Are You Saved: A Lesson on Sin (Christians: please read!)

Mounts said:

I also want to put up a red flag on your saying, We can overcome sin completly. 1 John 1:8,10 seems to negate that idea...

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1Jo 1:
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Excellent point. This is a verse that I did understand for a number of years. Something was wrong, and I could never quite comprehend what was being said. On the one hand, I knew we were new creatures, created in Christ Jesus into good works, partakers of the divine nature, after the image of God (2 Cor 5:17-21, Eph 2:10, 2 Pet 1:4, Col 3:10). I knew that because we have this new divine nature, which is the spiritual seed of God, we cannot sin (1 John 3:9, 5:18). We are good trees that cannot put forth evil fruit (Matt 7:18).
So it bothered me for a long time. One night, in the wee hours of the morning, I was in fellowship with the Lord and He just opened up something to me.
Read the verses leading up to 1 John 1:8:

1Jo 1:
5 This is the Message which we have heard from the Lord Jesus and now deliver to you--God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness.
6 If, while we are living in darkness, we profess to have fellowship with Him, we speak falsely and are not adhering to the truth.

The key word is IF.
If we are in darkness and say we still are in fellowship with God, then we are lying. But we are not always in darkness. The normal Christian life is to be in the light with Him.

1Jo 1:
7 But if we live in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, His Son, cleanses us from all sin.

These verses about being sinful as well as those that follow, only pertain to people who find themselves in darkness. If you find yourself in darkness, and claim that you did not get there by sinning, then the truth is not in you. The only way believers get into darkness is by sinning! That is why he says:

1Jo 1
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

In other words, if you find yourself in darkness, and if claim that you have not sinned, then you deceive yourself!

Can you see the difference here? He is not saying that sinning and being in darkness is the normal state of the believer. He is just saying that sin is the only way a person gets into darkness.

Your other question:

When you say, "He no longer sees our sins, even the one's we commit today." The Father chastens those whom He loves, and I have to wonder how He would do that if He forgets our sins in the present age. Yes, I believe Christ has paid for our past, present, and future sins but does God really not see the sins we commit today to correct us when we go astray?

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This is another topic which I will address in another post.
That is, what happens when a believer sins, and: how does God deal with sin in the believer.

Nm

croy01 said:

Discourse tainted with 'they' and 'them' also keeps people in bondage. Do you really mean it when you say, "...be very careful not to become pharasees in our treatment of brothers".

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Yes I did! We should be careful not to shoot our wounded. It is sad that church folk have a habit of throwing out the baby with the bath water.

(What is wrong with the words "they" and "them"?

Okay thank you.

I'm not sure if I said this, but my bro also sees this in our dad. We have brought up the subject to our father about him staring at females (with that desire in his eyes) but he claimed he was merely flipping through channels.

There comes a point where if one stops at every channel with a female (esp ones who are sexually suggesting), something will seem wrong. I will not mention the other things he does.

We both have tried to bring it up a few times after that but our father became mad and suggested that we don't watch tv with him.

I do not watch tv now. I took him up on his suggestion.

My brother is not a Christian; though he used to go to youth group for a few weeks he will not identify with Christianity and is reluctant to identify with our dad.

Please note that we first started by pointing out our observations. Our father is the kind of person, which if you (for example) ask him to stop humming so loud, then he will hum louder. Our mother will agree with me =\

sweetsoulsong said:

Okay thank you.
We both have tried to bring it up a few times after that but our father became mad...

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Speaking as a father(and as the child of a father), perhaps you should consider respecting your father... and leaving these issues to God, your mother, and his breathern.
I hope I do not offend, but it is really not your place to judge your father. This may be why he hums louder, he is telling you (intentionally or not) that you are not the person to tell him what to do (why would you tell your father not to hum??) It is outside of the order that God has ordained. If he was harming you or sinning in such a way that hurt you(such as abuse), then you are within you rights to speak and even act in your own self defense.
But in this sort of situation, it is your position to respect him, pray for him, and even listen to him. Show him the respect that is due to him. Once he is aware that you respect him, then you will be in a better position to lovingly work through issues like this. At all times you should be mindful of the place he occupies and the place you occupy. I am 49, my father is 83. I have never, ever questioned his actions, words, or deeds to him...even when I knew he was wrong. It is not my place to do so.
Again, I hope I am not hurting your feelings... but this, I believe is the correct councel.
God bless you and peace in Him.

I am a senior in high school and many of my classmates profess to be Christians, but God has given me the gift to judge their hearts—and I discerned that they, in fact, do not believe in Jesus Christ.

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I know you think this is a small matter, but you have really just claimed to be God himself. Who are you to judge someone's heart? I understand that we can all discern the difference between right and wrong, and it's clear that your friends are wrong, but that does not mean that you know their standing before God. You take this one example of sin and use it to try and say that these people are on their way to hell when in reality you (and all of us except for the guy who claims he has stopped sinning) sin every day. You see these people only during class, you do not KNOW them the way you claim to. HOw do you know they didnt repent? How can you tell that it wasnt just a mistake. Again, we can all discern weather or not a persons actions are right or wrong, but NOBODY except God can judge their hearts.

Having said that, maybe a conversation with them would clear things up. Something along the lines of "You said you are a Christian but your actions show otherwise." Not that cheesy of course but you get the picture. If you knew they weren't Christain but claimed to be why would you say nothing to them? Wouldnt they need help? Wouldnt doing nothing be wrong? If you see somebody get hit by a bus shouldnt you stop and help them?

This is no minor issue, you have just claimed to be able to tell who is going to heaven and who is going to hell, that is a major claim.

Mount,

Ok, thats no problem, I just misunderstood your intentions Glad we got it cleared up.

I understand. Thank you. It is hard for me with my parents. By prayer I manage.