Why I resist trendy ministries and fad doctrines (a Story)

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JimB

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Here’s a true story of the dangers of pop-theology.

Several years ago a fortyish woman, who had been through three disastrous marriages became involved with a local Charismatic congregation that was into all sorts of fad theologies, including free-for-all-prophecy and generational curses. She became convinced, thanks to her counselors (including the pastor). that her problems, which had contributed to her divorces, were the result of a generational curse caused by her parents neglect, sins, and failures. Forget the fact that her parents and two older sisters were faithful, balanced Christians with happy marriages. I was close to the family and observed how she soon became estranged from them.

She became the glowing project of the church, their crown of success, and were determined, I felt, to make her their trophy and she was soon alienated from everyone but members of the church.

Eventually, a serious alcoholic fresh from prison and rehab began attending the church. He became their next project and soon prophecies were going forth that God had put this damaged couple together for His divine purpose and He had a glorious ministry ahead for them “that would effect thousands”. But I knew that the “delivered” alcoholic had been picked up by the police for public intoxication on two separate occasions and feeling that they were about to make a serious mistake I went to the pastor on behalf of the family who could not get an audience with him. He was going through his mid-life crisis at the time, complete with motorcycle and bandana, and I confronted him about the seriousness of the unwise advice his members were giving this crippled pair who need professional help, not pop-theology, and not marriage. He laughed at me, told me that I was not their God, and that the church was on track with God and them, and that maybe I should mind my own business.

I told him some things, too.

The end result was that this broken couple married within months. It soon became obvious that he would not find work, he wrecked their only car while driving DUI, was seen by me purchasing beer at a local convenience store, and they were stuck in grim poverty. Within two years they were divorced.

The pastor, a father of two young boys, himself soon fell into a sordid and scandalous affair with (you guessed it) his blond college-aged secretary , left his family, the church and our community; sought and gained a divorce; and married the young woman.

The wounded church hung on for a time as members left one by one until finally they dissolved and a remnant reorganized under another name. But to this day they cannot shake the stigma of all they did to damage not only themselves but the work of the kingdom in our community.

This is a personal example of why I resist trendy ministries and fad doctrines. They are deadly and never accomplish the good they claim.

What do you think?

\o/

 

SharonL

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The people that walk around saying they have a word from God and always speaking out words do so much damage. I have witnessed it many, many times.

The people receiving the words do not test the spirits and try to fit their lives into the words with disasterous results.

One in particular I know is about the same as what you said - she got a word that she would marry soon - Now this is someone that has followed Jesus and was a prophet in her own right. Well she believed it so much that she went out looking for her husband.

A very sad situation now as she is always giving words that are not from God, she is not hearing right from the Lord, her walk is not right, she has turned into a jealous, hateful, bitter person.

We have to be careful in giving "Words" and receiving "Words" - we must test the spirits.
 
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LeeS

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I tend to agree with you Jim. I have seen the prophetic used for good though. For the building and lifting up of the body. For incouraging and guidence. However, when it gets to where people are being TOLD via prophesy whom and when to marry and their being put into positions of authority via prophesy and the same prophesys are said over the same people week after week after week and things don't work out and then people are sorta cast to the wayside and they are hurt. I hate to say it but it seems to become a bit stale. Somehow I don't believe thats what God intended in the usage of the prophetic giftings.
 
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marciebaby

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We were going through some financial difficulties, and a man we knew came up to us and said that "God told" him to give us money, so he handed over a check, and we were very grateful. Apparently "God" forgot to tell him that his account was in the red. The check bounced and we were stuck with the fees.

That being said, I do believe that God can speak to us in this modern age, but we need to be careful to test what is being said, and not to become prideful when a few things work out our way.

How does one differentiate between what is "trendy" and what is not?
 
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JimB

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9-iron said:
Why is this a common theme is so many non-denom and charismatic churches. I'm saying they are all this way, but there does seem to be a trend to whatever degree.
There was a certain smugness in the Pentecostal church I was nurtured in (and spend decades trying to deprogram) that those “denominal” people were poison (leaven) and we were to stay away from them – come out from among them and be separate, we were taught. We saw ourselves as “Full” Gospel and them as less than full. We were Spirit-“filled”; ergo, they were less than filled. We had a side to us that said we were superior, but we secretly felt inferior because we thought them more sophisticated, better educated, more worldly-wise, so we demonized them, I think, to make ourselves feel better about ourselves. It was a schizophrenic superiority/inferiority complex.
It was us vs. them.
So, we were not allowed to associate with "them", attend their movies or ballgames, enjoy their entertainment, etc. Every activity was centered around the church – in-church volleyball (endless volleyball, sheesh!), socials, youth rallies, revivals, campmeetings, etc.

We acted, I think, in a lot of ways like a cult. Looking back, it scares me.

\o/





 
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Trish1947

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I agree Jim. Isn't most prophacy in the general edification. To edify the body of Christ. Words of encouragement. There are less prophacies concerning certain individuals that will produce a total life change. I am suspect when a person is prophacied over, particularly only one of a married couple, and the other mate has no idea whats going on, neither feels led to do such a thing, received no confimation or prophacy at all. I have seen quite a few couples have problems with this. I have found that most that have received a personal prophacy is already being guided in that direction to begin with, by the Holy Spirit, and it confirms what they already know. And will usually have at least two other confirmations of it, hopefully by people that don't know each other.
 
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NacDan

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Isaiah 14:12-14 NASB said:
"How you have fallen from heaven, O star of the morning, son of the dawn! You have been cut down to the earth, You who have weakened the nations! "But you said in your heart, 'I will ascend to heaven; I will raise my throne above the stars of God, And I will sit on the mount of assembly In the recesses of the north. 'I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High.'
I translate that last sentance "I will make myself god" (personal translation).​

Seems to me the "gift of prophecy" is much over used and much misunderstood. We all have thoughts and opinions on what is going on around us. The problem is when we decide that we are so in tune with the Holy Spirit that we believe every thought we have is a Word from God, when in fact, it's a word from god. Nothing new about this.

People claiming to be prophets use that status to do three things:
1) foretell other's fortunes,
2) control others (God said for you to do this...),
3) (and this ought to be first on the list), make themselves out to be somehow more favored by God than you.

All this makes me so mad I could eat fried chicken.​

1 Corinthians 14:3 NASB said:
But one who prophesies speaks to men for edification and exhortation and consolation.

Nuff said.

Danny
 
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Imagsusman

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Jim M said:
.

What do you think?

\o/

While I "hear" what your saying and certainly agree that this particular instance was certainly not a God breathed prophetic word, I would caution you or anyone else for that matter to not despise prophesying.(1Thes 5:20)..The deep rooted problem lies with people allowing a little to much worldy thought to stay prominent in their lives...What I mean by this is that In the kingdom of God we are all equal. Some may have been given more talents(gifts etc) than others but they were all given for the edification of the body of Christ as a whole that we may be conformed to the image of Jesus..(Eph 4:12-13)..To whom much is given much shall be required(Luke 12:48), but in no way does that make the "more gifted" person above, or more valuable to the Lord...Many people still want to put a minister or prophet up on some sort of pedestal within their minds because of this worldy thought(the old man)....Couple that with certain supposed leaders who wish the prideful "preminance" among others, and you have a disater waiting to happen...Jesus gave a direct commandment to "take heed that no man deceive you"(Matt 24:4) to each and every indivigual..For the weaker within the body who cant see these things, its nice to see another brother in the Lord stand up for them...However Jim, I hope Im not discerning a cynical attitude towards the gifts of the Spirit...BTW brother, a motorcylce and bandana doesnt necessarily constitute a "mid-life" crisis...IT may very well be a wish to get to heaven quicker....lol
 
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rhemarob

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Sounds like that church was based on popular trends instead of The Word and sound doctrine.
As far as the generational curse thing, it is an enabler for many people since they now have an excuse for their past and present behavior, so instead of confronting the sin in their lives and doing something about it, there are no accountability issues, it makes people happy to have an excuse, instead of changing they get to blame the bad old devil and great grandpa, after all great grandpa used to steal chickens and thats why I'm a thief, its not my fault,
give me a break.
And the wayward prophecy free for all is a for sure way to collapse a church, lets face the harsh reality, most people in the church aren't really that spiritual to begin with so you end up with a bunch of spiritual babies running around giving advice to other spiritual babies and blaming it on God.
Its too bad the pastor was too busy with his mid life crisis to take charge and be the leader.
 
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LeeS

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Imagsusman said:
While I "hear" what your saying and certainly agree that this particular instance was certainly not a God breathed prophetic word, I would caution you or anyone else for that matter to not despise prophesying.(1Thes 5:20)..The deep rooted problem lies with people allowing a little to much worldy thought to stay prominent in their lives...What I mean by this is that In the kingdom of God we are all equal. Some may have been given more talents(gifts etc) than others but they were all given for the edification of the body of Christ as a whole that we may be conformed to the image of Jesus..(Eph 4:12-13)..To whom much is given much shall be required(Luke 12:48), but in no way does that make the "more gifted" person above, or more valuable to the Lord...Many people still want to put a minister or prophet up on some sort of pedestal within their minds because of this worldy thought(the old man)....Couple that with certain supposed leaders who wish the prideful "preminance" among others, and you have a disater waiting to happen...Jesus gave a direct commandment to "take heed that no man deceive you"(Matt 24:4) to each and every indivigual..For the weaker within the body who cant see these things, its nice to see another brother in the Lord stand up for them...However Jim, I hope Im not discerning a cynical attitude towards the gifts of the Spirit...BTW brother, a motorcylce and bandana doesnt necessarily constitute a "mid-life" crisis...IT may very well be a wish to get to heaven quicker....lol

I for one love the prophetic but to me it's a bit disturbing when those who misunderstand it use it as the only means of guidence over their own personal time with God. I will never forget the time I was part of a prophetic team and the woman interrupted what God was saying to tell us all she wanted to know was "is my marriage over?". I looked at her and said, "we're not psychics"

I did not see a seperation of people from their families in the church I attended. In fact, for the most part I saw exactly the opposite. People generally became closer to their families and were soon bringing them with them into fellowship with the Lord. What Jim has described does sound cultic but I don't believe that is the norm. At least not the ones I have seen and/or been part of.

Of course I have also known that what was said prophetically was NOT even close to what the person prophesied to said was said. :( That was why we taped all prophecies. Frequently people only hear what they want to hear and then when things soured they would say "well you said". We'd dig out the tape and listen and we did NOT say, that was just what they heard.

So it can work both ways.
 
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SavedByGrace3

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Nice little story Jim. Witches have been burned for less...
Lets get a mob and "deal" with these folk they way only a mob can!
Thank God rational people base their decisions on something more than this.
Anecdotal evidence that seems to condemn or support a teaching is meaningless. Supporters of such teaching will match you story for story. So what?! Go to any mental asylum or institution of higher learning and you will find similar stories that would seem to support the idea the Christianity itself is harmful and even deadly. Are we going to believe them simply based on some bad experiences?
All the devil would have to do is trump up a few more of these little "incidents".... and we could shut down the church altogether.
Come to think of it....
Hmmmm...

If you have scriptural or logical evidence that disputes (or supports) your position... then feel free to present it.
But "little stories" are a dime a dozen. And there are too many people all to ready and willing to believe them.
 
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Imagsusman

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hobart schmedly said:
Nice little story Jim. Witches have been burned for less...
Lets get a mob and "deal" with these folk they way only a mob can!
Thank God rational people base their decisions on something more than this.
Anecdotal evidence that seems to condemn or support a teaching is meaningless. Supporters of such teaching will match you story for story. So what?! Go to any mental asylum or institution of higher learning and you will find similar stories that would seem to support the idea the Christianity itself is harmful and even deadly. Are we going to believe them simply based on some bad experiences?
All the devil would have to do is trump up a few more of these little "incidents".... and we could shut down the church altogether.
Come to think of it....
Hmmmm...

If you have scriptural or logical evidence that disputes (or supports) your position... then feel free to present it.
But "little stories" are a dime a dozen. And there are too many people are all to ready and willing to believe them.

lol...hobart...I notice you and Jim differ on many things across many threads...do you guys follow each other around?...hehehe
 
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SavedByGrace3

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Imagsusman said:
lol...hobart...I notice you and Jim differ on many things across many threads...do you guys follow each other around?...hehehe

Hey..... when I see the baby washing down the hill with the bath water, I can put two and two together.
 
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Trish1947

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Hey, the way I see it..If someone gives me a piano, and tells me I can play it, are we to assume I'll play it perfectly as soon as I sit down? Practice, practice, practice. Don't I learn the notes, then play that note, then make a cord, then play that cord, then learn a melody, then play the whole song? Or do I pitch the piano out in the yard and say there's something wrong with the piano? If I hit a sour note, there's no reason you can't recognize it when you hear it. I don't think we are born tone deaf.

Sorry people, but for some reason I'm into analogies this week.
 
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Imagsusman

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Trish1947 said:
Hey, the way I see it..If someone gives me a piano, and tells me I can play it, are we to assume I'll play it perfectly as soon as I sit down? Practice, practice, practice. Don't I learn the notes, then play that note, then make a cord, then play that cord, then learn a melody, then play the whole song? Or do I pitch the piano out in the yard and say there's something wrong with the piano? If I hit a sour note, there's no reason you can't recognize it when you hear it. I don't think we are born tone deaf.

Sorry people, but for some reason I'm into analogies this week.

A very good anology though Trish..:thumbsup:
 
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Andrew

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Nothing to do with trendy or fad doctrines but common spiritual sense.

Whether a church is trendy or not, mega or tiny, if the leaders use prophecy to direct your life, alarm bells should go off and you better check your spirit to see if its just a confirmation of what God has already been telling you, or absolute rubbish.

Not too long ago in Spore, a lady who wasn't really mentally sound stabbed a pastor. Thank God he did not die. It all started when someone prophesied to her that she would marry so and so. Of course, when that man married someone else, she flipped...
 
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Questioning Christian

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Andrew said:
Not too long ago in Spore, a lady who wasn't really mentally sound stabbed a pastor. Thank God he did not die. It all started when someone prophesied to her that she would marry so and so. Of course, when that man married someone else, she flipped...

That was due to her mental instability ... not due to false prophecy.

I hear these stories, "Well, they picked on so-and-so until he flipped and went postal, and said he killed his coworkers because they made fun of him."

No, stupid, you killed because you have a killing mechanism inside you. A lot of people get made fun of who never kill anyone.
 
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