Why is this taught in your churches?

Zecryphon

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isn't that commonly referred to as "cherry picking"?

i love the saying "God said it. I believe it. That settles it!!"


It is called cherry picking. But I don't know if the OP believes any of the Bible, that's why I asked the question about it. I love the saying "If the KJV was good enough for Jesus and His disciples, it's good enough for you!" ^_^
 
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jblake

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If you don't believe the creation account in the Bible, what parts of the Bible do you believe? None of it? Some of it?
That was my point. If you accept the Bible as true, then one has to believe that the Creation account is true, as a matter of faith and belief. Depending purely on reason, logic, and empirical evidence, one has to say "I don't know" in terms of either evolution, or Creation. What is claimed to be true depends on one's axioms --- the unproven and unprovable assumptions that one makes. The recognition of those assumptions, and one's willingness to accept that they are unproven and unprovable, is why one takes the results of those axioms on faith, and faith alone. If one only accepts that only part of the Bible is true, then what part, or parts are true? The parts that are comfortable? The parts that don't require one to admit to a belief system? Some other subset? Why are those parts true? Why are the other parts not true? In the end, it boils down to: "Do you _know_ what you believe?" and "Do you know why you believe what you think you believe?". Maybe one should also throw in: "Is what you think you believe, what you actually believe?"
 
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twin.spin

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When we look at the Creation account in Genesis in its context, there is no other meaning that can be implied other than God created the universe and everything in it in six consecuative 24 hour days. When did this occur? What was the mechanics of these daily events initiated by God's word? We do not know. The Bible gives no information on the age of the earth and universe.

NASA installed large landing pads on the original landing craft because of the known factor of how much dust accumulates in space. The theory went that because the moon is billions of years old there should be approx 1 foot or more dust ..... what they discovered was less than 1".

Conclusion, either:
  1. the universe is younger than believed
  2. the formula for dust accumulating on surfaces is wrong
As far as I know, NASA hasn't changed the rotation rate of satellites ... dust hasn't changed accumulation speeds.

\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ other interesting facts /////////////
F = ma
Force = (mass) times (acceleration)
a heavier object doesn't fall any faster or slower than a small object

Recently a fairly large meteor (approx the size of a full size bus) came within the earth (half the distance between the earth and moon). Despite the gravitational pulls of both the moon and earth, the meteor didn't become an orbiting satellite.

The significance of this is what force stopped the moon of it's accerlation to become an satellite of the earth.... if the earth couldn't stop a meteor?

Which the ultimate question is, what force stopped all the sun's accleration after the bang if that happened?
 
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Zecryphon

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The Bible is God's divine revelation to mankind. There is no reason to believe any part of it is a lie and I've seen plenty of atheists, agnostics, philosophers and other kinds of skeptics try to prove it false and fail. Now, I would like it very much if you would answer the question that has been put before you: which parts of the Bible are true? All of it, some of it or none of it?
 
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Lupinus

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Because the Bible tells us so.

God tells us the world was created in six days, therefor it was created in six days. Just because science tells us that is impossible doesn't mean a fig. Science is always wrong and constantly changing as it is based on what we as humans know in our limited understanding. The so called laws of science constantly change.

Plenty of the things in the bible are scientifically impossible. Creation of the world in six days, raising of the dead, parting of the red sea, mana from heaven, covering the world in a flood, etc.

Does this mean none of them happened? That they are impossible? If our limited human understanding will cause us to pick and choose does any of it really matter?
 
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Studeclunker

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Each religious order has something they base their belief system on. Weather it be the Koran, the writings of a particular leader (Confucus, Budda, etc), or the Holy Bible.

Whatever one bases their religion on must be the norm and foundation of that faith. Otherwise it's like the house built on sand that Christ mentions in his parable, "The wind blew and the waves beat upon it and great was its fall..." Thus will be the fall of the religion that doesn't remain faithful to it's source of faith.

Thus, if the Bible, in the books Moses recorded, says that the Lord created the world in six twenty-four hour days, then, since we have no other eye-whitness accounts, we as Lutherans accept the Lord's testamony as truthful. Since our belief system is based on his word (the Holy Bible) we have no other choice.

As to the Scientific community, they have nothing but theories as to the origins of the Earth and universe. Since all a theory amounts to is a guess, then I'd rather not base my faith on Science, thank you.
 
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seajoy

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A question has been asked of the OP.....why hasn't he come back and answered it? I am curious to know his response.

Oops - the question was asked of a different poster - I need to read better. Anyway - it could be asked of the OP. What parts of the bible do you believe? Creation isn't a big stretch when looking at ressurection.
 
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lovernotafighter

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A question has been asked of the OP.....why hasn't he come back and answered it? I am curious to know his response.

Oops - the question was asked of a different poster - I need to read better. Anyway - it could be asked of the OP. What parts of the bible do you believe? Creation isn't a big stretch when looking at ressurection.

All of it, of course! I've been looking into YEC theory. It seems like I never really gave it a chance. Let's prove it and shock the world! :)
 
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Studeclunker

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All of it, of course! I've been looking into YEC theory. It seems like I never really gave it a chance. Let's prove it and shock the world! :)

Shocking? Oh, indubidably!^_^ The proof will come riding in the clouds on a white horse and will be seen all over the world at once. It is also written, that those who don't presently believe and promote their 'scientific' theories and agendas, won't believe when confronted with the proof either. We already know the end of the story. Just when the story will end, that's the question.;)
 
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twin.spin

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Shocking? Oh, indubidably!^_^ The proof will come riding in the clouds on a white horse and will be seen all over the world at once. It is also written, that those who don't presently believe and promote their 'scientific' theories and agendas, won't believe when confronted with the proof either. We already know the end of the story. Just when the story will end, that's the question.;)

Love that answer :amen:
 
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Shocking? Oh, indubidably!^_^ The proof will come riding in the clouds on a white horse and will be seen all over the world at once. It is also written, that those who don't presently believe and promote their 'scientific' theories and agendas, won't believe when confronted with the proof either. We already know the end of the story. Just when the story will end, that's the question.;)

http://www.smallchurchmusic.com/Snippet/S-AtTheName-KWeston-PipeLC-48-CAM.mp3
 
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Aibrean

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Yes...it can be possible to have a 6 day creation and an earth that appears old (as Tangible said). I actually came to that realization this year.

If everything was created without having been given the appearance of "old", Adam wouldn't have had anything to eat (they didn't eat meat before the fall) in the garden. How could birds be in the heavens if they were baby birds? Certainly even Adam wasn't created as a baby.

And the LORD God planted a garden in Eden, in the east, and there he put the man whom he had formed. And out of the ground the LORD God made to spring up every tree that is pleasant to the sight and good for food. The tree of life was in the midst of the garden

He put Adam in the garden before he put plants in there...so either the trees grew super-fast or they were created full grown.
 
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Aibrean

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Plants were on the earth yes...not necessarily in the garden. At least that's the way I read this..

And the LORD God planted a garden in Eden, in the east, and there he put the man whom he had formed.

I read it chronologically (no plant on the earth had sprung up). Being a farmer, a plant does not grow if it hasn't been planted because it doesn't exist there. The verse above that one is

When no bush of the field was yet in the land and no small plant of the field had yet sprung up

Which means to me that the rest of the earth had already been planted before he "planted a garden in Eden". But, if I read the verse in order, God placed man in the garden before the plants (in the garden of Eden) "sprang up".
 
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DaRev

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Plants were on the earth yes...not necessarily in the garden. At least that's the way I read this..



I read it chronologically (no plant on the earth had sprung up). Being a farmer, a plant does not grow if it hasn't been planted because it doesn't exist there. The verse above that one is



Which means to me that the rest of the earth had already been planted before he "planted a garden in Eden". But, if I read the verse in order, God placed man in the garden before the plants (in the garden of Eden) "sprang up".

But the verse says that He planted the garden and then placed the man there, which tells me that the plants were there first.
 
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Yes...but it was before they had sprung up (yes...ok...they we there but not visible). You know how long it takes an apple tree to bear fruit from a seedling?

I never really thought of creation in those terms.

I've always pictured it as God saying "here's an apple tree" and there's an apple tree.
 
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Studeclunker

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I come from an agrarian background too. Thus, I understand your viewpoint as to the origin of (plant) life. However, the question begs answer; did the chicken come first or the egg? Thus, did the tree come first or did the seed? If we believe that our Lord created the earth by just his word, the answer is given: the chicken and the tree.

Let's have a look at C.S. Lewis' view of what the creation may have been like:

...But it was a valley of mere earth, rock and water; there was not a tree, not a bush, not a blade of grass to be seen. The earth was of many colours: they were fresh, hot and vivid...

The Lion was pacing to and fro about that empty land and singing his new song. It was softer and more lilting than the song by which he had called up the stars and the sun; a gentle, rippling music. And as He walked and sang the valley grew green with grass. It spread out from the Lion like a pool. It ran up the sides of the little hills like a wave. In a few minutes it was creeping up the lower slopes of the distant mountains, making that young world every moment softer. The light wind could now be heard ruffling the grass. Soon there were other things besides grass. The higher slopes grew dark with heather. Patches of rougher and more bristling green appeared in the valley. Digory did not know what they were until one began coming up quite close to him. It was a little, spiky thing that threw out dozens of arms and covered these arms with green and grew larger at the rate of about an inch every two seconds. There were dozens of these things all round him now. When they were nearly as tall as himself he saw what they were. "trees!" he exclaimed.

Excerpt from The Magician's Nephew, by C.S. Lewis

What's to say that a being who can create things simply by the power of his voice couldn't do something quite similar? Lewis is presenting this as his theory, a shadow, of what creation might have been like. So, again the question's answers are: the Chicken and the Tree. Fully formed and mature.
 
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Zecryphon

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Yes...but it was before they had sprung up (yes...ok...they we there but not visible). You know how long it takes an apple tree to bear fruit from a seedling?

Just out of curiosity, how do you know that the plants had not sprung up when God created planted the garden?
 
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Aibrean

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Now no shrub had yet appeared on the earth and no plant had yet sprung up, for the LORD God had not sent rain on the earth and there was no one to work the ground, 6 but streams came up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground. 7 Then the LORD God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being. 8 Now the LORD God had planted a garden in the east, in Eden; and there he put the man he had formed. 9 The LORD God made all kinds of trees grow out of the ground—trees that were pleasing to the eye and good for food. In the middle of the garden were the tree of life and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
The way I see it...
1. No plants yet have spring up
2. God creates man
3. God plants garden of EdenB
4. Got puts man in garden
5. All kinds of trees grow out of the ground.

Between 1 and 2...maybe from the streams coming up from the earth. Obviously between 2 and 3, man is going to have to need something to eat. So like I said...either they grow super fast or when he makes the garden the plants are full grown.
 
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