When your spouse sins

[Confess]

Question:
I am dealing with a lot of turmoil with my friends. The husband is a faithful Lutheran in so much that he attends church at nearly every service, he knows the doctrines and believes them, he catechizes his family ...

And yet he crushes the whole family so harshly with the law that it is breaking the family apart.

He openly admits that he does not love the daughters that come from a previous marriage (which he has raised since they were around 7 years old), he says that they turn his stomach and has a hard time looking at them.

He is a finger pointer who judges all those whom he does not like. He makes you feel miserable if he doesn't like you and is rude as well as ungentlemanly at all times.

He blames his wife for all his anger, he blames her for the way the daughters from a previous marriage has turned out and he shows no mercy or tenderness to her.

She comes from a harsh background, divorced her first husband to save her life from his physical abuse, her second husband died from the effects of a car accident and had a total of 2 daughter from each marriage. She has a total of 7 children in all.

The daughters are not considered by the husband to be his even though he adopted that 2 daughters who came from the husband that died. When asked, he says he has 3 children. He has emotionally disowned the 4 daughters and requests that my girlfriend rarely sees them and requests that she does not treat her grandchildren as if they are hers.

My question.

Because their marriage is just about over. Is it reasonable for a pastor to put a sining man like this under the minor ban considering his unrepentance?

 

[RadMan]

Because their marriage is just about over. Is it reasonable for a pastor to put a sining man like this under the minor ban considering his unrepentance?

How does the pastor know all this? Did the husband or wife admit all this?. Did somebody else tell the pastor? It all seems to go from knowledge by a few to knowledge by everyone. Sorry it doesn't really address you question.

 

[DaRev]

This man has broken his wedding vow. When a man marries a woman who has children, those children become a part of his family. If he cannot love her children as his own he really has no business entering into a marriage with their mother in the first place.

A minor ban should be the last act. This man needs serious counselling in order to have the opportunity to repent. Not knowing what, if any, such counselling has occured makes it difficult to make such a determination at this point.

 

[Jim47]

My question.

Because their marriage is just about over. Is it reasonable for a pastor to put a sining man like this under the minor ban considering his unrepentance?

DaRev is right. This man is in danger of losing his salvation and he is also doing no good to those intrusted to his care. A Pastor's counciling is in order, and every accusation should be discussed and shown to him how he is sinning against The Lord.

Jesus told us we are to forgive others if we want to be forgiven. He has refused to give love to others even though they have not wronged him. He feels this guilt and that is whay he is so angry. Only confession and repentance will change him, but I wouldn't attempt this without aide and witness of his Pastor.

 

[porterross]

What a sad, sad situation. Blended families are trying enough without such sinful selfishness, but I can't even begin to imagine how your friend has stayed with this man. Children should ALWAYS come first.

This family needs prayer without ceasing from any and everyone.

 

[seajoy]

I grew up in a similar situation where law was crammed down my throat by my abusive father. I pity these children very much. The damage is already done, and all in the name of religion it seems. The effects of what this man has done will be felt for many years to come. Yes, the wife is also a victim, but she is also an adult, and everything should be done to get this man to come to repentance, and it all should come out with a pastor's help.

This story sickens me. Perhaps it's just too close to home. I can still see my father slamming down the photo of the child that my brother took on after marrying a woman whose husband left her alone with a 6mo old baby.

People like this are very sick. My father still doesn't think anything he ever did was wrong....or he pretends it away. It's sad indeed what is going on in this home that Confess speaks of.

 

[filosofer]

What a sad, sad situation. Blended families are trying enough without such sinful selfishness, but I can't even begin to imagine how your friend has stayed with this man. Children should ALWAYS come first.

This family needs prayer without ceasing from any and everyone.

[FONT= "Book Antiqua"]
For a slightly different take...

Christ should always be first
Spouse second
children third

If the person cannot love Christ, he/she cannot love the spouse properly. If the person cannot love his/her spouse, he/she cannot love the children properly.

The best way for a spouse to love the children is to love their mother. In this case, the person has not learned love in any relationship.

And I whole-heartedly agree that the family needs prayer and support - all of them.

[/font]

 

[porterross]

For a slightly different take...

Christ should always be first
Spouse second
children third

If the person cannot love Christ, he/she cannot love the spouse properly. If the person cannot love his/her spouse, he/she cannot love the children properly.

The best way for a spouse to love the children is to love their mother. In this case, the person has not learned love in any relationship.

And I whole-heartedly agree that the family needs prayer and support - all of them.

Of course. I thought it was a given here that we all put Him first.

Being a single parent who has chosen to do what's necessary to ensure my child wasn't put into a similar situation as described in the OP, (even when I wasn't looking to God first), it's difficult for me to understand why people with children are in such a hurry to remarry.

Frankly, I wouldn't have had the energy to even think of being pulled in two separate enotional directions. I'm not that limber.

 

[filosofer]

Of course. I thought it was a given here that we all put Him first.

Being a single parent who has chosen to do what's necessary to ensure my child wasn't put into a similar situation as described in the OP, (even when I wasn't looking to God first), it's difficult for me to understand why people with children are in such a hurry to remarry.

[FONT= "Book Antiqua"]
I understand. I wanted to clarify for those who may not follow the thread without proper context.

[/font]

Frankly, I wouldn't have had the energy to even think of being pulled in two separate enotional directions. I'm not that limber.

[FONT= "Book Antiqua"]
Ya'll talking to the choir here... from someone who takes 3-4 steps just to stand up rightly after sitting for an hour.

[/font]

 

[porterross]

I understand. I wanted to clarify for those who may not follow the thread without proper context.

Yes, Reverend dear. I'm in a the mood to pull pig tails and throw paper airplanes tonight.

Ya'll talking to the choir here... from someone who takes 3-4 steps just to stand up rightly after sitting for an hour.

You're doing great then, because it already takes that for me to work out the stiffness/soreness sometimes as well.

 

[DaRev]

Yes, Reverend dear. I'm in a the mood to pull pig tails

I'm glad I got my hair cut.

 

[Confess]

I am just so sick. Prayers would be very appreciated. Counseling has been done many times, there seems to be no one who really believes what is happening. The man can cover his tracks well. The last resort is the ban, but getting the pastor to understand that before something terribly serious happens ...

I just needed to know if the minor ban was something that we Lutherans do practice in marital situations like this. Faith and salvation are truely at risk here.

I am tired and weary. God help them and God help me as the children are now beginning to call me for counsel.

 

[Confess]

How does the pastor know all this? Did the husband or wife admit all this?. Did somebody else tell the pastor? It all seems to go from knowledge by a few to knowledge by everyone. Sorry it doesn't really address you question.

Pastor has known for over 10 years. My friend is an amazing woman in that she has worked so hard on this problem for so long. I fear the Pastor has grown weary.

 

[Confess]

This man has broken his wedding vow. When a man marries a woman who has children, those children become a part of his family. If he cannot love her children as his own he really has no business entering into a marriage with their mother in the first place.

A minor ban should be the last act. This man needs serious counselling in order to have the opportunity to repent. Not knowing what, if any, such counselling has occured makes it difficult to make such a determination at this point.

Thank you.

 

[seajoy]

I am just so sick. Prayers would be very appreciated. Counseling has been done many times, there seems to be no one who really believes what is happening. The man can cover his tracks well. The last resort is the ban, but getting the pastor to understand that before something terribly serious happens ...

I just needed to know if the minor ban was something that we Lutherans do practice in marital situations like this. Faith and salvation are truely at risk here.

I am tired and weary. God help them and God help me as the children are now beginning to call me for counsel.

Direct the children to professional counseling. This is over your head, and it will continue to wear you down. I'm sorry this is happening in your life, and most especially in the lives of the children.

The wife may be a wonderful person in trying to work through this for 10 years, but her children are suffering much because of it. My own mother had a chance to move herself and us, to her sister in law's when we were young. My mother chose to keep us in the abusive situation instead. It would have "looked bad" to the community.

If the pastor will no longer do anything about this situation, then it's time to get different help. Such as another Pastor or Christian counselor.

I will be praying for this family. Take care of yourself, Confess. You can't fix this situation.

 

[Radiata]

Actually, I am almost happy to see someone like this. Someone who enforces strict rules and does not tolerate one with no respect for the rules. I see almost no people my age that have any desire to not sin, and I think that is a product of bad parenting. Why can't I find people my age like myself that are actually trying to be perfect?

Buuuuuuuut, I am not happy to see the other half of this man. The side which has him disowning his daughters in law. I don't have any advice on how he should be delt with. Sorry.

 

[seajoy]

I spent my childhood trying to be perfect, just so I wouldn't be beaten or yelled at. It made me nearly afraid to breathe, let alone be my own person. Those traits continued right into adulthood. You will never be perfect, Radiata...not in this life. God does not stand over your head with a hammer. Christ did it all for you. Rest easy, my young friend.

 

[Radiata]

I spent my childhood trying to be perfect, just so I wouldn't be beaten or yelled at. It made me nearly afraid to breathe, let alone be my own person. Those traits continued right into adulthood. You will never be perfect, Radiata...not in this life. God does not stand over your head with a hammer. Christ did it all for you. Rest easy, my young friend.

Of course I know that it is impossible to be perfect. That doesn't mean that I don't try. I have a picture in my room. See the bottom of the post for it. Everyday I look at that picture and I say to myself, "Am I worthy of that?" And everyday I answer myself 'I am not.' Then I live out my day trying to be perfect. Even though I know that it will never happen. Why can't this be my goal?

But there is one example that I find questionable. There was a man who came into my pastor's office and he claimed to be perfect. He said that he hasn't sined in 5 years. Never lied, never had evil intentions, never looked at another women lustfully... This is just what he says.

Besides, even if he is indeed perfect, he is still born with original sin and therefore still needs a savior.

The scary thing is, that kid looks like me.

 

[seajoy]

You are worthy of that hug because of what Christ has done for you.

If your goal is to be perfect, you will be let down. I'm not one to say what a person's goal should be, but perhaps wording it differently. Like..."My goal is to live for Christ today (with His help of course)." It takes the focus off our selves and places it where it should be.

As for the guy in your Pastor's office.....he reminds me of my father and the man that Confess is talking about in this thread. "Look at me, I'm a wonderful Christian." Yikes that is scary.

 

[Radiata]

You are worthy of that hug because of what Christ has done for you.

It's not just a hug. Look at where they are.