What is "strange fire"?

[aWalkbyFaith]

What is it?

I've heard so many different interpretations.

People point to Jesus saying:
" God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”


I've often heard this passage used in a way that implies that we need to first go cleanse ourselves and wipe away our own sin before we can come to God. How can anyone do that? Why would we expect anyone to be able to do that without first coming to Jesus. Isn't God the one that purifies our hearts, by grace through faith in Jesus Christ?


Let's have a discussion..



Bless you.

 

[cyberlizard]

what is strange fire - no one knows, except apparently john macarthur.


Steve

 

[jiminpa]

what is strange fire - no one knows, except apparently john macarthur.


Steve

...and we have a winner. In contemporary application, strange fire is a catch all term used to condemn that which the Bible does not condemn. I guess God's word just doesn't go far enough in identifying sin. It's a good thing that macarhur and his disciples, yes even on this so-called Charismatic forum, are so much smarter than God.

 

[x141]

What is it?

I've heard so many different interpretations.

People point to Jesus saying:
" God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”


I've often heard this passage used in a way that implies that we need to first go cleanse ourselves and wipe away our own sin before we can come to God. How can anyone do that? Why would we expect anyone to be able to do that without first coming to Jesus. Isn't he the one that purifies our hearts, by grace through faith?


Let's have a discussion..



Bless you.

Strange fire is the same as another gospel, or coming up another way, or the image that provokes God to jealousy, etc. (and what the people say, but not according to their perception of what this truth is), they all are facets that show in picture form the same truth. God does not share his glory with another, but we are not another. There is a great picture of this concerning the process in the woman at the well.

 

[Optimax]

Lev 10:1
And Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron, took either of them his censer, and put fire therein, and put incense thereon, and offered strange fire before the Lord, which he commanded them not. KJV

 

[aWalkbyFaith]

Lev 10:1
And Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron, took either of them his censer, and put fire therein, and put incense thereon, and offered strange fire before the Lord, which he commanded them not. KJV

Thanks. That's a very good start because that's exactly where the term comes from.

Under the Old Covenant, wasn't only the High Priest allowed into the Holy of Holies and only once a year. And if he didn't perform part of the cleansing ceremony correctly then he'd die...

And as far as fire offerings, they were to be conducted a certain way. Or they too were in danger.

 

[BenAdam]

Thanks. That's a very good start because that's exactly where the term comes from.

Under the Old Covenant, wasn't only the High Priest allowed into the Holy of Holies and only once a year. And if he didn't perform part of the cleansing ceremony correctly then he'd die...

And as far as fire offerings, they were to be conducted a certain way. Or they too were in danger.

Many say that the temple ceremonies are all types (pictures) of the redemptive work. Strange fire would be introducing a new way of things, IOW there is more than one way to redemption.

Just wondering is all.

 

[aWalkbyFaith]

Strange fire is the same as another gospel, or coming up another way, or the image that provokes God to jealousy, etc. (and what the people say, but not according to their perception of what this truth is), they all are facets that show in picture form the same truth. God does not share his glory with another, but we are not another. There is a great picture of this concerning the process in the woman at the well.

Thanks and bless you.

And the gospel is of faith in Jesus Christ and not of works lest any man boast right?

I just reread the woman on the well story in John. And it seems that Jesus is saying that we no longer need to worship at the mountain. But instead in spirit and truth.

 

[Optimax]

Lev 10:1
And Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron, took either of them his censer, and put fire therein, and put incense thereon, and offered strange fire before the Lord, which he commanded them not. KJV

They offered fire before the Lord which He commanded them not.

Have we as born again Christians been commanded to offer an "fire" to the Lord?

 

[aWalkbyFaith]

They offered fire before the Lord which He commanded them not.

Have we as born again Christians been commanded to offer an "fire" to the Lord?

It's my understanding that we are the temple of God and Holy Spirit is the source of that fire.

Bless you.

 

[Johnnz]

What is it?

I've heard so many different interpretations.

People point to Jesus saying:
" God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”


I've often heard this passage used in a way that implies that we need to first go cleanse ourselves and wipe away our own sin before we can come to God. How can anyone do that? Why would we expect anyone to be able to do that without first coming to Jesus. Isn't God the one that purifies our hearts, by grace through faith in Jesus Christ?

First up, we cannot cleanse ourselves - ever. That was accomplished by Jesus completely and forever. Sure, we can recognise areas where we need to change in some way but that must never obscure the fact of th egift of righteousness we already have.

Secondly, a more modern translation puts it better:
Lev 10:1-2 10 Aaron's sons Nadab and Abihu took their censers, put fire in them and added incense; and they offered unauthorized fire before the Lord, contrary to his command. So fire came out from the presence of the Lord and consumed them, and they died before the Lord. NIV

They has stepped over a God imposed limit.

John
NZ

 

[Optimax]

It's my understanding that we are the temple of God and Holy Spirit is the source of that fire.

Bless you.

We are the temple.

However.

Where in the NT is the commandment to offer fire to the Lord?

We are commanded to walk by love.

We are commanded to live by faith.

we are commanded to believe on His Name.

Where is the "fire" one at?

 

[Yitzchak]

Strange fire is doing things our own way rather than the way that God commands. This is not limited to just service in the temple , but is a general principle. I think that it goes hand in hand with the well known scripture in 2 Chronicles 7 :14 because it says to humble ourselves.

2Ch 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

The primary meaning of humble ourselves is to come on God's terms and not our own terms. Dead religion is the opposite of this. It says we can make up our own way to serve God. But it is usually a way without any relationship. It is religion and not relationship. Relationship wants to do it God's way.

 

[aWalkbyFaith]

We are the temple.

However.

Where in the NT is the commandment to offer fire to the Lord?

We are commanded to walk by love.

We are commanded to live by faith.

we are commanded to believe on His Name.

Where is the "fire" one at?

By the mercies of God, we do present our bodies as living sacrifices. But that's only by His grace through faith. It's not anything we could ever do on our own ability.

And yes, we walk by faith in love, all by His grace.

As for the NT and fire, there is mention of tongues, as of fire. But I guess some believe God stopped doing that.

Bless you.

 

[aWalkbyFaith]

Strange fire is doing things our own way rather than the way that God commands. This is not limited to just service in the temple , but is a general principle. I think that it goes hand in hand with the well known scripture in 2 Chronicles 7 :14 because it says to humble ourselves.



The primary meaning of humble ourselves is to come on God's terms and not our own terms. Dead religion is the opposite of this. It says we can make up our own way to serve God. But it is usually a way without any relationship. It is religion and not relationship. Relationship wants to do it God's way.

Bless you.

It sounds like you are saying that all sin is "strange fire"? But, I see what you mean since worship is much more than singing songs to God in a church building.

I love that scripture in 2 Chronicles.

Let's humble ourselves to seek the one true God. To Him be glory forever and ever!

 

[aWalkbyFaith]

Ok so far what I've heard is that "strange fire" sacrifice is either another gospel or it's not doing God's will.

As for it being another gospel: I don't understand that one. If it's another gospel other than of faith in Jesus Christ, then it's another gospel as far as what it looks like in the bible. But how is that "strange fire" as it applied in the old testament with Nadab and Abihu?

And for the not doing God's will one: At what level does it become "strange fire". We all stumble at times. I mean, I've met a lot of people that act as if they are righteous apart from the blood of Jesus. But I've only ever met one, Jesus Christ, that did not fall short of God's glory. So then is "strange fire" only applicable when someone is living in rebellion/iniquity? Because I could see how people could easily start searching for flaws in others and accuse them of "strange fire". Any thoughts on that?

I guess another one I've heard is that "strange fire" is when we believe that according our interpretation of the bible that another person's worship is not acceptable to God. Isn't that a scary place to be when we start judging that God does not accept their worship? And as far as I know, when I was born-again God saved me. He wasn't waiting for me to walkout a flawless life. Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating sin here. But it's been a long progress for me over 21 years. And still sometimes I stumble. Good thing for mercy and forgiveness. Or I'd had been cut off on day one. Another thing on the "worship not being acceptable": It's God's presence that changes us. So if God was waiting for an "acceptable worship" from me, then He wouldn't have saved me because I was a heathen of heathens when He, in His mercy, chose me.

Jesus Christ was and is the "acceptable" sacrifice, in all aspects. And faith in Christ pleases the Father. It's impossible to please God without faith.

Any comments?

Bless you.

 

[rdclmn72]

They were drunk.

 

[x141]

Thanks and bless you.

And the gospel is of faith in Jesus Christ and not of works lest any man boast right?

I just reread the woman on the well story in John. And it seems that Jesus is saying that we no longer need to worship at the mountain. But instead in spirit and truth.

It was never by works or labor of thought from the beginning.

The three that Jesus lays out are a progression of truth that equates to wisdom, knowledge and understanding (which deals with the perception of our soul of what the truth is), just as you see the same in the tabernacle of Moses, the layers found in Noah's ark, or Egypt, wilderness and the land, or Saul, David, Solomon, etc.

The worship that is in spirit and truth (God) is the walk that Jesus walked.

The woman (symbolic of our soul) at the wells five husbands were her five senses, which gave her a husband (sixth) that was not her own while her true husband (seventh/rest) sat on the (first the) natural well revealing himself as the true (then the spiritual) well/husband/Christ/Life (spirit of truth) that would be in her (the Seed of the woman is the life of the woman) having needed only but to have asked.

Jesus distanced himself from the salvation that was of the Jews, as much as the Jewish scriptures lead to what He in Truth was, which is the Truth of every son. He was the jubilee they heard but could not see yet.

 

[Messy]

False, evil fire:
James 3
See how great a forest a little fire kindles! 6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity. The tongue is so set among our members that it defiles the whole body, and sets on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire by hell. 7 For every kind of beast and bird, of reptile and creature of the sea, is tamed and has been tamed by mankind. 8 But no man can tame the tongue. It is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison. 9 With it we bless our God and Father, and with it we curse men, who have been made in the similitude of God.

And the Holy Spirit is the only One who can tame our tongue.

But I think what they mean with it is fake fire:
http://topmanteca.org/userFiles/847/azusa_street_prophecies.pdf

 

[x141]

Ok so far what I've heard is that "strange fire" sacrifice is either another gospel or it's not doing God's will.

As for it being another gospel: I don't understand that one. If it's another gospel other than of faith in Jesus Christ, then it's another gospel as far as what it looks like in the bible. But how is that "strange fire" as it applied in the old testament with Nadab and Abihu?

The fire was not taken from the altar which holds the significance of our soul as concerning the first feast (Passover/ a cross as the only way to follow him into the truth that he leads us into) one is called up to Jerusalem to keep, and identifies itself with the place where the lamb is slain, which is as the process of the perception of the truth in us.

Truths are not confined to one perception in any given passage (Question of the day ... How many words does it take to describe The One Word?). These were sons of Aaron, to see more of it and how it relates to the truth being revealed in us you must go back a follow the line, and how the priest hood became separated after as on was separated from Egypt, by being called out of the tabernacle of Joseph, and the inheritance of his sons which fall in line with the elder serves the younger. This goes a long way. The Bible is one book, of one truth, of one son being revealed in us, even though it appears as two tables of stone (which brings us back to a forbidden tree, which has it's identity as the law of our mind which ensnares us, which in type is the law of our mother when not enclosed in the commandment of our Father).

The principle of the two sons stretches from cover to cover, as well their names together meaning a liberal worship of the father/God, but not at the cost of their soul, which is our only acceptable sacrifice, the reasonable one never being fully offered without it.