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A reasoned argument to suggest that God probably exists

Skavau

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Yes. It should not be trusted AT ALL.
So we should be suspicious of being suspicious of intellectuals and new information.

Is our suspicion of our suspicion towards anti-intellectualism also suspicious? Should we be suspicious of our suspicion towards our suspicion of anti-intellectualism?
 
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WonderBeat

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I see you are trapped in your own prison of the mind. Sad.
 
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Skavau

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I see you are trapped in your own prison of the mind. Sad.
How can one accurately determine truth without the mind? How can you be sure of anything if you either in part or wholly reject the notion that we can understand anything through observation and rational inquiry?
 
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Wiccan_Child

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Never trust the mind. The mind can be your worst enemy. You have to pacify it somehow. Truth comes first, then the mind can step in as a maidservant to that glorious Truth.
But since your mind conceived of that idea, or at least posted on CF, by your logic we shouldn't trust it.
 
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distraff

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The "stuff" cannot be vast because it is outside space-time. It cannot be complex because that is an attribute of matter, and matter can only exist in space-time. Maybe whatever outside the universe that caused it to exist was some sort of force?
 
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Wiccan_Child

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The "stuff" cannot be vast because it is outside space-time.
Why does the latter preclude the former?

It cannot be complex because that is an attribute of matter,
Why can only matter have complexity? What about anti-matter, or dark matter, so something altogether different?

and matter can only exist in space-time.
Why?

Maybe whatever outside the universe that caused it to exist was some sort of force?
Why can forces exist outside the spacetime continuum, but matter can't?
 
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distraff

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Why does the latter preclude the former?

Because size is directly related to space. There is no evidence space exists outside space-time, or that there is any space-time outside of universes.


Why can only matter have complexity? What about anti-matter, or dark matter, so something altogether different?

Anti-matter and dark matter are just forms of matter.


Hmm, that is a little bit of an assumption. Correction: There is no evidence matter can exist outside space-time.


Why can forces exist outside the spacetime continuum, but matter can't?

I am using the term "forces" loosely?
 
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Wiccan_Child

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If there's no evidence either way, then we can't say either way. Yet, your counter-argument seems to rely on us knowing with scientific certainty that no space exists beyond our own, that no matter can possibly exist outside our own. If we don't have that certainty, then your counter-argument seems a little... flat.

Anti-matter and dark matter are just forms of matter.
Nonetheless, why can only matter be complex?

I am using the term "forces" loosely?
So, if you're not using it in the usual sense, what do you mean by it?
 
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WonderBeat

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Matter by definition occupies extension and duration. These attributes are only found in space and time respectively. If you say there are exotic forms of space and time, that's one thing, but if you say matter can exist in no space and no time, than I don't see that as a fact.


Nonetheless, why can only matter be complex?

Good question.
 
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Wiccan_Child

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Maybe, but there's nothing to say our particular instance of spacetime is the only one. Someone living on a bubble or a balloon might not be able to detect others, but that doesn't mean others don't exist, other instances of the same thing.
 
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