Would you support a 'Christian Zone'?

Matthew514

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Let's start with the premise that the Bible contains instruction from God how people should behave in a Godly society. Secular laws contain instruction about how people should behave in modern society. Many Christians believe that laws should reflect, to an extent, Biblical teaching because a) such teaching is better for society and b) it allows them to practice and share their faith without persecution. On the other hand, secular society, and some Christians, believe that the law should reflect the current morals of society, and that a religious group shouldn't impose their beliefs on others.

The dynamic of these counter opinions has led to an ongoing struggle between the two camps, and a situation where many Christians are made to feel they are being unreasonable, and are even attacked, for suggesting certain aspects of our faith should be reflected in legislation. In some countries, in Europe in particular, governments are even creating legislation that could make some aspects of living a Christian life, Biblical parenting for example, open to prosecution.

So let's run this thought experiment (a thought experiment for now at least):

Let's say we have a zone, a bare plot of land where no one currently lives. The intention would be to develop this empty land so it will have houses and businesses etc., but even before that happens it will have political autonomy: the developers/managers could make their own rules before they even start.

So these zone developers could make rules and laws that reflect Bible teachings. There could be no argument that such rules would be imposed on the unwilling, there is no existing population, and new arrivals know exactly what they are getting into from the start: they would be 'voting with their feet' to show they are at least tolerant of such rules.

So there would be a mandate for everything that is too much, or would cause outrage, in modern societies. So all the great controversial things could be enshrined in law: marriage would be between a man and women, school prayer could not be simply be allowed, it could be mandatory.

We could go further: public officials, judges, police and school principals would have to demonstrate a Christian faith, Christian organisations incentivized to come, ISP's obliged to filter pornography etc. New residents would be asked to sign a declaration that they understand that are coming to a Christian zone, with all that entails (as they would do when enrolling a child in a Christian private school). And if people don't want any of that, well they don't have to come and live there.

The purpose of this relatively small zone would be to demonstrate that Biblical instruction works for society, and if anyone objects to that, well we say to them that we will grow and prosper if it is right, or fold and fail if it is not.

It could also be a place where World-weary or persecuted Christians could come and stay for a season, to re-charge before returning to their home countries.

Now, the questions to you are, if this were possible, would it be right to create such a zone? Would you support it? Would you move there? Would you help create it?
 

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I don't get why some religious people feel the need to force their religion on others. The choice isn't between laws based on Christianity, and laws based on modern morality... the better position to take is to have no ones morality forced on others. ie: People are free to do what they want, as long as it doesn't harm others.

That way, Christians are free to be Christians, and non-Christians are free to live by their worldview.

What you are basically saying is that you want to create a new Christian state, perhaps not even subject to the constitution. Well why would that be legitimate?
 
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Matthew514

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Such a scheme of course would not force people to do anything, there would be no people in such an initially empty zone to force. Instead, any one who felt the rules were not of their liking would simple not go there. To expand the idea a bit: there could be a competing zone that had completely different rules. The point would be to have choice, not force.

Re legitimacy: what makes any constitution legitimate in the first place?
 
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keith99

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And who decides what a real Christian is?

What happens the first time someone goes there and finds they have been lied to and they cannot leave or cannot leave without staggering economic loss.

At least the Lutherans need not worry, at least until they consider it a mission field!

The Kingdom is to be in the midst of your enemies. And he who will not suffer this does not want to be of the Kingdom of Christ; he wants to be among friends, to sit among roses and lilies, not with the bad people but the devout people. O you blasphemers and betrayers of Christ! If Christ had done what you are doing, who would ever have been spared?
 
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Matthew514

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What happens the first time someone goes there and finds they have been lied to and they cannot leave or cannot leave without staggering economic loss.

As with anyone providing a product, the developers of such as zone would be ruining their own scheme if they were untrustworthy.

For potential migrants, as with anyone, caveat emptor.
 
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GenetoJean

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Matthew, why did you put this in the general political forum?

However, let's say that there is a very large plot of land that is privately owned and this is where the town is being built so that there is no public land, I wouldnt have a problem with it. I wouldnt live there and I dont think it will work unless all people in the town are the same denomination or at least very close.

I would go to the plot of land right next to this town though and start a business to provide all of the things that the people cant get because of their laws but people are going sneak out to get anyway.
 
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Matthew514

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What about people born in to that society? They aren't willingly accepting those terms.

An really important issue. All children are born into a certain social framework in a time and place. But according to the zeitgeist at another place and/or time, the way they are raised would be wrong. A parent will have an understanding of what they believe to be true, and will naturally want to raise their children that way. That may clash with the prevailing zeitgeist, especially if that zeitgeist proclaims all moral positions are equal, so therefore there is no one true moral position.
 
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SaphireOwl

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No. A Christian community, as in a property where Christians live together and live by the Biblical tenets they set in place on that private property, sure. Much like private gated communities today only with a Christian theme.

But that wouldn't even involve non-Christians being forbidden to enter. Think of the Pagan mailman who would be so confused because the mail boxes are on the other side of the barbed wire! ;)



But a zone for Christians only, never.

In my opinion, all one has to do is look to the Muslim countries that are Muslim Sharia law zones.

Edit to add this extended trailer. This short trailer depicts a warning regarding your question as pertains to a Christian scripture or God's law zone that should never be dismissed. Or forgotten. Save for the grace of God in this non-Theocratic nation, there go we If a Christian law zone were ever implanted here.
Extremism is a spirit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-zWq_Xzw_g


All one has to do is look to to the Dearborn Michigan "No-Go" zone, to see what an extremist religious zone would look like if one were made in Christ's name.

Jesus came to save the whole world. He didn't come to establish his covenant in one neighborhood where those unaffiliated were forbidden to enter.
The whole world is invited to find Christ. How could a zone be established that kept everyone but Christians out? And say that it practices the teachings of Christ.


Let's start with the premise that the Bible contains instruction from God how people should behave in a Godly society. Secular laws contain instruction about how people should behave in modern society. Many Christians believe that laws should reflect, to an extent, Biblical teaching because a) such teaching is better for society and b) it allows them to practice and share their faith without persecution. On the other hand, secular society, and some Christians, believe that the law should reflect the current morals of society, and that a religious group shouldn't impose their beliefs on others.

The dynamic of these counter opinions has led to an ongoing struggle between the two camps, and a situation where many Christians are made to feel they are being unreasonable, and are even attacked, for suggesting certain aspects of our faith should be reflected in legislation. In some countries, in Europe in particular, governments are even creating legislation that could make some aspects of living a Christian life, Biblical parenting for example, open to prosecution.

So let's run this thought experiment (a thought experiment for now at least):

Let's say we have a zone, a bare plot of land where no one currently lives. The intention would be to develop this empty land so it will have houses and businesses etc., but even before that happens it will have political autonomy: the developers/managers could make their own rules before they even start.

So these zone developers could make rules and laws that reflect Bible teachings. There could be no argument that such rules would be imposed on the unwilling, there is no existing population, and new arrivals know exactly what they are getting into from the start: they would be 'voting with their feet' to show they are at least tolerant of such rules.

So there would be a mandate for everything that is too much, or would cause outrage, in modern societies. So all the great controversial things could be enshrined in law: marriage would be between a man and women, school prayer could not be simply be allowed, it could be mandatory.

We could go further: public officials, judges, police and school principals would have to demonstrate a Christian faith, Christian organisations incentivized to come, ISP's obliged to filter pornography etc. New residents would be asked to sign a declaration that they understand that are coming to a Christian zone, with all that entails (as they would do when enrolling a child in a Christian private school). And if people don't want any of that, well they don't have to come and live there.

The purpose of this relatively small zone would be to demonstrate that Biblical instruction works for society, and if anyone objects to that, well we say to them that we will grow and prosper if it is right, or fold and fail if it is not.

It could also be a place where World-weary or persecuted Christians could come and stay for a season, to re-charge before returning to their home countries.

Now, the questions to you are, if this were possible, would it be right to create such a zone? Would you support it? Would you move there? Would you help create it?
 
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Marius27

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The purpose of this relatively small zone would be to demonstrate that Biblical instruction works for society, and if anyone objects to that, well we say to them that we will grow and prosper if it is right, or fold and fail if it is not.
Or, we could just look at countries in the world that are already dominated by religious rules and see how they work out. You'd basically end up like Uganda or Russia. In other words, a 3rd world cesspool. Theocracies don't work.

I'm also curious on whose version of Christianity will control this small zone? I don't think Catholics and Protestants are going to agree on the rules.
 
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Hetta

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Now, the questions to you are, if this were possible, would it be right to create such a zone? Would you support it? Would you move there? Would you help create it?
You are welcome to go and create your 'perfect' society where nobody will ever sin. Good luck to you. No, I wouldn't want to visit. I'm too imperfect.
 
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rumitoid

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Let's start with the premise that the Bible contains instruction from God how people should behave in a Godly society. Secular laws contain instruction about how people should behave in modern society. Many Christians believe that laws should reflect, to an extent, Biblical teaching because a) such teaching is better for society and b) it allows them to practice and share their faith without persecution. On the other hand, secular society, and some Christians, believe that the law should reflect the current morals of society, and that a religious group shouldn't impose their beliefs on others.

The dynamic of these counter opinions has led to an ongoing struggle between the two camps, and a situation where many Christians are made to feel they are being unreasonable, and are even attacked, for suggesting certain aspects of our faith should be reflected in legislation. In some countries, in Europe in particular, governments are even creating legislation that could make some aspects of living a Christian life, Biblical parenting for example, open to prosecution.

So let's run this thought experiment (a thought experiment for now at least):

Let's say we have a zone, a bare plot of land where no one currently lives. The intention would be to develop this empty land so it will have houses and businesses etc., but even before that happens it will have political autonomy: the developers/managers could make their own rules before they even start.

So these zone developers could make rules and laws that reflect Bible teachings. There could be no argument that such rules would be imposed on the unwilling, there is no existing population, and new arrivals know exactly what they are getting into from the start: they would be 'voting with their feet' to show they are at least tolerant of such rules.

So there would be a mandate for everything that is too much, or would cause outrage, in modern societies. So all the great controversial things could be enshrined in law: marriage would be between a man and women, school prayer could not be simply be allowed, it could be mandatory.

We could go further: public officials, judges, police and school principals would have to demonstrate a Christian faith, Christian organisations incentivized to come, ISP's obliged to filter pornography etc. New residents would be asked to sign a declaration that they understand that are coming to a Christian zone, with all that entails (as they would do when enrolling a child in a Christian private school). And if people don't want any of that, well they don't have to come and live there.

The purpose of this relatively small zone would be to demonstrate that Biblical instruction works for society, and if anyone objects to that, well we say to them that we will grow and prosper if it is right, or fold and fail if it is not.

It could also be a place where World-weary or persecuted Christians could come and stay for a season, to re-charge before returning to their home countries.

Now, the questions to you are, if this were possible, would it be right to create such a zone? Would you support it? Would you move there? Would you help create it?

We are to be "in the world," and besides that, what kind of message would this send to the neighbors we are to love. Then there is also the screening process for admittance into the Zone; not everyone who calls themselves a Christian actually qualifies. Would money be pooled, like a cooperative? Would we have rights?
Interesting idea and I need to think about it more because my mind always goes to the negative first before it can start to see the positive.
Shalom
 
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DaisyDay

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There is such a Hassidic Jewish town in New York:

Kiryas Joel, New York - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Public buses are segregated with women on one side of the curtain and men on the other - of course, no buses run on Saturday. The schools are sexually segregated as well.

I think this town has one of the highest public subsidy rates in the country.
 
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keith99

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I've rethought this letting my dark side take over.

My dark side firmly supports this idea.

That is the dark side of an atheist.

What could be better? A society composed only of self defined and self righteous 'Christians' who want to be in a safe place free from the influence of people like me and who are actively denying the call to be a light to the world and to spread the good news.

It would be so amusing to sit and wait for them to bring Christ into disrepute.

Satan (if there is a Satan) would be overjoyed at even a serious consideration of this idea.
 
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Paradoxum

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I've rethought this letting my dark side take over.

My dark side firmly supports this idea.

That is the dark side of an atheist.

What could be better? A society composed only of self defined and self righteous 'Christians' who want to be in a safe place free from the influence of people like me and who are actively denying the call to be a light to the world and to spread the good news.

It would be so amusing to sit and wait for them to bring Christ into disrepute.

Satan (if there is a Satan) would be overjoyed at even a serious consideration of this idea.

You think they'd make a mess of running an area like that?
 
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Hetta

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Isn't the church supposed to be a "Christian zone"? And how is that working out for all those millions who have been driven out of churches, and the churches that have dissolved amidst rancor, and the churches making bazillions on the back of the prosperity bible while teaching watered down drivel? I can see that living zone working out just like the church. Lots of polite talk upfront, but lots of back-stabbing and gossip behind closed doors.
 
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keith99

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You think they'd make a mess of running an area like that?

No, I know they would make a mess of it. The only question is how bad a mess and if it would mainly be humorous or tragic.

Do remember my post 4, especially the quote at the end. This if it happened would be a filtered Christian Group and a lot of the good would have been filtered out.

If afterwards something evil occurred and the remaining Christians were gathered up and put in a different area I would expect they would still have problems, but it might just work out better than usual for human beings.
 
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