Why Do We Have An Alter?

CalledOutOne

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The alter is at the front of the church.

Here's a good example of one.
IMG_3056.JPG
 
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hedrick

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Sorry, that's not an altar. It's a communion table, or a place to put the Bible, or a fancy flower stand. That's really the official answer. Calvinists don't have altars.

I will say that that particular flower stand looks more like an altar than I would prefer. My own church (PCUSA) has a raised pulpit at the front, with the choir in front of that. In front of the choir there's a rail, with something that is clearly a communion table in front of the rail. My preference is that any table should be pretty obvious as a communion table.
 
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Why on earth do Protestant churches today have altars?

That is a huge generalisation, and also incorrect.

There are somethings that must be noted;

  1. Some protestant denominations advocate the inclusion of an altar in the church, eg High Anglicans.
  2. Some proestant denominations are apostate
  3. Many protestants have a table at the front of their building that serves several purposes, eg holding the communion elements, the flowers, etc.
 
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file13

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The alter was used in the Temple. Do you see a temple? I sure don't.

I'm not going to argue for having an altar in Protestant churches (I'm with hedrick here), but I did want to point out that this statement is not entirely accurate. Yes, there was an altar in the temple, but it's not the only place we find God pleasing altars. There were also altars where there were no temples, and in John's Revelation, we find altars in heaven.
 
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CalledOutOne

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I'm not going to argue for having an altar in Protestant churches (I'm with hedrick here), but I did want to point out that this statement is not entirely accurate. Yes, there was an altar in the temple, but it's not the only place we find God pleasing altars. There were also altars where there were no temples, and in John's Revelation, we find altars in heaven.

That's pretty interesting.
 
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CalledOutOne

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That is a huge generalisation, and also incorrect.

There are somethings that must be noted;

  1. Some protestant denominations advocate the inclusion of an altar in the church, eg High Anglicans.
  2. Some proestant denominations are apostate
  3. Many protestants have a table at the front of their building that serves several purposes, eg holding the communion elements, the flowers, etc.

Many Southern Baptist (even Reformed) have altars in the Church. There's a sermon Paul Washer was preaching and some woman came to the front of the church to cry on the altar and Elder Paul told her, "Don't touch the altar of God."

That is really disappointing seeing how even parts of the Reformed crowd have these.
 
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Philonephius

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Many Southern Baptist (even Reformed) have altars in the Church. There's a sermon Paul Washer was preaching and some woman came to the front of the church to cry on the altar and Elder Paul told her, "Don't touch the altar of God."

That is really disappointing seeing how even parts of the Reformed crowd have these.

What is the problem with alters? I guess I never paid attention. It seems like there are bigger problems in Christianity today than alters (assuming alters are a problem to begin with, which I fail to see).
 
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CalledOutOne

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What is the problem with alters? I guess I never paid attention. It seems like there are bigger problems in Christianity today than alters (assuming alters are a problem to begin with, which I fail to see).

There are bigger problems and there are other threads about those bigger problems.

I see this to be a big problem. Unless you are making sacrifices, I don't see why an altar should be used. When did Christians start putting these in their churches?
 
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mothcorrupteth

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CalledOutOne,

The history of the altar goes a little something like this. In the earliest years of the church, when celebrating the Lord's Supper, they tried to imitate the sequence of events on the night on which Jesus was betrayed. That included the use of a table when celebrating the Supper. The communicants would actually literally come to the table and stand or sit around it as they received the Elements.

It's not known exactly why the shift was made to having the communicants receive the Elements away from the table, but it is known that starting in the 6th century churches began restricting laypersons from approaching the table, and that is where the rails were introduced that are still often included in many churches: to keep people out of the table "zone."

Incidentally, for reasons I'm not entirely clear on, they called their tables "altars." This would later become a sticking point during the Reformation, because the Roman Catholics could point back to antiquity and say, "See? Proof that the Holy Church has always regarded it as an unbloody sacrifice! It's an altar!" Thus, many Protestants, in reforming the practice, insisted on calling it the Lord's Table, as per the first letter to the Corinthians. Naturally, though, less reformed churches, such as the Church of England, the Methodists, and the Lutherans, had fewer scruples about calling it an altar, and they continue to do so to this day.

But within Reformed circles, here is what I imagine has taken place. (This part of the history I don't know; I only speculate.) You Reformed Baptists started out as Puritans, and the Puritans started out in the Church of England. When the Puritans tried to find unity with the Church of Scotland during the English Civil War, there was a big row at the Westminster Assembly over the Scottish practice of celebrating the Supper at a single table, dividing the church into installments to accommodate numbers. The Puritans, much like the Baptists of today, were congregationalist. They were mortally offended that anyone would suggest splitting up the congregation, because they believed the proper "seat" of the ordinance wasn't in just any group of Christians gathered together but in an entire congregation. So they retained the practice of putting the table up front for show, but had the minister walk up and down the aisle with the bread and cup to distribute them. What I'm guessing happened, is both the tradition of calling it an altar and of taking communion in the pews got passed down to the early Reformed Baptists and was just reinforced later on as they started to sing Anglican and Methodist hymns and interact with Anglican and Methodist theology during the revivals of the Great Awakenings.
 
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Philonephius

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There are bigger problems and there are other threads about those bigger problems.

I see this to be a big problem. Unless you are making sacrifices, I don't see why an altar should be used. When did Christians start putting these in their churches?

Alright. On what do you suggest the communion bread and wine be presented? What if we were to call it a table instead of an alter; would it be okay then? This seems to be more a matter of semantics than anything else.
 
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Eddie L

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Alright. On what do you suggest the communion bread and wine be presented? What if we were to call it a table instead of an alter; would it be okay then? This seems to be more a matter of semantics than anything else.

I kind of agree. To me an "altar" is a piece of religious furniture that looks like a table. Unless people treat it like some kind of holy of holies, I could care less what it's called.
 
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I kind of agree. To me an "altar" is a piece of religious furniture that looks like a table. Unless people treat it like some kind of holy of holies, I could care less what it's called.

Let's be clear on what an alter actually is! An altar is a place of offering sacrifice and the name signifies the purpose. If you place the communion elements upon an alter you are performing "the mass" and resacrificing Christ - rightly or wrongly that is the issue many reformed folk have an 'alter'
 
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Eddie L

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Reformed Baptist 1689 said:
Let's be clear on what an alter actually is! An altar is a place of offering sacrifice and the name signifies the purpose. If you place the communion elements upon an alter you are performing "the mass" and resacrificing Christ - rightly or wrongly that is the issue many reformed folk have an 'alter'

if people in a church think of an altar as being a place of sacrifice, then there is a problem. If they think of it as a fancy table, then they're isn't one.
 
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if people in a church think of an altar as being a place of sacrifice, then there is a problem. If they think of it as a fancy table, then they're isn't one.

If they think of it as a fancy table then why don't they call it 'a fancy table' rather then an 'altar'? Better yet why have a fancy table, not a plain and simple one, if any at all?
 
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Eddie L

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If they think of it as a fancy table then why don't they call it 'a fancy table' rather then an 'altar'? Better yet why have a fancy table, not a plain and simple one, if any at all?

Most of the words for these kinds of things are passed via traditions, not definitions. If my grandfather called it an "alter", I might also, even if I don't know what "altar" means. :)
 
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Most of the words for these kinds of things are passed via traditions, not definitions. If my grandfather called it an "alter", I might also, even if I don't know what "altar" means. :)

But is the moto of the reformed, 'reformed, always reforming' shouldn't traditions be challenged by each new generation if we are true to our reformed heritage?

Not to mention the fact that all a christain has to do is read there bible and they will soon see what an alter is, and if they read Hebrews they will see who that alter now is.

I don't buy ignorence as an acceptable reason, sorry :D
 
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Eddie L

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Reformed Baptist 1689 said:
But is the moto of the reformed, 'reformed, always reforming' shouldn't traditions be challenged by each new generation if we are true to our reformed heritage?

Not to mention the fact that all a christain has to do is read there bible and they will soon see what an alter is, and if they read Hebrews they will see who that alter now is.

I don't buy ignorence as an acceptable reason, sorry :D

sin comes from the heart. Traditions that create rules should always be reformed because these create legalists, who are sinnimg in their hearts. Unless someone is actually offering sacrifices on an altar, it is just some sticks of wood with a religious name, which means the hearts of the worshipers are not sinning. If there is no sin in the heart, then there are more important things to worry about.

I'm no authority, but that is what I think about it.
 
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hedrick

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Most of the words for these kinds of things are passed via traditions, not definitions. If my grandfather called it an "alter", I might also, even if I don't know what "altar" means. :)

I agree with this. I've often heard Presbyterians call something an altar even when it's clear from the design that it's intended to be a communion table. Most Protestants think "altar" simply means "big table at the front of a church." This is largely harmless in practice.

There is a substantial difference between Reformed and Catholic theology on what happens at communion. If "altar" is used with its traditional meaning of a place of sacrifice, we should object. But the meaning of words change, and I don't think it's worth raising an objection if it's clear that the community isn't in danger of confusing what is actually going on.
 
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