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vanshan

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Saint Theophan the Recluse is a highly esteemed saint of Russia in the century before last. A protestant missionary came into a Russian town preaching a different gospel to the people there causing confusion and descension. In response to a letter, Saint Theophan gave the following response about the situtation:

"Maybe he teaches salvation, but not in the way that Christ Himself or the Holy Apostles taught us. . . .

Someone may read the Gospel and interpret it falsely. For him the Gospel becomes a means of destruction. Why is this? This is because he doesn't know the road to salvation well. He does not know certain points of the spiritual path, such as faith, keeping the commandments, the acquisition of divine grace, etc. In the Gospel, these points are not spelled out and written collectively, but they've been written under several different passages. In order for one to walk safely in the way of salvation, he must recognize all these points.

Many stumble as they concentrate on certain passages that are related to salvation and turn their attention to one or two of these; they become isolated from the rest of Holy Writ, and cry out 'We have found it, the way of salvation!' In this way one declares, 'Have faith and you will be saved.' Another proclaims, 'Acquire Divine Grace and you don't need anything else.' A third advises, 'Love and you will obtain heaven.' And many other such things are taught. All these are real, and based on Holy Writ. But alone, none covers the entire subject of salvation. They must be combined and only then will full knowledge of the true character of salvation be gained.

Your false teacher is thus among all these who are deceived. He reads the Bible, as you write, and teaches how we will be saved. However, does he present the whole breadth and depth of the struggle that is required, or only one side of it? He grabs two or three isolated passages from Writ, and starts preaching: 'Here is the salvific medicine for you. Take it and be saved!' In the end, he is a liar and a deceiver . . . "

I'll write more from the article later, but the whole article is available through the "Orthodox Heritage" publication available at: http://members.cox.net/orthodoxheritage/index.htm . We should all ask ourselves, are we or our pastors deceivers and liars, having distorted the Gospel, even if unintentionally, or without mallice?

Basil
 
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vanshan

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Do any of you know of preachers who use "proof texts" to try and prove what they are teaching? Have you heard your pastor say, "Turn with me to . . . " trying to use verses one by one to make their case? More often than not, these types of teachers are deceivers sent by satan to lead us astray. We must hold fast to the faith left by the Apostles, because many of these false teachers are disguised as innocent lambs, by in reality they are liars and enemies of Christ. Christ warns us, "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves." Matthew 7:15. We that this verse applies to those who teach anything contrary to what we believe, according to our interpretation of the scriptures, but what is the correct standard of measure? If we are wrong, it is our own teachers whom we may love who are the wolves, and as much as we cooperate with them, we are guilty of deceit with them. It will not be easy for us to discern who the wolves are, or Christ would not have to give us this warning. They are hidden in an allusion of goodness, but if they have departed from the truth apostolic teachings handed down by Christ, they are His enemies, according to this article.

Basil
 
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jamesMarion

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By the opinion of Theophan the Recluse, I am I liar and a deceveiver, and I am bound for Hell. I agree that I am a liar, and I do dececeive, but I beg to differ on my future.
"so foolish was I, and ignorant: I was as a beast before thee.
Nevertheless I am continually with thee: thou hast holden me by my right hand.
Thou shalt guide me with thy counsel, and afterward receive me to glory"
"Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for rightouesness."
Me and Abe are buds.
 
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Why not go on and post the contest of your James quote?
1 - Theophan would have never said you were going to hell.
2 - Your little one liner is a prime example of what the article is describing. you're attempting to show that Abe was justified by faith only but what does the verse actually mean?
 
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jamesMarion

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I found this at gnisios.narod.ru/feofanhow.html
How To Save the Soul
by Bishop Theophan the Recluse
What does one say to the person who asks: "How can I save my soul?"
This: Repent, and being strengthened by the power of grace in the Holy Mysteries, walk in the path of God's commandments, under the direction which the

Holy Church gives you through its God-given priesthood. All of this must be done in a spirit of sincere faith which has no reservations.

What then is faith?
Faith is the sincere confession that God, Who is worshipped in the Trinity, Who created all things and provides for all, saves us who are fallen, through the power of the death on the Cross of the incarnate Son of God, by the grace of the Most Holy Spirit in His Holy Church. The beginnings of renewal, which are established in this life, will appear in all their glory in the future age, in a way that the mind cannot comprehend not the tongue express.
O our God, how great are Thy promises!

How then does one walk in the path of the comandments unswervingly?
This cannot be answered in one word, for life is a complex matter. Here is what is necessary:
a) Repent, and turn to the Lord, admit your sins, weep for them with heartfelt contrition, and confess them before your spiritual father. Vow in word and in your heart before the face of the Lord not to offend Him further with your sins.
b) Then by abiding in God in mind and heart, endeavour to fulfill in body the duties and affairs which your station in life imposes on you.
c) In this labor most of all guard your heart from evil thoughts and feelings -- pride, vainglory, anger, judging of others, hatred, envy, scorn, despondency, attachment to things and people, scattered thought, anxiety, all sensual pleasures and everything that separates the mind and heart from God.
d) In order to stand firm in this labor, resolve beforehand not to withdraw from what you recognize to be necessary, even if it may mean death. To achieve this, when you first resolve to do so, offer your life to God in order to live not for your own sake, but for God alone.
e) A support for life in this manner is a humble offerings of one's self to the will of God, and not depending on one's self; the spiritual arena in which this life is accomplished is patience and an unswerving standing the ranks of redeemed life, with a cheerful endurance of all the labors and unpleasantness that are linked with this.
f) A support for patience is faith, or the assurance that, working in this way for God, you are His servant and He is your Master, Who sees your efforts, is gladdened by them and values them; hope that the help of God which is ever protecting you, is always ready and waiting for you, and will descend upon you in your time of need, that God will not forsake you to the end of your life, and preserving you as one faithful to His commandments here, among all temptations, He will lead you through death to His eternal Kingdom; love, which meditates day and night upon the beloved Lord, in every way strives to do only what is pleasing to Him, and avoids everything that might offend Him in thought, word or deed.
g) The weapons of such a life are: prayers in church and at home, especially mental prayer, fasting according to one's strength and the rules of the Church, vigilance, solitude, physical labors, frequent confession of sins, Holy Communion, reading of the Word of God and the writings of the Holy Fathers, conversations with God-fearing people, frequent consultation with one's spiritual father about all the events of one's internal and external life. The foundation of all these labors in measure, time and place is wisdom, with the counsel fo those who are experienced.
h) Guard yourself with fear. For this remember the end -- death, judgment, hell, the heavenly Kingdom.
Most of all, be attentive to yourself: preserve a sober mind and an untroubled heart.
i) Set as a final goal the kindling of the fire of the spirit, so that the spiritual fire will burn in your heart and, gathering up all your strength into one, will begin to build your inner man and finally burn up the tares of your sins and passions.
Arrange your life in this manner, and with God's grace you will be saved.

Source: Orthodox Life, Volume 27, Number 6 (Nov.-Dec. 1977), pages 37-38. Translated by Subdeacon Alexander Bohush from Trinity Leaflets, Vol. I, pp.

263-265, Jordanville, N.Y., 1972.
My qoute about Abe comes from Paul.
by Me: points A thru D kinda look like the sinners prayer.
My personal opinion: a one liner is all that is needed for salvation. i.e." It is finished"
Another one of my opinions: the book of James is an unbeliever looking at the gospel. Kinda like the book of Ecclesiastes is a believer out of fellowship. (not thinking correctly)
"Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life, and I will dwell in the house of the Lord forever."
 
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Yeznik

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I have the book, and I thought it was a rather good read. The point that stuck to me is when a person who is a Christian is being preached by another person stating to the Christian that they need Christ in their lives. Then we should ask the questions of what Christ is the person talking about?
 
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vanshan

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Saint Theophan also points out:

"Without a doubt we must believe in Christ to be saved. But here I emphasize that this faith in Christ should be received in such a manner that it is intertwined with our faith in the Holy Trinity. Because if one listens constantly about 'salvation in Christ,' it is possible that this truth will be ingrained within Him so exclusively that the significance of the Holy Trinity in the effort of salvation with wane. Thus the Holy Trinity will be covered up in the Person of Jesus Christ. This is a deviation from the true path of salvation. It is not honorable to embrace the Christian faith and then to distort it.

Just like the incarnation and sacrifice of Christ on the cross didn't happen without the Father and the Holy Spirit, so also our salvation is not attained without the synergy of the entire Holy Trinity. The faithful come to the Son through the Father, as the Lord Himself reveals to us: 'No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him. (John 6:44) But how does the Father draw one towards the Son? He draws him through the Holy Spirit. Without the Holy Spirit no on e is saved. This is what the Lord said: 'It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. (John 16:7) It is as if He said: 'If the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, does not come in vain is my incarnation, in vain my death, in vain my resurrection. You will be far from salvation, because without the Holy Spirit you cannot be transfigured, you cannot obtain the characteristics of one who has been saved.'

Do you see, therefore, how we are saved? We are saved in Christ Jesus, with the good-will of the Father and the Grace of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Apostles undertood this deeply, which is why they wished all: 'The Grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the Love of God the Father, and the Communion of the Holy Spirit be with all of you. (II Corinthians 13:13)"


It is clear that many have left the truth for a lie, according to Saint Theophan, who is in agreement with the "o"rthodox view passed down within the Church. You cannot make the gospel about a few proof texts which only gives one side of the picture. Can you imagine the strange image of a work of art if only half of the portrait were shown? The full picture of salvation is found in the totatlity of scriptures, rightly interpretted within the true Body of Christ.

Basil
 
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theend0218

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I especially enjoyed the point that we need remember that it is the grace of God in Christ given to us through the activities of the Holy Spirit. This, of course, is not an exact quote, but the point, I hope, is the same. God, in the mystery of His Being, brings us to Himself, imparts life and goodness through His many gifts. Peace.
 
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Lynn73

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We should all ask ourselves, are we or our pastors deceivers and liars, having distorted the Gospel, even if unintentionally, or without mallice?

Not in my opinion. My pastor preaches the gospel just fine. There's always going to be disagreements as to which group is distorting the gospel, we all know that.
 
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holeinone

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You mean like Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Or

Mat 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

That kind of proof texting?
 
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ThePilgrim

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You do realize that St. Theophan wasn't Roman Catholic, right?
 
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mesue

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From where do you think we get our understanding from? You're calling the Holy Spirit a false teacher?
KJV said:
Proverbs 2:6 For the LORD giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding.
KJV said:
Proverbs 9:10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.
KJV said:
Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
I have the Teacher in me. The Holy Spirit will teach me what I need to know. The more I study the Bible the more of the deep things He shows me.
 
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ThePilgrim

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mesue said:
From where do you think we get our understanding from? You're calling the Holy Spirit a false teacher?


I have the Teacher in me. The Holy Spirit will teach me what I need to know. The more I study the Bible the more of the deep things He shows me.

See, the problem with this is that other people also claim to have the Holy Spirit within them, and teach the opposite of you on important matters. "God is not the author of confusion."
 
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mesue

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ThePilgrim said:
See, the problem with this is that other people also claim to have the Holy Spirit within them, and teach the opposite of you on important matters. "God is not the author of confusion."
There's only One Holy Spirit.
Can you please clarify what might be contrary to what I have just said? Especially the important matter. I wouldn't want to be a stumbling block for any one to come to the Lord.
 
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ThePilgrim

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mesue said:
There's only One Holy Spirit.
Can you please clarify what might be contrary to what I have just said? Especially the important matter. I wouldn't want to be a stumbling block for any one to come to the Lord.
Well, you're saying that you get your understanding of how to interpret the Bible from the Holy Spirit. Other people also say that the Holy Spirit teaches them, but they believe different things than you do. Yet both say that their understanding comes from the Holy Spirit.

So obviously, it's not enough to say that the Holy Spirit is your teacher.
 
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mesue

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I believe what my Bible tells me.
Also,I believe we, who are saved, have the same Holy Spirit. This is the main reason why you cannot forsake fellowship. True, Biblical, fellowship is sharing our walk and edifying each other, not a food fest as some would think. This edifying includes studying the Scripture together so we, through the Holy Spirit, don't get what God has said to us through His Holy Word wrong.
 
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ContraMundum

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It's interesting that St Theophan in the OP never entertains the idea that he may have the Gospel wrong. Just like the rest of us, but without the fancy name.

Does this thread have an agenda? I'm wondering.
 
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Splayd

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But the truth is any one of those "ways" is sufficient on it's own if you look at them properly:

1. "Have faith and you will be saved."
What's faith? Is it purely an intellectual belief? NO! Is it a trivial confession? NO! It's so much more than those things. It's a compelling conviction. It's a belief that MUST be acted upon, because you can't help but do otherwise. Anything less is just a profession of intellectual belief. If I sincerely have faith in God, I'm compelled to know Him and all He teaches and to obey Him. How can I do otherwise? Anyone that suggests that faith is not enough on it's own, simply doesn't understand what real faith is.

2."Acquire Divine Grace and you don't need anything else."
There is nothing else! The ONLY way to have salvation is through God's grace. There is no other way. Not one of us deserves it or can earn it. It IS God's Grace and only by God's grace that we can be saved. Understanding that that's all we need is not the same as acquiring it though. I'm yet to hear anyone suggest that knowing it and having it are the same thing, but truly knowing it puts everything into perspective. WOW! God really is great! I'm really not! I need God! If I truly know that truth how can I not want to serve Him? How can I not want to persue that relationship in truth?

3. "Love and you will obtain heaven."
So what is love in this context? 1 John 4 tells us - God is Love! How then can I know love, unless I first know God? If I know God and I'm exhibiting that relationship through love then I am surely saved. John further defines "love" when he proclaims that the way to love each other is to first love God with all we have and to keep His commandments. There is nothing more. If I love God with all my heart and all my mind and all my soul, then I am consumed by Him. Surely that alone is sufficient for my salvation.

The problem isn't that these teachings are insufficient, it's that they're misunderstood. To anyone who understands the truth of these messages and lives them, they are certainly enough.
 
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