Atheism (2)

createdtoworship · Jun 17, 2012

Gadarene said:
I'm right about what?

No evidence is required for this definition of atheism as it is not a positive claim. It makes no claims of existence. If we claimed that there were definitely no gods in existence, then evidence would be required for that. Just because we do not claim no gods exist does not mean we are not atheists, because lacking a belief can occur regardless of whether one makes an existence/nonexistence claim or not.

A lack of evidence doesn't mean atheism of this kind is an untenable position, it just means you still haven't grasped what this definition of atheism actually means.

you said

How do you have "evidence for atheism"?

I said you dont', your right

Gadarene · Jun 17, 2012

gradyll said:
they are the same basic thing as agnostics.

No, they aren't. Agnosticism is about knowledge. Atheism is about belief.

Knowledge =/= belief.

Gadarene · Jun 17, 2012

gradyll said:
you said

I said you dont', your right

Right, because it does not make claims that require evidencing.

So you accept that the burden of proof is on the one making the positive claim, i.e. yourself.

So over to you.

Dave Ellis · Jun 17, 2012

gradyll said:
not really, because we can't claim a negative belief either.

it makes us leprechaun agnostics.

I didn't ask if you have a negative belief, I asked if you have a positive belief there are Leprechauns out there.

Yes, or No.

Dave Ellis · Jun 17, 2012

gradyll said:
they are the same basic thing as agnostics.

Agnosticism and Atheism deal with two totally separate topics, and are not mutually exclusive.

Most people who identify as Agnostic are Atheist as well.

createdtoworship · Jun 17, 2012

Dave Ellis said:
I didn't ask if you have a negative belief, I asked if you have a positive belief there are Leprechauns out there.

Yes, or No.

I don't have a belief either way,

do you have a negative belief

yes or no?

createdtoworship · Jun 17, 2012

Dave Ellis said:
Agnosticism and Atheism deal with two totally separate topics, and are not mutually exclusive.

you said this

Most people who identify as Agnostic are Atheist as well.

then you said this, which contradicts what you said up there!

Gadarene · Jun 17, 2012

gradyll said:
you said this

then you said this, which contradicts what you said up there!

No, it doesn't.

Knowledge and belief are separate topics, so one can be an agnostic atheist, i.e. they are not mutually exclusive.

Going Merry · Jun 17, 2012

What's going on in here o.o
Repent heathens! etc

I have a very knowledgeable belief

createdtoworship · Jun 17, 2012

Gadarene said:
No, it doesn't.

Knowledge and belief are separate topics, so one can be an agnostic atheist, i.e. they are not mutually exclusive.

Oh yeah you said atheism was a lack of belief not a belief.....so now you have a contradiction.

Dave Ellis · Jun 17, 2012

gradyll said:
I don't have a belief either way,

do you have a negative belief

yes or no?

If you don't have a belief, then you do not believe in the existence of Leprechauns.

This is the Atheist view in regards to God. We have no evidence to justify a belief in God, therefore we hold no belief in it.

I don't hold a negative belief in regards to God either, just as you don't hold a negative belief in Leprechauns. The vast majority of Atheists also share that sentiment.

Unless you assert a positive belief, then you lack a positive belief (that does not mean you are asserting a negative belief, much like your stanve on Leprechauns).... It does not mean you assert such a thing does not exist, however you can not accept the claim as true at this point in time.

Atheism is a lack of belief in God, not an assertion that God doesn't exist.

Your stance on Leprechauns is the exact same as an Atheist's stance on God.

Dave Ellis · Jun 17, 2012

gradyll said:
you said this

then you said this, which contradicts what you said up there!

No, that's not a contradiction.

Atheism/Theism deals with Belief
Agnosticism/Gnosticism deals with Knowledge

You can hold a belief in both Atheism and Agnosticism at the same time, as they are mutually exclusive. Just as you can be an Agnostic Theist.

Saying you are Agnostic is meaningless to what your beliefs are regarding the existence of God.

Gadarene · Jun 17, 2012

gradyll said:
Oh yeah you said atheism was a lack of belief not a belief.....so now you have a contradiction.

No, I said knowledge and belief are different topics.

Atheism is defined around the subject of belief - specifically, a lack of belief.

Agnosticism is defined around the subject of knowledge - specifically, a lack of knowledge.

Going Merry · Jun 17, 2012

wait so am i a agnostic theist? >_>
im confused

these terms seem to change on me when i turn my back

Going Merry · Jun 17, 2012

Gadarene said:
No, I said knowledge and belief are different topics.

Atheism is defined around the subject of belief - specifically, a lack of belief.

Agnosticism is defined around the subject of knowledge - specifically, a lack of knowledge.

does it have to be a lack of knowledge?

i always figured agnosticism is 'not knowing so.. ooooh wait i get it now lol i understood it as soon as i typed that

Gadarene · Jun 17, 2012

Baam said:
does it have to be a lack of knowledge?

i always figured agnosticism is 'not knowing so.. ooooh wait i get it now lol i understood it as soon as i typed that

Yup, they don't claim to know there is a god, or know there isn't a god.

For atheism, substitute "believe" for "know" etc etc.

Gadarene · Jun 17, 2012

Baam said:
wait so am i a agnostic theist? >_>
im confused

these terms seem to change on me when i turn my back

If you don't claim to have knowledge of God's existence or non-existence but have a belief in God, then you're an agnostic theist.

Dave Ellis · Jun 17, 2012

Baam said:
wait so am i a agnostic theist? >_>
im confused

these terms seem to change on me when i turn my back

Depends on your viewpoints... however most Christian Churches are agnostic organizations.

If you are of the opinion that we can't understand God's ways as they are higher than ours.... God works in mysterious ways, etc, then you are agnostic.

Agnosticism means you don't believe we can know the nature or workings of a God. It makes no claim as to belief in one's existence.

Many people have tried to mistakenly label themselves as Agnostic, and it's actually amazing how many Christians are not aware of what Agnosticism even means.

Going Merry · Jun 18, 2012

Dave Ellis said:
Depends on your viewpoints... however most Christian Churches are agnostic organizations.

If you are of the opinion that we can't understand God's ways as they are higher than ours.... God works in mysterious ways, etc, then you are agnostic.

Agnosticism means you don't believe we can know the nature or workings of a God. It makes no claim as to belief in one's existence.

I believe God to be real and that He is revealed in the bible. (No doubt)
This would mean I am not a agnostic theist then I would think but just a theist!

sandwiches · Jun 18, 2012

Baam said:
I believe God to be real and that He is revealed in the bible. (No doubt)
This would mean I am not a agnostic theist then I would think but just a theist!

But do you KNOW God to be real? Not just believe but KNOW...

Atheism (2)

In the grip of grace

-______-

-______-

Contributor

Contributor

In the grip of grace

In the grip of grace

-______-

‏‏‏‏ ‏‏‏‏

In the grip of grace

Contributor

Contributor

-______-

‏‏‏‏ ‏‏‏‏

‏‏‏‏ ‏‏‏‏

-______-

-______-

Contributor

‏‏‏‏ ‏‏‏‏

Mas sabe el diablo por viejo que por diablo.

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency