Where are the human bones and remains from the flood?

[GenemZ]

But among the people descended from Noah was Israel, just as Abraham fathered many people, but the only ones the Bible follows are the Israelites, not the Edomites or the Ishmaelites.

Its not an Israel issue. For, all men came from that family.

All men. Men, from all over the world...

It would be like using your argument to say that Adam is mentioned in the Bible because Israel descended from Adam. All men descended from Adam.

I do not know why you wish to argue over what is a non-point, but now has become a point, because you desire to make it an issue.

And until Abraham was called to Canaan, the ancestors of Israel (including Noah) appear to have lived in Mesopotamia.

We do not know where Noah first lived. We only know where the Ark landed, and where they ended up. It may have rained for 40 days, but the Ark was afloat for almost a half year.

Genesis 7:24 niv
"The waters flooded the earth for a hundred and fifty days."

​

With God having the Ark moved along by winds and fast currents, it could have been an entirely different area of the world that the Ark landed in, from which they had lived.

Where man first lived is where God wanted flooded. God was not out to destroy the entire planet. He was out to destroy mankind, and all life that lived where mankind lived. God did not desire to kill off animals that may have lived on the other side of the earth.

If all the types of animals and insects of the world where brought into the Ark? They would not fit!

It would have taken many Arks for that to happen. God was only out to destroy man's domain. Where man lived prior to the flood. Only living creatures indeginous to where man had lived was to be preserved on the Ark. Other creatures around other parts of the world where man did not live were needing no space on the Ark.

It was only later on that God finally got man to scatter over the face of the earth! They did not want to be scattered. They wanted to remain close to one another. (Genesis 11:3-4)

"They said to each other, "Come, let's make bricks and bake them thoroughly." They used brick instead of stone, and tar for mortar. Then they said, "Come, let us build ourselves a city, with a tower that reaches to the heavens, so that we may make a name for ourselves and not be scattered over the face of the whole earth."

​

The Bible does not state in what exact area of the world where the Ark was constructed. It seems you keep telling me that you know where. I do not know where you got that from.

The small dot on the globe where mankind lived before the Flood, we can not know. It may have only been the size of London, for all we know. Finding their bones may now be buried under thousands of feet of water.

No, I am making the point that if Noah did live in Mesopotamia, people had spread at least that far from East Africa where the human species originated. They were already spread from Ethiopia to Persia eastward, and that is a much larger area than Rhode Island.

People did not spread out until after the flood. I do not know what data you are working with. If what you claim were pertaining to the time of the antideluvian period (just before the flood of Noah)? Then the preaching of Noah would not have been heard by all who were to die, and God would have judged all men without warning them first. There's a problem there. God is just.

"They said to each other, "Come, let's make bricks and bake them thoroughly." They used brick instead of stone, and tar for mortar. Then they said, "Come, let us build ourselves a city, with a tower that reaches to the heavens, so that we may make a name for ourselves and not be scattered over the face of the whole earth."


​

Man did not want to be scattered. He at that time had a sense of security by sticking close to one another.


In Christ, GeneZ

 

[FallingWaters]

At least some good suggestions found here:

http://www.icr.org/index.php?module=articles&action=view&ID=1103

Hope this helps.

Thank you. Excellent article. Makes sense.

I like the last line:
"[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]On the other hand, if evolution is true, and humans have lived on Earth for three million years, many trillions have lived and died. Where are their fossils? This is the more vexing question."[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]*Dr. John Morris, President of ICR.[/FONT]

 

[The Lady Kate]

Thank you. Excellent article. Makes sense.

I like the last line:
"[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]On the other hand, if evolution is true, and humans have lived on Earth for three million years, many trillions have lived and died. Where are their fossils? This is the more vexing question."[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]*Dr. John Morris, President of ICR.[/FONT]

On the other hand, A global flood would leave not only thousands, if not millions of human remains, but villages, towns, cities, and entire civilizations obliterated, all at precisely the same time.

And where might they be?

 

[food4thought]

On the other hand, A global flood would leave not only thousands, if not millions of human remains, but villages, towns, cities, and entire civilizations obliterated, all at precisely the same time.

And where might they be?

Reading the article should answer the first part of your inquiry... the second part I don't know. If I find anything, I'll pass it along.

One quick thought... I do remember hearing about the possibility that the foundations of various Gaza Plateau structures (the great pyramids and the sphynx in particular) showed considerable signs of being underwater at some point in history. The book I heard this from was called "Fingerprints of the Gods"... can't remember the authors name, but I definitely remember that he was not a Christian! His book has some very interesting information that could support the idea of a global flood and following ice age as well as, or even better than, his pet theory about crustal slippage.

God bless!

 

[The Lady Kate]

Reading the article should answer the first part of your inquiry... the second part I don't know. If I find anything, I'll pass it along.

One quick thought... I do remember hearing about the possibility that the foundations of various Gaza Plateau structures (the great pyramids and the sphynx in particular) showed considerable signs of being underwater at some point in history. The book I heard this from was called "Fingerprints of the Gods"... can't remember the authors name, but I definitely remember that he was not a Christian! His book has some very interesting information that could support the idea of a global flood and following ice age as well as, or even better than, his pet theory about crustal slippage.

God bless!

And yet... is there anything in the Egyptian history itself mentioning when and how (not to mention if) the pyramids and sphinx were flooded?

A disaster of that magnitude, you'd think someone would've written down something...

 

[xpiotosaves]

They could have been washed anywhere! They could be in the Tigris River, the Red Sea, or even deep under one of Saddam's former palaces. They are most likely somewhere in that area, but even if scientist found them
1. Some wouldn't care because they aren't Christian/Jewish/Muslim
2. It would be next to impossible to know that it was the flood that killed them because they wouldn't have water in their lungs.
3. In the months the world was flooded, the bodies could have washed as far as North America.

 

[xpiotosaves]

And yet... is there anything in the Egyptian history itself mentioning when and how (not to mention if) the pyramids and sphinx were flooded?

A disaster of that magnitude, you'd think someone would've written down something...

1. Wasn't everyone except Noah and his family killed?
2. Wasn't the flood long before the pyramids?

 

[gluadys]

1. Wasn't everyone except Noah and his family killed?

That's what the story says. But is the story also history?

2. Wasn't the flood long before the pyramids?

Depends on whose estimate of dating you use. The usual estimate of about 4.000 years ago is within the timeframe the pyramids were being built.

A much earlier date is needed for the flood if one takes literally that all humans other than Noah & family were killed. Not just to place the flood before the building of the pyramids, but also to allow the human population to build up enough that there would be sufficient workers to build them.

 

[FallingWaters]

I'm pretty sure it is believed that the Pyramids were built after Noah's Flood.

 

[gluadys]

I'm pretty sure it is believed that the Pyramids were built after Noah's Flood.

That doesn't make it true. The date most often mentioned for the flood is around 2300 BC. That is smack-dab in the middle of the reign of the last Pharoah of the 5th Egyptian Dynasty. Both this Pharoah and others before and after him built pyramids. There are architectural and written records of the time, and none of them mention the flood or show any break that would indicate the deluge.

One can get around this by placing the flood earlier in time, but then everything else (including creation) has to be placed earlier too.

And no matter how far back you go, there is still no indication of a global flood.

Much simpler to interpret the biblical story as referring to a local flood.

 

[The Lady Kate]

I'm pretty sure it is believed that the Pyramids were built after Noah's Flood.

Someone should tell this author:

One quick thought... I do remember hearing about the possibility that the foundations of various Gaza Plateau structures (the great pyramids and the sphynx in particular) showed considerable signs of being underwater at some point in history. The book I heard this from was called "Fingerprints of the Gods"... can't remember the authors name, but I definitely remember that he was not a Christian!

 

[The Lady Kate]

They could have been washed anywhere! They could be in the Tigris River, the Red Sea, or even deep under one of Saddam's former palaces. They are most likely somewhere in that area, but even if scientist found them
1. Some wouldn't care because they aren't Christian/Jewish/Muslim

I don't care what religion you are, if you're a scientist and you come across evidence of a lost civilization, you'd be interested!

2. It would be next to impossible to know that it was the flood that killed them because they wouldn't have water in their lungs.

There are other ways of determining what sort of disaster leveled a village/town/city.

3. In the months the world was flooded, the bodies could have washed as far as North America.

Then we'd be finding them here... but we're not.

 

[FallingWaters]

That doesn't make it true. The date most often mentioned for the flood is around 2300 BC. That is smack-dab in the middle of the reign of the last Pharoah of the 5th Egyptian Dynasty. Both this Pharoah and others before and after him built pyramids. There are architectural and written records of the time, and none of them mention the flood or show any break that would indicate the deluge.

One can get around this by placing the flood earlier in time, but then everything else (including creation) has to be placed earlier too.

And no matter how far back you go, there is still no indication of a global flood.

Much simpler to interpret the biblical story as referring to a local flood.

Except then we have a problem because God promised never again to send a flood like Noah's, and since we have had local floods since that time, that would make God a covenant-breaker, so that's not an option either.


Genesis 9:12 And God said: “This is the sign of the covenant which I make between Me and you, and every living creature that is with you, for perpetual generations: 13 I set My rainbow in the cloud, and it shall be for the sign of the covenant between Me and the earth. 14 It shall be, when I bring a cloud over the earth, that the rainbow shall be seen in the cloud; 15 and I will remember My covenant which is between Me and you and every living creature of all flesh; the waters shall never again become a flood to destroy all flesh. 16 The rainbow shall be in the cloud, and I will look on it to remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is on the earth.” 17 And God said to Noah, “This is the sign of the covenant which I have established between Me and all flesh that is on the earth.”

 

[The Lady Kate]

Except then we have a problem because God promised never again to send a flood like Noah's, and since we have had local floods since that time, that would make God a covenant-breaker, so that's not an option either.


Genesis 9:12 And God said: “This is the sign of the covenant which I make between Me and you, and every living creature that is with you, for perpetual generations: 13 I set My rainbow in the cloud, and it shall be for the sign of the covenant between Me and the earth. 14 It shall be, when I bring a cloud over the earth, that the rainbow shall be seen in the cloud; 15 and I will remember My covenant which is between Me and you and every living creature of all flesh; the waters shall never again become a flood to destroy all flesh. 16 The rainbow shall be in the cloud, and I will look on it to remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is on the earth.” 17 And God said to Noah, “This is the sign of the covenant which I have established between Me and all flesh that is on the earth.”

Only a problem if you take the whole thing literally.

 

[FallingWaters]

That doesn't make it true. The date most often mentioned for the flood is around 2300 BC. That is smack-dab in the middle of the reign of the last Pharoah of the 5th Egyptian Dynasty. Both this Pharoah and others before and after him built pyramids. There are architectural and written records of the time, and none of them mention the flood or show any break that would indicate the deluge.

One can get around this by placing the flood earlier in time, but then everything else (including creation) has to be placed earlier too.

And no matter how far back you go, there is still no indication of a global flood.

Much simpler to interpret the biblical story as referring to a local flood.

Perhaps the dating of the Egyptian Dynasties is wrong.

 

[gluadys]

Perhaps the dating of the Egyptian Dynasties is wrong.

Trust a creationist to come up with this possibility.


The dating of the actual artifacts of Egyptian civilization has to be wrong in order to accommodate a flood for which there is no evidence at all.

Sorry dear. Science works with the evidence it has, not with evidence that exists only in the imagination of an ancient story-teller.

Provide substantial evidence that Egypt was ever inundated in a universal flood (annual flooding of Nile does not count), provide something datable, then archeologists can reconstruct a timeline.

 

[xpiotosaves]

I don't care what religion you are, if you're a scientist and you come across evidence of a lost civilization, you'd be interested!

They weren't GREAT CITIES, they were most likely a bunch of huts. They wouldn't be any differt, if not less interesting, than any other excavation.

There are other ways of determining what sort of disaster leveled a village/town/city.

Again, they were probably so insignificantly small, the flood could have washed away any evidence.

Then we'd be finding them here... but we're not.

How do you know that we haven't? They could be any of the ancient remains, found anywhere on earth.
FYI: Remains, even bones, are not always fossilized. They could have rotted away.

 

[FallingWaters]

Trust a creationist to come up with this possibility.

I am greatly honored by your remark.

 

[Melethiel]

They weren't GREAT CITIES, they were most likely a bunch of huts. They wouldn't be any differt, if not less interesting, than any other excavation.

What makes you say that? I see nothing giving that idea in the text, and if people really were living hundreds of years and breeding, there would be enough people for at least a couple of decent sized cities. (IIRC, there is mention of some relative of Cain's building a city.)

 

[RealityCheck]

Even artifacts from over 10,000 years ago have been found. There were no "great cities" then. A lot of human settlements yes... but no great cities.

So even if a flood occurred four or five thousand years ago, there ought to be remains. Pottery, tools, bones, whatever.

Hi gluadys!