What evidence is there that Democrats would've handled anything differently with Covid?

[A_Thinker]

The WHO waited until March 11 to declare it a pandemic,

That doesn't really matter.

Trump's advisors were struggling to convince Trump that we needed to mandate social isolation by February 26. Trump wasn't listening and was still hosting rallies at that point ...

 

[A_Thinker]

Everyone (or at least everyone in the West) was slow to act when it came to really taking this seriously, not just the United States. That's not nonsense. It's fact.

Action will always come "too late". We could always have acted sooner.

But Trump waffled until March 31 to get serious about the threat.

By then, we had taken my son to Emergency twice, ... they couldn't spare a test for him, ... and we could find no face-masks ...

 

[A_Thinker]

I think I have posted this about five times now.
Fauci Told NBC in February That Social Distancing Not Necessary

Yes ... Fauci stated that there no needed for social distancing at that time, ... but that things maight change at a moment's notice.

Trumps waited until March 31 to become serious about the threat.

By then, the US had overtaken all others countries in numbers of infected ...

 

[Gregory Thompson]

So if Trump's motivation to not take action was conspiracy (which I wouldn't disagree with you on)

What was the motivation on the part of Cuomo and DeBlasio to down play it? What was the motivation of Pelosi to encourage her peeps to come out and attend a large gathering in Chinatown in her city in late February

What was the governor of Louisiana's motivation for moving forward with Mardi Gras celebrations and gatherings?

While none of it was conspiracy fear-mongering...it certainly doesn't sound like they were taking it very seriously either.

Red herring.

If you can provide some evidence that Hilary Clinton would have done that, feel free to provide.

 

[ZNP]

I strongly agree with the only presidents that I have have seen in action, plus Truman and Roosevelt. None would have ignored the late January information from China, the WHO and the intelligence agencies.
China closed down Wuhan and arrested the doctor.

We might argue about a week or two in mid-January. However, by January 22, the disaster was clear the world. The question was what actions would be taken by which countries.

If it was so clear to the world surely we were posting about it on this forum and demanding the government take action. Can you point me to those threads because I missed them.

What I do remember is that we had a mother of one teacher and the husband of another die and no one connected that to this virus. One week before NYC shut down (1st week of March) there was concern about the virus but our understanding was that it only affects those over 70 and those who have compromised immune systems.

 

[A_Thinker]

One week before NYC shut down (1st week of March) there was concern about the virus ...

It deserves to be said again ... Trump didn't get serious about CV until March 31.

... our understanding was that it only affects those over 70 and those who have compromised immune systems.

Those that were informed (Trump should have been among these) ... understood that our medical leaders were saying that the virus affected a broad range of age-groups. Young people are affected as well, ... just not so frequently and/or seriously.

NBA players had contracted the virus in early March, to the extent that the NBA season was set aside ...

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Red herring.

If you can provide some evidence that Hilary Clinton would have done that, feel free to provide.

How is it a red herring?

"something, especially a clue, that is or is intended to be misleading or distracting."

What I posted wasn't misleading or distracting. If the assertion is "the democrats would've done a better job if they were taking point on this", then asking for evidence for that claim is SOP for a debate.

The names I mentioned (and provided video of) were in positions of authority, and weren't taking it seriously as of late-Feb/early-March. Would simply having the title of President instead of Governor have changed Cuomo's position on the matter back in mid February?

 

[ThatRobGuy]

???
The amount of information and expertise available at the federal is far greater than what was available to Pelosi and Cuomo. It is Republican conspiracy to believe that there is the same or better information generally available. After all, the president can know more than all the experts just be watching FOX in the morning, instead of paying attention to briefings.

...and as I noted, federal level experts (Fauci to name one) were still telling people there was no reason to adjust behavior or how they go on about there business on Feb 29th.

 

[Pommer]

^ This. A good leader needs to unite people during a crisis. Trump has focused on dividing people, to the detriment of the American public. I still don't understand how he has people who support him.

They made their choice in 2016 and they’ll stick with him, no matter what he does; the “worse” he becomes the more they’ll support him, that’s how Authoritarians (Leaders/followers) work.

 

[ZNP]

It deserves to be said again ... Trump didn't get serious about CV until March 31.

Governor Cuomo announced the shut down of NYC schools March 15th.

Those that were informed (Trump should have been among these) ... understood that our medical leaders were saying that the virus affected a broad range of age-groups. Young people are affected as well, ... just not so frequently and/or seriously.

The press also should have been among these as well. CDC, WHO, leaders of Italy, Spain, France, Germany, etc.

NBA players had contracted the virus in early March, to the extent that the NBA season was set aside ...

Yes, one of those contracted it because he licked everything in sight during a press conference. That was the perfect demonstration that few people took it seriously until it was too late.

 

[ZNP]

If it was so clear to the world surely we were posting about it on this forum and demanding the government take action. Can you point me to those threads because I missed them.

This forum is a journal of what this community was thinking and concerned about. We represent people from all over the world. So, where was the thread warning of the impending disaster from this virus in January or February? Judge not lest you be judged.

 

[pitabread]

They made their choice in 2016 and they’ll stick with him, no matter what he does; the “worse” he becomes the more they’ll support him, that’s how Authoritarians (Leaders/followers) work.

It's surreal to watch. He's created this cult of personality like dictators in other countries. It's also frightening to see people go along with it.

If he was in a different country with a different system, I could easily see him being a life-long dictator.

 

[Silmarien]

In mid-January, long before most Germans had given the virus much thought, Charité hospital in Berlin had already developed a test and posted the formula online.
By the time Germany recorded its first case of Covid-19 in February, laboratories across the country had built up a stock of test kits.

A German Exception? Why the Country’s Coronavirus Death Rate Is Low

I think this article is just what you have been talking about as far as their healthcare system.
All the CoVid-19 articles in the NYT are not behind a paywall.

Yes, Germany had the capacity to do massive testing, but if they had started it before Italy collapsed, we would have all known that there was a problem in Europe significantly earlier. I don't think Germany was doing massive testing and just hiding the fact that they had a problem from the world, and I was watching their numbers of positive cases start climbing with the rest of Europe at the very end of February, so I don't think it makes sense to say that they got started with the actual testing sooner. (If I remember correctly, I think Italy was the first to start testing aggressively in Europe, which is why they discovered what they did.)

I do agree that Germany was much better prepared than the rest of the West, and that they acted faster. But they seem to have still waited to really get started. (Either that, or they were testing and just didn't have problems until importing it from Italy at the end of February, I suppose.)

Either way, I've been really intrigued with the German system for a while. Their healthcare, their labor relations, and a bunch of other stuff, so... "Germany did it, so we could have done it too" is not something I agree with, since Germany had the advantage of being Germany. The United States is a total disaster when it comes to social cohesion and a functioning government.

That doesn't really matter.

Trump's advisors were struggling to convince Trump that we needed to mandate social isolation by February 26. Trump wasn't listening and was still hosting rallies at that point ...

Internationally, the fact that the WHO acted so late in declaring a pandemic actually does matter, I think. If it had been even a week earlier, Madrid would have probably been spared the massive problems they have had, since that type of warning bell going off might have convinced them to call off the marches for International Women's Day.

Action will always come "too late". We could always have acted sooner.

But Trump waffled until March 31 to get serious about the threat.

By then, we had taken my son to Emergency twice, ... they couldn't spare a test for him, ... and we could find no face-masks ...

I'm sorry to hear that. I hope he's alright.

But again, I am in no way defending Trump with any of this. We should have had the testing capacity to start responding to this at the beginning of March, and we didn't. There is no excuse for how the response to the crisis was botched.

If the Democrats had been in charge, I think we would have probably been doing things at the same pace as Europe. What I reject is the idea that we would somehow have started some sort of massive testing campaign a month earlier than Europe.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

It would have never happened, it is a Democrat Hoax after all.

 

[timothyu]

Yes ... Fauci stated that there no needed for social distancing at that time,

Pharmaceutically inspired doctors are not usually in the habit of practicing preventative medicine.

 

[timothyu]

If you can provide some evidence that Hilary Clinton would have done that, feel free to provide.

Anything a Clinton would have said would have been a conflict of interest as the Clinton foundation relies on outbreaks as the basis for their foundation.

 

[Yttrium]

What we could have done is test every suspected case, contact trace every positive case, and isolate.
If we had stocked up on test kits as Germany did we would have been ready for it.

Not likely. It was being spread fast by people with no symptoms. It took us a long time to figure that out. Even if we had produced enough tests, we didn't know just how much it had spread around.

 

[timothyu]

..and as I noted, federal level experts (Fauci to name one) were still telling people there was no reason to adjust behavior or how they go on about there business on Feb 29th.

And these are the people that the politicians relied on for information as to how to address the outbreak. This should have been obvious thanks to Trump's daily reality show where they took lead roles after his opening monologue.

 

[timothyu]

The United States is a total disaster when it comes to social cohesion and a functioning government.

Comparing Germany's state medical system which could focus on the problem compared to scattered private enterprise in the US?

 

[timothyu]

Not likely. It was being spread fast by people with no symptoms. It took us a long time to figure that out.

I find it hard to believe people think you can only catch a cold or a flu from someone who only shows the effects. It has always been common knowledge that once contracted it can be three or more days before we show outward symptoms but already be spreading it. As the old saying goes, don't touch that. You don't know where it's been.