless they're living a transformed life. If the evidence of your relationship with Jesus isn't in everything you do with every day you live, then you may be mouthing the words, but you aren't really his.

Feed the hungry, comfort the grieving, give water to the thirsty, show love to your neighbor. Pray, study the Bible, draw closer to Jesus. God will take care of everything else.
 
Upvote 0

DeaconDean

γέγονα χαλκὸς, κύμβαλον ἀλαλάζον
Jul 19, 2005
22,188
2,677
62
Gastonia N.C. (Piedmont of N.C.)
✟107,834.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
You do realize that the scriptures speaks of our salvation as in three distinct phases don't you?

Paul Thomas Simmons points out:


P. T. Simmons, A Systematic Study of Biblical Doctrine, Chapter 28, The Three Tenses of Salvation

And by "entire sanctification", I need a more detailed explaination.

Are you talking about the same doctrine as "sinless perfection" in which some denominations teach?

Or, are you questioning whether or not we accept, believe, and teach the same doctine as Eastern/Oriental Orthodoxy?


Source

God Bless

TIll all are one.
 
Upvote 0

FredVB

Regular Member
Mar 11, 2010
4,981
1,009
America
Visit site
✟322,155.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Entering salvation according to the plan of Yahweh God is a beginning. With there never being a changed life, or no more change than going to church, there is no evidence of truly having entered this salvation, and whether that one responded to the true gospel from God's grace should be questioned to come to doing the right things. Salvation is truly from God's grace through Christ to whom we come with him as Lord with faith, for that. With that there is seeking obedience to him, and growing with more obedience and conforming to what is taught from godly commandments. Growth is essential in spiritual living. We do our part, if we are growing, with our cooperation, but it is hardly our work but basically God's work in us.
 
Upvote 0
S

SeventhValley

Guest
You do realize that the scriptures speaks of our salvation as in three distinct phases don't you?

Nope that one is new to me. Looks interesting


Yes are there any Baptist that teach something similar to the E.O. theosis or Wesleyan idea

"Entire sanctification is a state of perfect love, righteousness and true holiness which every regenerate believer may obtain by being delivered from the power of sin, by loving God with all the heart, soul, mind and strength, and by loving one's neighbor as one's self. Through faith in Jesus Christ this gracious gift may be received in this life both gradually and instantaneously, and should be sought earnestly by every child of God.-United Methodist Book of Discipline (para. 62)"


If I remember the Puritans also had some Calvanistic Pietist beliefs. Dr. William Ames (1576-1633)

"
1. The real change of state is an alteration of qualities in man himself. 2 Cor. 5:17, Old things have passed away; all things are new.
2. The change is not in relation or reason, but in genuine effects seen in degrees of beginning, progress, and completion. 2 Cor. 4:16, The inner man is renewed day by day.
3. This alteration of qualities is related to either the just and honorable good of sanctification, or the perfect and exalted good of glorification. Rom. 6:22, You have your fruit in holiness and your end in everlasting life.
4. Sanctification is the real change in man from the sordidness of sin to the purity of God’s image. Eph. 4:22-24, Put off that which pertains to the old conversation, that old man, corrupting itself in deceivable lusts, and be renewed in the spirit of your mind. Put on that new man who according to God is created to righteousness and true holiness."-http://www.apuritansmind.com/puritan-favorites/william-ames/sanctification/
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
S

SeventhValley

Guest
Just found this from the BF&M



This seems similar to Theosis to me.
 
Upvote 0
S

SeventhValley

Guest
This is neat from the web site you linked Dean

From Chapter 27 - The Doctrine of Sanctification
 
Upvote 0

DeaconDean

γέγονα χαλκὸς, κύμβαλον ἀλαλάζον
Jul 19, 2005
22,188
2,677
62
Gastonia N.C. (Piedmont of N.C.)
✟107,834.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Nope that one is new to me. Looks interesting

In another thread, you want to teach me Greek, tell me how wrong my Greek was, and yet, you have never looked at the word "sozo" in the Greek as it relates to scriptures.

Interesting.


I do not not know many if any Baptists, the teach "entire sanctification".

And you do know that it is against the rules to promote doctines of other denominations here don't you?

If I remember the Puritans also had some Calvanistic Pietist beliefs. Dr. William Ames (1576-1633)

The basic meaning of sanctification is "to set apart".

This hapens at the point of salvation. We are "set apart" for God.

Charles Hodge (December 27, 1797, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania – June 19, 1878, Princeton, New Jersey) was the principal of Princeton Theological Seminary between 1851 and 1878 wrote:


Charles Hodge, Systematic Theology, Book III, Soteriology, Chapter 18, Perfectionism​




Continued...
 
Upvote 0

DeaconDean

γέγονα χαλκὸς, κύμβαλον ἀλαλάζον
Jul 19, 2005
22,188
2,677
62
Gastonia N.C. (Piedmont of N.C.)
✟107,834.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
James Petigru Boyce (1827–1888) wrote:


James P. Boyce, Abstract of Systematic Theology, Chapter 37: Sanctification

Founders Ministries | ch37

Continued...
 
Upvote 0

DeaconDean

γέγονα χαλκὸς, κύμβαλον ἀλαλάζον
Jul 19, 2005
22,188
2,677
62
Gastonia N.C. (Piedmont of N.C.)
✟107,834.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Benjamin B. Warfield (November 5, 1851 – February 16, 1921), wrote:


Entire Sanctification, B. B. Warfield

Do I personally teach "sinless perfectionism", "entire sanctification"?

No!

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
Upvote 0

DeaconDean

γέγονα χαλκὸς, κύμβαλον ἀλαλάζον
Jul 19, 2005
22,188
2,677
62
Gastonia N.C. (Piedmont of N.C.)
✟107,834.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
So essentially the answer would be...We are to work toward Glorification even though Baptist do not believe it can happen in this life. Correct?

I am trying to understand how you equate "sanctification" and "glorification" as one-in-the-same.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
Upvote 0
S

SeventhValley

Guest
Setting denomination aside for the moment and considering the Bible, the answer is to do what Jesus said we were to do. Think Matthew 25:31-46.


41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’
44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’
45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

 
Upvote 0

UnionJack

Veteran
Nov 18, 2009
1,182
131
Toronto
✟24,484.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Should a already saved Christian then work towards "theosis" or the more modern term "entire sanctification" in which after being saved a person should continue to strive to be more and more like Christ?

If we take into consideration, the verse "He who began a good work will finish a good work"

Philippians 1:6
Being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.

and then..

John 15:5
"I am the vine; you are the branches. If a man remains in me and I in him, he will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing."


So essentially, a truly saved person will continue to strive to be more like Christ, not because of their own will power, but because of the Father who enabled that person to come to Christ in the first place, will see to it that that person becomes more and more Christ like until the day that God takes the person home.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
S

SeventhValley

Guest

Ultimately yes. But in a practical sense you still have to put in the work.
 
Upvote 0
S

SeventhValley

Guest
I just found this
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0