A re-examination of nothing

Brieuse said:

How lame of you to think it means what you said.

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We generally believe that is precisely what it means. How do you ever miss it? I suppose you look beyond, hoping against all hope that it doesn't mean that, so you could have an out with God...

Well, you don't.

Floatingaxe said:

We generally believe that is precisely what it means. How do you ever miss it? I suppose you look beyond, hoping against all hope that it doesn't mean that, so you could have an out with God...

Well, you don't.

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Nope, I'm just honest with myself. Not prejudiced.

Brieuse said:

Nope, I'm just honest with myself. Not prejudiced.

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I am honest with myself and also with God. There is no prejudice in Him or myself. I trust what He says, and don't try to squirm out of what He says is sinful, so that I somehow have permission in my mind to practice sin.


That would be less than honest...in fact, it would be delusional.

Floatingaxe said:

I am honest with myself and also with God. There is no prejudice in Him or myself. I trust what He says, and don't try to squirm out of what He says is sinful, so that I somehow have permission in my mind to practice sin.


That would be less than honest...in fact, it would be delusional.

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We're not fooled.

Brieuse said:

We're not fooled.

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Delusional? how ironic.

What he said is wishful thinking. Men and beds lends easily to men in beds together! How lame your argument is, to think it means anything else!

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Ahhh! This would be one of those times the Bible isn't clear enough so you have to force it to mean what you want? Is there a list posted somewhere so I know which scriptures are to be taken at face value and which are to be "interpreted correctly"?
tulc(I already got that the ones about selling all and following and turning the other cheek have to be interpreted so as not to mean what they say, are there many others?)

tulc said:

Ahhh! This would be one of those times the Bible isn't clear enough so you have to force it to mean what you want? Is there a list posted somewhere so I know which scriptures are to be taken at face value and which are to be "interpreted correctly"?
tulc(I already got that the ones about selling all and following and turning the other cheek have to be interpreted so as not to mean what they say, are there many others?)

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Oh yeah--I just forced it, tulc! LOL!

I suppose it really means male beds, as if there is such a thing! Gve me a break! Hah!

Koit---is the root word for the now used, "coitus", sexual intercourse. All this creative sidestepping of the meaning of the Greek words is silly. we are dealing with spiritual life or death issues. It behooves the homosexuals here to be more honest with themselves and with God.

Floatingaxe said:

What he said is wishful thinking. Men and beds lends easily to men in beds together! How lame your argument is, to think it means anything else!

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Uhh no....first of all it isn't MEN, it is male which is SINGULAR, which is why the argument you are presenting falls flat. There isn't any evidence it has anything to do with 2 men bedding down together! A promiscuous man (a man that goes from bed to bed) is the best translation I've seen, but even that cannot be determined to be 100% accurate.

Plenty of Bible translations have thought it to be something else, so that point doesn't make sense in the least.

David Brider said:

No, they're Christian churches.


David.

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Should we look at what will happen to Christian churches who are compromised and corrupted?

Rev. 2:12-29

The Compromising Church
12 “And to the angel of the church in Pergamos write,
‘These things says He who has the sharp two-edged sword: 13 “I know your works, and where you dwell, where Satan’s throne is. And you hold fast to My name, and did not deny My faith even in the days in which Antipas was My faithful martyr, who was killed among you, where Satan dwells.
14 But I have a few things against you, because you have there those who hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balak to put a stumbling block before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed to idols, and to commit sexual immorality.
15 Thus you also have those who hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate.
16 Repent, or else I will come to you quickly and will fight against them with the sword of My mouth.
17 “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes I will give some of the hidden manna to eat. And I will give him a white stone, and on the stone a new name written which no one knows except him who receives it.”’

The Corrupt Church
18 “And to the angel of the church in Thyatira write,
‘These things says the Son of God, who has eyes like a flame of fire, and His feet like fine brass:
19 “I know your works, love, service, faith, and your patience; and as for your works, the last are more than the first.
20 Nevertheless I have a few things against you, because you allow that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess, to teach and seduce My servants to commit sexual immorality and eat things sacrificed to idols.
21 And I gave her time to repent of her sexual immorality, and she did not repent.
22 Indeed I will cast her into a sickbed, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of their deeds.
23 I will kill her children with death, and all the churches shall know that I am He who searches the minds and hearts. And I will give to each one of you according to your works.
24 “Now to you I say, and to the rest in Thyatira, as many as do not have this doctrine, who have not known the depths of Satan, as they say, I will put on you no other burden.
25 But hold fast what you have till I come.
26 And he who overcomes, and keeps My works until the end, to him I will give power over the nations—
27 ‘ He shall rule them with a rod of iron; They shall be dashed to pieces like the potter’s vessels’— as I also have received from My Father;
28 and I will give him the morning star.
29 “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.”’

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savedandhappy1 said:

Should we look at what will happen to Christian churches who are compromised and corrupted?

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There's quite a difference between compromise and tolerance...to be without prejudice.

tulc said:

Ahhh! This would be one of those times the Bible isn't clear enough so you have to force it to mean what you want? Is there a list posted somewhere so I know which scriptures are to be taken at face value and which are to be "interpreted correctly"?
tulc(I already got that the ones about selling all and following and turning the other cheek have to be interpreted so as not to mean what they say, are there many others?)

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Matthew 19:16-30
16 Now behold, one came and said to Him, “Good Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may have eternal life?”
17 So He said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.”
18 He said to Him, “Which ones?”
Jesus said, “‘You shall not murder,’ ‘You shall not commit adultery,’ ‘You shall not steal,’ ‘You shall not bear false witness,’
19 ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’”
20 The young man said to Him, “All these things I have kept from my youth. What do I still lack?”
21 Jesus said to him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell what you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”
22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful, for he had great possessions.
23 Then Jesus said to His disciples, “Assuredly, I say to you that it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.
24 And again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”
25 When His disciples heard it, they were greatly astonished, saying, “Who then can be saved?”
26 But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
27 Then Peter answered and said to Him, “See, we have left all and followed You. Therefore what shall we have?”
28 So Jesus said to them, “Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
29 And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife or children or lands, for My name’s sake, shall receive a hundredfold, and inherit eternal life.
30 But many who are first will be last, and the last first.

So you don't believe that the scriptures above are saying that it is hard for a rich man to get into heaven?

You don't believe that alot/most rich people place that wealth above God, and aren't able to put God first and have riches?

Do you believe that if we take these scriptures with the ones that speak about people loving money and also trying to love God explain each other?

Do you not believe that what is simple being pointed out here is that, you can't have two master because you will love the one and dispise the other?

You don't believe that the scriptures are saying that without God no one can get into heaven?

Can I ask what you do think they are saying?

davedjy said:

There's quite a difference between compromise and tolerance...to be without prejudice.

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Since the whole point is someone willfully sinning and the Church turning a blind eye to it, and/or joining in on it, I wouldn't know why we would be talking about tolerance or prejudice.

The scriptures aren"t about tolerance or prejudice, because it isn't intolerant or prejudice to not compromise when it comes to sin.

Jet_A_Jockey said:

not really.

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care to explain why?

Der Alter said:

Joseph Smith, John Thomas, Charles Russell, R.E. McAlister, Herbert Armstrong, Jim Jones, David Koresh, et alia. What do these guys and you have in common? They all told their followers the same thing you said in this post. Hey, would the last guy in line of "I got the only true truth, interpretation of scripture," hold up your hand, we got another one.

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Um... no, the differences between me and these guys are that

A. my thesis is supported by empirical evidence
B. I don't claim to be inerrant or to recieve direct communication from God.

I am perfectly happy to acknowledge that I may be in error about anything... all I ask is evidence to this effect before I change my opinions. Is this really so much to ask?

Floatingaxe said:

No it doesn't. You appear to not rely on the Holy Spirit at all for your understanding because it goes against God and His Word.

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Nope, you're wrong, again.

I rely entirely on the Holy spirit.

If you ever find any of God's words, please show me? Of course, if you are refering to the Bible, not even the Bible even claims to be the word of God, so, because you refuse to explain why you believe it is, I'm at a loss as to why you believe the Bible is somehow "God's word"

Floatingaxe said:

NO ONE is suggesting that we ignore science. Science is fantastic! It is the revelation of the handiwork of God!

Rejoice in His creation with every new discovery. He is a limitless God and He has created a limitless universe for us to discover.

To ignore God, however, is the wrong thing to do--for science points to Him.

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You ignore biology, astronomy, geology, paleontology, archaeology, physics, chemistry, medicine, sociology, dendrochronology and I'm sure a myriad of other fields of scientific endeavour every time you insist the Bible is an inerrant, historically accurate account of pre-history and creation.

savedandhappy1 said:

Since the whole point is someone willfully sinning and the Church turning a blind eye to it, and/or joining in on it, I wouldn't know why we would be talking about tolerance or prejudice.

The scriptures aren"t about tolerance or prejudice, because it isn't intolerant or prejudice to not compromise when it comes to sin.

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Love your neighbour, judge not lest you be judged, let him without sin cast the first stone, blessed are the peacemakers...

Sounds pretty tolerant to me.

EnemyPartyII said:

Nope, you're wrong, again.

I rely entirely on the Holy spirit.

If you ever find any of God's words, please show me? Of course, if you are refering to the Bible, not even the Bible even claims to be the word of God, so, because you refuse to explain why you believe it is, I'm at a loss as to why you believe the Bible is somehow "God's word"

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People who know God know that the Bible is the source of His Words to us. Deny the written Word and you deny Him.

Hebrews 4:12-13
For the word of God is alive and powerful. It is sharper than the sharpest two-edged sword, cutting between soul and spirit, between joint and marrow. It exposes our innermost thoughts and desires. Nothing in all creation is hidden from God. Everything is naked and exposed before his eyes, and he is the one to whom we are accountable.

EnemyPartyII said:

You ignore biology, astronomy, geology, paleontology, archaeology, physics, chemistry, medicine, sociology, dendrochronology and I'm sure a myriad of other fields of scientific endeavour every time you insist the Bible is an inerrant, historically accurate account of pre-history and creation.

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I enjoy all of those sciences.

The Word of God and the knowledge given me by God trumps the secular conclusions that we see peppered throughout study's resulting literature.