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Who are the Israelites in Scripture???

Discussion in 'Exposition & Bible Study' started by airren1, Nov 21, 2005.

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  1. airren1

    airren1 New Member

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    Who are the True Israelites



    I am not starting this thread to start any unnecessary debates about who the true Israelites are, the scriptures are clear on this matter. I am simply trying to hear what others take is on the subject about who the true Israelites are. I am not asking you to agree with me because I want you to, but to search, pray, and fast so that you can rightly divide truth from the lies of this world. No one can worship the Creator without truth and spirit, and anyone doing so does it in vain. Please avoid letting your personal feelings interfere with the information. YHWH is not prejudiced and the spirit of truth and love reside with him.



    Most scriptural student knows that although the earth belongs to YHWH, it is ruled by Satan, the adversary who is also called the devil, and we know that he has deceived the whole world, Rev. 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. As servants of YHWH, we are to have no dealings with the affairs of this world because we already know that our treasures are not here. We are not to deal with politics, love money, prejudice, hatred, wars (soldiers), or anything else, although we live here. Servants of YHWH is the opposite of what this world stands for, and everything in it! That is why they will be persecuted because they are not to be as the average person of the world.



    My point is that YHWH lets us know that so that we are not seduced by the false teachings of man. We know that Egypt was the land of Ham, Psalm 105:23 "ISRAEL ALSO CAME INTO EGYPT; AND SOJOURNED IN THE LAND OF HAM (KHAWM)." , Psalms 105:27"THEY SHOWED HIS SIGNS AMONG THEM, AND WONDERS IN THE LAND OF HAM [KHAWM)." It is known and accepted that Ham's descendants are black people. Also, it is worthwhile to point out that the ancient Egyptians were a black people as science even acknowledges.



    Anyway, by scripture, it shows us that the Israelites and the Egyptians were a indistinguishable people. When Joseph's ten brothers came into Egypt they were brought before him. Joseph recognized his brothers, but they didn't recognize him (Genesis 42:1-8). Also, when the great patriarch Israel (Jacob) died, even the other inhabitants of the land, the Canaanites which are also a black people decended from Cush's son Canaan, could not distinguish the Egyptians from the Israelites, Gen. 50:7-11 And Joseph went up to bury his father: and with him went up all the servants of Pharaoh, the elders of his house, and all the elders of the land of Egypt, 8And all the house of Joseph, and his brethren, and his father's house: only their little ones, and their flocks, and their herds, they left in the land of Goshen. 9And there went up with him both chariots and horsemen: and it was a very great company. 10And they came to the threshingfloor of Atad, which is beyond Jordan, and there they mourned with a great and very sore lamentation: and he made a mourning for his father seven days. 11And when the inhabitants of the land, the Canaanites, saw the mourning in the floor of Atad, they said, This is a grievous mourning to the Egyptians: wherefore the name of it was called Abelmizraim, which is beyond Jordan. Even when the daughters of Midian were helped water their flock by Moses, they mistakenly called him an Egyptian, Ex. 2:19 And they said, An Egyptian delivered us out of the hand of the shepherds, and also drew water enough for us, and watered the flock.



    Furthermore, when Moses, a Hebrew Israelite of the tribe of Levi (exodus 2:1-3), was a child he was rescued by the Pharoah's daughter and raised up in the house as his grandson for 40 years Acts 7:23, Exodus 2: 6, 10, and the black Pharoah of Egypt did not know the difference. It stands to reason that if Pharoah knew Moses was a Hebrew, he would have killed him like all the other Hebrew males at that time. Pharoah only sought to kill Moses after it became clear that Moses was a Hebrew himself, after he had killed an Egyptian for mistreating a Hebrew, Exodus 2:12-15. Yet still we have YHWH turning Moses hand white as a miracle to the Israelites, and to show that YHWH was with the children of Israel, Exodus 4:6-7. There would be no miracle in turning the hand of a white person white. Everytime that Leprosy is mentioned in the scriptures, it is in connection with turning the skin white, Num. 12:1, Lev. 13:2-6.



    Most importantly, we would do well to remember that the Israelites dwelled in a region filled with black people, Ethiopians, Canaanites, Jebusites, Amorites, Egyptians, etc., and in a region where people of lighter complexions did not fare well because they had no melanin to protect their skin from the sun.



    Concerning Yahshua (Jesus), it is important to note that he was sent into Egypt for safety when Herod had ordered all Hebrew males be killed, Matt. 2:13-14. That was because Egypt was a land of blacks like Yahshua and his family, and no one could tell the difference between the Egyptians and the Hebrews. Also in the few accounts where the physical appearance of Jesus is discussed, they always compare him with dark metals and as having wooly hair, Rev. 1:14-15, His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; 15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters, Dan.7:9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire., and Daniel 10:6

    His body also was like the beryl, and his face as the appearance of lightning, and his eyes as lamps of fire, and his arms and his feet like in colour to polished brass, and the voice of his words like the voice of a multitude.




    Moving on I would like to clarify myself even further, everyone who accepts Yashua and keeps the laws and commandments of the Abba can become a part of Israel no matter what color they are. By the mercy and grace of YHWH, Israel and Gentile both have a chance for salvation. We must remember that Yahshua came not to destroy the law but to fulfill it. He was the ultimate ransom and atonement for our sins, and with the shedding of his blood we no longer have to sacrifice animals, but we must still keep the laws and commandments.

    I am aware of the fact that there is continuous controversy over the identity of the biblical Israelites, but if we read the scripture instead of adhereing to the doctrines of man we can discern truth from lies. In Gen. 10, we can read the table of nations, and YHWH tells us who the Gentiles are, The sons of Japheth; Gomer, and Magog, and Madai, and Javan, and Tubal, and Meshech, and Tiras. 3And the sons of Gomer; Ashkenaz, and Riphath, and Togarmah. 4And the sons of Javan; Elishah, and Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim. 5By these were the isles of the Gentiles divided in their lands; every one after his tongue, after their families, in their nations. Diligent research, not just my word, will support the fact that these are all lands where the people are "white". Further research will conclude righteously that the beginning of civilization lies in Africa.

    Scripture also tells us that Abraham knew that his descendants would be strangers in a land where they would be oppressed for 400 yrs, Gen.15:13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years;, and contrary to popular belief, that was not fulfilled anywhere in scripture. For the first part of Israel's sojourn in Egypt, Joseph was in good favor with the Pharoah, and not until after Joseph died, a Pharoah who had not known him enslaved Israel Ex. 1:8-11 Now there arose up a new king over Egypt, which knew not Joseph. 9And he said unto his people, Behold, the people of the children of Israel are more and mightier than we: 10Come on, let us deal wisely with them; lest they multiply, and it come to pass, that, when there falleth out any war, they join also unto our enemies, and fight against us, and so get them up out of the land. 11Therefore they did set over them taskmasters to afflict them with their burdens. And they built for Pharaoh treasure cities, Pithom and Raamses. It is without a doubt that Israel spent many years enslaved by Egypt, but not 400.

    After Moses had led his people to freedom, while in the wilderness they made a convenant with YHWH Ex. 19:5,8, and was told of all the great things that would happen to them if they lived righteously Lev. 26:1-13, but they were also told of what would happen if they broke the convenant of YHWH Lev 26:14-46, and again in Deu. 28 YHWH goes over both the blessings and the curses. These blessings and cursings are put upon Israel only.

    Furthermore, it was prophesied that Israel was to enter into Egypt again, this time by way of ship. Deuteronomy Chapter 28 Verse 68, which states :"And Yah shall bring you into Egypt again with SHIPS, by the way whereof I spake unto you, You shall see it no more again and there you shall be sold unto your enemies as bondmen and bondwomen and no man shall buy (redeem)you. Egypt is used as a symbol of bondage and oppression, Egypt is called The House Of Bondage (Ex 13:3,14 / 20:4,- DEUT 5:6 / 7:8 / 26:6), The Iron Furnace (DEUT 4:20), Furnace of Affliction (Isaiah 48:10), which are all synonymous with hard slavery.

    It is very interesting to note that the similarities between Israels first captivity and their last captivity are striking. Israelites went into bondage several times throughout history because of their disobediance. The Ishmaelites (Arabs)sold Joseph into slavery just as they sold the Hebrews into slavery to the Americas, they both had taskmasters (overseers) set over them, both had their names changed, and both built great cities among several other similarities that are to long to discuss at this time.

    Yashua was sent to the lost sheep of Israel, as we both know, and it is through Israel that all others can reach salvation. Israel was supposed to be a nation of priests that failed in it's duty by worshipping idols and practicing false religions. It was only Hebrew Israelites that were the disciples of Yahshua. They were not even allowed to go unto the other nations until they went to Israel. Israel had to know first.

    Israel has had a very difficult time and fail to prosper because of their disloyalty to YHWH. As a matter of fact, they are at the bottom in every aspect in society. They are the most disease- stricken, poverty- stricken, oppressed people who still refuse to see the error of their ways and turn back to the Most High. It is time that these facts and the reasoning surrounding them are brought to the light. As I said earlier, I am not here to present these facts to make anyone feel low. We know that YHWH has set Israel forward to be an example to the other nations, but they have failed in their duty which has caused them to be scattered from one end of the earth to the other Deu. 28:64 "AND YHWH SHALL SCATTER YOU AMONG ALL PEOPLE, FROM ONE END OF THE EARTH EVEN UNTO THE OTHER; AND THERE YOU SHALL SERVE GODS WHICH NEITHER YOU NOR YOUR FATHERS HAVE KNOWN, WOOD AND STONE. That is also why they have lost their identities as a people, Deu. 28:37AND YOU SHALL BECOME AN ASTONISHMENT, A PROVERB, AND BYWORD, AMONG ALL NATIONS WHERE YHWH SHALL LEAD YOU, and,PSALM83:1-4, KEEP NOT YOUR SILENCE, O YHWH HOLD NOT YOUR PEACE, AND BE NOT STILL O YHWH.2. FOR, LO, YOUR ENEMIES MAKE A TUMULT AND THEY THAT HATE YOU HAVE LIFTED UP THE HEAD. 3 THEY HAVE TAKEN CRAFTY COUNSEL AGAINST YOUR PEOPLE, AND CONSULTED AGAINST YOUR HIDDEN ONES. 4. THEY HAVE SAID, COME LETS CUT THEM OFF FROM BEING A NATION SO THAT THE NAME OF ISRAEL MAY BE NO MORE IN REMEMBRANCE . Isn't it ironic how out of all the nations of people in the world, the "blacks" have no knowledge of who they are, or where they came from. It is like their history has been erased. YHWH says that He will put these things upon Israel for a sign and wonder always, if the children of Israel did not listen to His laws and statutes, Deu. 28:45 Moreover all these curses shall come upon thee, and shall pursue thee, and overtake thee, till thou be destroyed; because thou hearkenedst not unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to keep his commandments and his statutes which he commanded thee: 46And they shall be upon thee for a sign and for a wonder, and upon thy seed for ever.


    YHWH is good and perfect in all his ways and He knows that we as a people have been utterly deceived, as a matter of fact he gave us up to our own reprobate minds, Romans 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves. Rev. 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. The "Jews" are not who the world thinks they are, Rev. 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan, and Rev. 3:9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. Who will be a servant of YHWH to do as he wants, and who will reach salvation through the spirit and truth that is in Him?
     
  2. MrJim

    MrJim Well-Known Member

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    I tend to believe that the church is the new israel but I am not dogmatic on the subject.
     
  3. GraceInHim

    GraceInHim † Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

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    Eziekel 36-the end of it - shows all Israel in the latter years - one already happened in 1948
     
  4. arunma

    arunma Flaming Calvinist

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    Well Menno, I believe that the church is (and always has been) Israel, and I am dogmatic on the subject! But hey, maybe I'm just an overzealous youngin.

    What? That's not true at all. It's well known that the Africans came from Africa. And the history of the Africans is quite well known. Several of the early church fathers, including Saint Athanasius, were from Africa. The Ethiopian whom Philip baptized converted his nation to Christianity. So Africa is rather prominent in the history of the Christian church. I have no idea why you make this claim.

    Most of your thesis is destroyed by the fact that even if the Israelites were Africans, Africans were not all Israelites. You'd have a hard time convincing me that Western and Southern Africans were part of the children of Israel.
     
  5. airren1

    airren1 New Member

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    That is very interesting, but do you have any scriptural verses to back that up? Without a doubt anyone who comes in through the front door, Yahshua(Jesus) and does the will of the Abba (Father) can be an Israelite, but where do you get the notion that there is a new Israel when Israel has never ceased to exist?

    Jeremiah 31:37
    Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD.

    Yashua allowed others to become a part of Israel, but they were never cast away, but we all know that neither the heaven or beneath earth can be measured, so Israel remains.
     
  6. arunma

    arunma Flaming Calvinist

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    These Scriptures, among many others, show that the church is Israel.
    Remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. (Ephesians 2:12-13)

    There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise. (Galatians 3:28-29)

    For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical. But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God. (Romans 2:28-29)
    The reason I said that Israel has always been the church is because I think that even from the time of Jacob, Israel consisted of those who believed in God's promises by faith. The one who practices the Law of Moses without faith is not an Israelite.

    Anyway, you still haven't shown me why you think that the African people correspond to the Israelites. Mind you, I have no objection to the notion that Israelites were Africans. My problem is with your suggestion that all Africans were Israelites.
     
  7. airren1

    airren1 New Member

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    I never said that all "Africans" are Israelites. What I do know though is that all "Africans" scattered to other nations are Israelites. Furthermore, the continent we know as Africa was named so by the man who "founded" it. Never in scripture was the land referred to as "Africa". If you look closely and read the verses I've quoted EXACTLY, you will see that all curses were brought upon Israel for their indulgences in the worship of idols. Ancient "Africans", and Egyptians practiced Voodoo, and because I don't want to offend anyone I can't name the others, but they practiced several false religions.

    As for the Ethiopian eunuch that was baptized by Philip in Acts 8, he was baptized in the name of Yahshua, remember that the Hebrew disciples were just going around preaching about the Messiah. The eunuch was already a man of faith, as most eunuchs were in that time. Scripture never states that he became a "Christian", as no one was called that at that time, but men simply held onto the faith. We can also tell that the eunuch was an Israelite because only Israelites went to Jerusalem, the Holy City, to worship in the Temple that was eventually destroyed.
     
  8. airren1

    airren1 New Member

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    I would like to clear up the fact that not all "Africans" are Israelites. The Israelites were scattered all over the earth when they went into captivity by ship.

    In Ephesians, Brother Paul was speaking to the Gentile nations, which were alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the promise, as YHWH's covenant was for Israel only, and they were to avoid strangers, not for so- called race, but because strangers did not know YHWH. By the blood of Yahshua all nations who were far off had a chance to obtain salvation.

    Galatians simply is telling them once again that anyone who walks with Yashua in truth, love, and obediance can have a part of the inheritance that YHWH had given to Israel. We must remember that there were quite a few false doctrines, and the Pharisees for example tried to keep others away from the promise, but this letter helped clear things up.

    Again, because of the matter of circumcision, Israelites performed this procedure as part of the covenant made with Abraham by YHWH, and other nations did not, Paul was telling the Romans that it does not matter if one is circumcised. He was addressing the false teachers who were telling people that because they were not circumcised they could not be a part of the covenant. He was also telling him that just because one is circumcised meant little, and what mattered was whether or not their hearts was with YHWH, and they did the will of the Father. If they did, then YHWH would bless them.

    Israel was and still is the countless decendants of Jacob, who was renamed Israel, and his 12 sons. As you said, faith without works is dead, and vice versa. Just because Israel is so by flesh does not save them. They must turn back to YHWH, accept their punishment, confess their sins, and walk righteously just like anyone else.

    Lev. 26:40-43 If they shall confess their iniquity, and the iniquity of their fathers, with their trespass which they trespassed against me, and that also they have walked contrary unto me; 41And that I also have walked contrary unto them, and have brought them into the land of their enemies; if then their uncircumcised hearts be humbled, and they then accept of the punishment of their iniquity: 42Then will I remember my covenant with Jacob, and also my covenant with Isaac, and also my covenant with Abraham will I remember; and I will remember the land. 43.The land also shall be left of them, and shall enjoy her sabbaths, while she lieth desolate without them: and they shall accept of the punishment of their iniquity: because, even because they despised my judgments, and because their soul abhorred my statutes.
     
  9. airren1

    airren1 New Member

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    First let me say that I do not dislike the "Jews" as that would be unfitting as a servant of YHWH. I know and wholeheartedly accept the fact that ANYONE who loves the Son, obeys the Father, and keeps the commandments of YHWH can be grafted into Israel. YHWH is merciful and full of grace, Amen.

    What part are you talking about? If it's the part that says their desolate land will be inhabited once more all I can say is don't believe the hype because the State of Israel is not the same as the country of Israel,and isn't it something how they are called Israelis and not Israelites. Satan can only imitate YHWH who he wishes he were, but he cannot create, he can only deceive by manipulating what is already here. The "Jews" also do not encompass all the land promised to Abraham either. Furthermore, you can easily count the "Jews" can't you? Does YHWH lie? Does He not promise that the seed of Abraham will be countless. Yet still we do good to see that the "Jews" have not fit neither the blessing or the curses attributed to the Isralites of the Bible. They are neither the highest nation or the lowest, and Israel will be one or the other according to Lev. 26, and Deu 28..

    I do not want to be accused of saying that anyone is not who they say they are because who am I to judge, but it is a blessing how accurate scripture remains, especially concerning these last days and the people of the world:

    2 Timothy 3



    1This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.



    2For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,

    3Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, no self- control, fierce, despisers of those that are good,

    4Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;

    5Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

    6For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,

    7Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

    8Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.

    9But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as their's also was.

    10But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,

    11Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.

    12Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

    13But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

    14But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;

    15And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

    16All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
     
  10. arunma

    arunma Flaming Calvinist

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    Well, that's also a problem. Please show me why the Western Africans who were enslaved were of Israelite descent.

    This much is true.

    So you make the connection because both Israelites and Africans practiced idolatry? Many nations practiced idolatry in that time. In fact, the Romans were steeped in idolatry, and it was for this reason that Peter called Rome Babylon (early Christians were extremely familiar with the Old Testament, and Babylon is the nation that held Israel in captivity). To this day, the Hindus in India practice the most wicked of idolatry, and they persecute the Indian church. So why do you make the connection between Africans and Israelites?

    Then this damages your claim, because the Ethiopeans were never enslaved by Americans. So does that make Ethiopeans Israelites, or not?

    By the way, the term Christian was used in Biblical times.
    So Barnabas went to Tarsus to look for Saul, and when he had found him, he brought him to Antioch. For a whole year they met with the church and taught a great many people. And in Antioch the disciples were first called Christians. (Acts 11:25-26)

     
  11. GraceInHim

    GraceInHim † Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

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    I read Prophecies and see clearly what is going on - from the past to the future - and That is where Jesus is returning - no doubt - will not say otherwise - and there are Jews there now from all over the world - just because they do not know Jesus yet - does not mean they are out - remember what Jesus said - the last will be first - and then why would there be 2 witnesses in Revelation and tell me who are the 12 tribes in Revelation? Also the dry bones in Ezek. ~ are who do not believe about the Messiah - they get flesh and skin and become alive - because God will give them a new heart and soul - they have been blinded - and you know what - there are many Christians who live in Israel - so when I talk about Israel - I do not mean just Jews - believe what you want while I believe as my spirit shows me ~ when I read the Prophets - God says too much for them to just disappear - Gentiles to the fullness?
     
  12. GraceInHim

    GraceInHim † Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

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    who is this - you think it is the Jews - what is this a muslim thread copy and paste? you are referring to a church in Revelation - which the Paul went to - what does that have to do with Israel? - all your post seem to be when they suffered from all the empires - read the Prophets for the latter years - not what the Jews already went through -

    we and Jews will be with The true King Jesus

    I see where Hitler came from - :scratch:
     
  13. GraceInHim

    GraceInHim † Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

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    It shall come to pass in that day that the LORD shall set His hand again the second time to recover the remnant of His people who are left, from Assyria and Egypt, from Pathros and Cush, from Elam and Shinar, from Hamath and the islands of the sea. He will set up a banner for the nations, and will assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth. (Isaiah 11:11-12)

    when did this happen?
     
  14. GraceInHim

    GraceInHim † Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

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    latter years God said to the Prophets

    • Dry Bones - The two-phase restoration
    • "To do them good"
    • North: "Give them up!"
    • South: "Do not keep them back!"
    • "I will bring you from the east"
    • "...and gather you from the West
     
  15. GraceInHim

    GraceInHim † Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

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    Gee I wonder who the Bondwoman is? :scratch:

    Gal 4 21Tell me, you who want to be under the law, are you not aware of what the law says? 22For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by the slave woman and the other by the free woman. 23His son by the slave woman was born in the ordinary way; but his son by the free woman was born as the result of a promise.

    24These things may be taken figuratively, for the women represent two covenants. One covenant is from Mount Sinai and bears children who are to be slaves: This is Hagar. 25Now Hagar stands for Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present city of Jerusalem, because she is in slavery with her children. 26But the Jerusalem that is above is free, and she is our mother.

    27For it is written:
    "Be glad, O barren woman,
    who bears no children;
    break forth and cry aloud,
    you who have no labor pains;
    because more are the children of the desolate woman
    than of her who has a husband."
    28Now you, brothers, like Isaac, are children of promise. 29At that time the son born in the ordinary way persecuted the son born by the power of the Spirit. It is the same now. 30But what does the Scripture say? "Get rid of the slave woman and her son, for the slave woman's son will never share in the inheritance with the free woman's son." 31Therefore, brothers, we are not children of the slave woman, but of the free woman.

    what did God say to Abraham concerning Sarah? She will be the mother of???

    It is really sad when people take Israel out of the picture - read what God said about this -
     
  16. airren1

    airren1 New Member

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    I'm sorry, you are correct, the disciples are called Christians in that verse.

    I will stand by my beliefs and in due time, all will know the truth concerning YHWH, and his beloved Son. Scripture shows what would befall the Israelites if they did not keep the covenant they made with YHWH. Subsequently, just as scripture teaches, they were taken into Egypt by ships, Deuteronomy Chapter 28 Verse 68, which states :"And Yah shall bring you into Egypt again with SHIPS, by the way whereof I spake unto you, You shall see it no more again and there you shall be sold unto your enemies as bondmen and bondwomen and no man shall buy (redeem)you. Egypt is used as a symbol of bondage and oppression, Egypt is called The House Of Bondage (Ex 13:3,14 / 20:4,- DEUT 5:6 / 7:8 / 26:6), The Iron Furnace (DEUT 4:20), Furnace of Affliction (Isaiah 48:10), which are all synonymous with hard slavery.
    Just as scripture said they were servants in a strange land for 400 years. It is a fact that at the time of their sojourn in Egypt they were not servants for 400 years, In the beginning of their stay they were friends with the Egyptians, and not until a new king arouse some time later did he make them slave. Please read the first post agin carefully.

    I also know that ALL other nations were practicing idolatry, that is why YHWH choose them for a special people to be an example unto the other nations, ALL the nations were in darkness, but he choose them to be the light, even Yahshua (Jesus) was an Israelite from the house of David, tracing his roots back to Noah.

    1 Peter 2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

    Deu. 14:2 For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God, and the LORD hath chosen thee to be a peculiar people unto himself, above all the nations that are upon the earth.

    1Kings 3:8 And thy servant is in the midst of thy people which thou hast chosen, a great people, that cannot be numbered nor counted for multitude.


    2Chron. 6:6 But I have chosen Jerusalem, that my name might be there; and have chosen David to be over my people Israel.

    Psa. 33:12 Blessed is the nation whose God is the LORD; and the people whom he hath chosen for his own inheritance.

    Just let me ask you honestly, How do you know who the people of the Americas are and what tribes they belonged to when they don't even know? Furthermore, Ethiopians come from the Greek word Aethiops which means burnt faced. Research it yourself if you don't believe me.
     
  17. GraceInHim

    GraceInHim † Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

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    The Book of Amos was likely written between 760 and 753 B.C.

    Amos is a shepherd and a fruit picker from the Judean village of Tekoa when God calls him, even though he lacks an education or a priestly background. Amos' mission was directed to his neighbor to the north, Israel. His messages of impending doom and captivity for the nation because of her sins were largely unpopular and unheeded, however, because not since the days of Solomon have times been so good in Israel. Amos' ministry takes place while Jeroboam II reigns over Israel, and Uzziah reigns over Judah.


    Key Verses: Amos 2:4, "This is what the LORD says: 'For three sins of Judah, even for four, I will not turn back [my wrath]. Because they have rejected the law of the LORD and have not kept his decrees, because they have been led astray by false gods, the gods their ancestors followed."

    Amos 3:7, "Surely the Sovereign LORD does nothing without revealing His plan to His servants the prophets."

    Amos 9:14, "I will bring back my exiled people Israel; they will rebuild the ruined cities and live in them. They will plant vineyards and drink their wine; they will make gardens and eat their fruit."

    When did this happen 1948 ~ or we can say it never happnened and say it will take place in the end times ~ but I think he would of mentioned more ~ Israel has become a nation through the UN in 1948 and since then the land has prospered ~ but Zechariah's 14 writings of the lord have not occurred yet.

     
  18. GraceInHim

    GraceInHim † Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

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    The Jews would have Israel again as their own country, again
    Examples: Amos 9:14-15, Ezekiel 4:3-6, Ezekiel 11:17, Ezekiel 36:24, Ezekiel 37:10-14, Ezekiel 37:15-19, Ezekiel 37:21-22, Genesis 15:18, Genesis 28:10-15, Genesis 35:9-12, Isaiah 66:7-8, Jeremiah 16:14-15, Jeremiah 32:44, Micah 7:8-11.

    In Isaiah 66:7-8, the prophet foreshadowed
    the re-birth of Israel. Isaiah describes a woman giving birth before going into labor, and he speaks of a country being born in one day. This accurately describes what happened on May 14, 1948 - when the Jews declared independence for Israel as a united and sovereign nation for the first time in 2900 years.

    During that same day,
    the United States issued a statement recognizing Israel's sovereignty. And, only hours beforehand, a United Nations mandate expired,ending British control of the land. During a 24-hour span of time, foreign control of the land of Israel had formally ceased, and Israel had declared its independence, and its independence was acknowledged by other nations.Modern Israel literally was born in a single day.

    Isaiah also said the birth would take place before there would be labor pains. And that too is precisely what happened. A movement called Zionism began in the 1800s to encourage Jews worldwide to move to Israel, which at that time was called Palestine. When the Jews declared sovereignty in 1948, the declaration did not follow a war for independence, but rather a war for independence followed the declaration. The birth was peaceful, the aftermath was painful. Within hours of the declaration,
    Israel was attacked by Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq and Saudi Arabia. Israel prevailed in that war and expanded the size of the country by 50 percent.
     
  19. GraceInHim

    GraceInHim † Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

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    In Ezekiel 43:7, Ezekiel is shown "... the place of my throne, and the place of the soles of my feet, where I will dwell in the midst of the children of Israel for ever ...."

    Daniel prophesied of the day when Christ's kingdom would be set up. "And
    in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, whichshall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever" (Daniel 2:44).

    When did this happen, God is talking about the latter years?

    Remember we are grafted into Abrahams root - we all come together in the end as one -

    To say Israel is gone or does not exist in the future is what to God?

    Tell me also - what other country which has been gone for over 1900 yrs comes back and reclaims thier land?

    That is like British taking back America?

    God does not lie.....
     
  20. airren1

    airren1 New Member

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    It didn't!!! Prophecy my dear prophecy.

    We all have the right to believe what we want, but not everyone can be right. Everyone has the options of receiving truth or being deceived by the things of this world as the devil is busy doing, Rev. 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. I cannot fight you, nor will I debate you over the facts that are out there in abundance for everyone to learn, if that is what they want. The world is very deceiving, and the truth is hidden as is YHWH's chosen ones, PSALM83:1-4, KEEP NOT YOUR SILENCE, O YHWH HOLD NOT YOUR PEACE, AND BE NOT STILL O YHWH.2. FOR, LO, YOUR ENEMIES MAKE A TUMULT AND THEY THAT HATE YOU HAVE LIFTED UP THE HEAD. 3 THEY HAVE TAKEN CRAFTY COUNSEL AGAINST YOUR PEOPLE, AND CONSULTED AGAINST YOUR HIDDEN ONES. 4. THEY HAVE SAID, COME LETS CUT THEM OFF FROM BEING A NATION SO THAT THE NAME OF ISRAEL MAY BE NO MORE IN REMEMBRANCE . Not even does his chosen ones know or consider who they are,
    Isa. 1:3 The ox knoweth his owner, and the ass his master's crib: but Israel doth not know, my people doth not consider.
    Even Solomon and Job, both ancestors of Yahsua's (Jesus), says they are black
    Song of Solomon 1:5
    I am black, but comely, O ye daughters of Jerusalem, as the tents of Kedar, as the curtains of Solomon.
    Job 30:30
    My skin is black upon me, and my bones are burned with heat.

    Most people know that when "white" people are ill and starving they turn pale, and "black" people turn darker.

    I am not a Muslim, but one who professes the faith of the YHWH of Israel, and his beloved Son who died so that we may all live. I refuse to argue as I am only presenting facts.

    How come the "Jews" know who they are, and have never lost their heritage, and how come the Bible warns us there will be imposters that say that are Jews? Research will show that the people residing in the State of Israel and calling themselves Jews and Israelis, not Israelites converted to the religion of Judaism. I am happy that you refuse to listen to what I say without studying, study the scriptures and history first. 2Tim. 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
    Rev. 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan, and Rev. 3:9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
    2Tim 3 And know that in the last days perilous times shall come.....
     
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