What does "Seeker Friendly" mean ?

[Joy]

Amen brother

 

[JimB]

I think some of you may be equating “seeker friendly” with “compromising”. If so, we are probably talking apples and oranges here.

\o/

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

Many churches say they are "Seeker Friendly" what exactly does that mean?
How do you become "Seeker Friendly" are some churches not "Seeker Friendly"
Just wondering what everyones perspective is on the subject.

My idea of "seeker friendly" is polling the community of unchurched and then gearing your church according to what those polled wanted.

 

[JimB]

Actually, very few Seeker Friendly churches “poll” (in the official sense) their community. Most that I know of are church plants and are doing what we did. We (after prayer and guidance) decided what kind of church we wanted to be and who we were trying to reach.

We decided (after prayer and guidance) that we would be a contemporary church with a casual method, laid-back, caffeine driven, servant lead, community focused and non-religious (i.e., no religious icons, jargon, vestments, legalisms, etc.)

Our initial target group – because we feel no church can serve the needs of everybody and so need to find their God-given niche – were disenfranchised, unchurched/ dechurched/ overchurched/ underchurched/ prechurched Christians who felt like they were misfits in more traditional churches – which our community has more than its share of – and so had dropped out. We discovered much to our pleasant surprise that there were a large number of these people in our community and our church immediately took off.

So, having realized this up-front, we tailored our church as “Church Done Different” with our meetings deliberately designed to speak to this particular niche group, avoiding technical jargon, stuffy dress codes, phony religiosity, tedious offerings, emotional altar calls, etc.

But because this particular group was in serious need of teaching, we are also a “learning congregation” and I am the “teaching pastor” and my sermons are “Life Lessons” designed to present the Bible in a practical way (where the rubber meets the road) and in language that can be generally understood by anyone. Hopefully, I am following the example of Jesus who chose tangible parables to esoteric theology when He taught.

At the end of each lesson we do a formal blessing (a.k.a. benediction) to dismiss the congregation while inviting those who need prayer, especially those who need Christ, to remain for ministry by trained ministry teams.

This is, IMO, what it means to be seeker friendly. It may not work for everybody but it sure works for us.

\o/

 

[Doug45]

I have been in two fellowships that have heard the 'seeker sensitive' approach and have acceptied it to a degree. Enough that is to change what is existing to accomadate the lost.

The philosophy starts from the idea that we ask people to come to church and get saved there rather than seeing them saved and brought into the church as believers. The gospel should be being preached outside the church walls. And this should be the primary place for increase. Yet our concern in our seeker sensitive services is how many were saved in our services this past week? We fish in the pond when there is an ocean out there in which to throw our nets.

What seems to be a consistant result is that we sacrifice such things as the gifts of the Spirit, spontonaety, and liberty in the services in order to elliminate surprises and messes so that our reputation might not be tarnished by the 'bizarre'. In other words we choose to be 'seeker sensitive' rather than 'God sensitive'. We sacrifice a service led by the Spirit to one that is structured and shaped so that all agree with the total statement which surrounds the preaching.

I was in a fellowship which planned worship around a musucal key. There were 30 singers who sat in the congregation and led out songs from that key for all of the services within a given month. Not even the musicians prepared a set order or list of songs, but the singers waited on the Holy Spirit and sang as He led them. The prophetic people in the church stood in place and prophesied based on inspiration and we seldom had more than 2-3 prophecies in every service.

The remarkable thing about this 'chaos' was that the preached word was confirmed at least 75% of the time by the songs and prophecy without any common discussion between the elements of the service. In what I have known as 'seeker sensitive', this spontonaety is replaced with program. It became man centered, sensitive, and focused rather than God centered, sensitive or focused.

Basically, God has to check in with the pastor to find out if He can get a word in edgewise. Am I saying that pastors cannot hear from God? No. I am saying that not all revelation and inspiration come through one or two individuals in the church. And I am also saying that when there is this spontaneous confirmation, the Holy Spirit imparts a sense of His involvement that is never felt within the design of a program based service.

I want God to invade our worship. I want Him to explode in our midst with dunamis power. The canned version of church that I have seen makes little room for Him.

Just my thoughts and opinions.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

Actually, very few Seeker Friendly churches “poll” (in the official sense) their community. Most that I know of are church plants and are doing what we did. We (after prayer and guidance) decided what kind of church we wanted to be and who we were trying to reach.

We decided (after prayer and guidance) that we would be a contemporary church with a casual method, laid-back, caffeine driven, servant lead, community focused and non-religious (i.e., no religious icons, jargon, vestments, legalisms, etc.)

Our initial target group – because we feel no church can serve the needs of everybody and so need to find their God-given niche – were disenfranchised, unchurched/ dechurched/ overchurched/ underchurched/ prechurched Christians who felt like they were misfits in more traditional churches – which our community has more than its share of – and so had dropped out. We discovered much to our pleasant surprise that there were a large number of these people in our community and our church immediately took off.

So, having realized this up-front, we tailored our church as “Church Done Different” with our meetings deliberately designed to speak to this particular niche group, avoiding technical jargon, stuffy dress codes, phony religiosity, tedious offerings, emotional altar calls, etc.

But because this particular group was in serious need of teaching, we are also a “learning congregation” and I am the “teaching pastor” and my sermons are “Life Lessons” designed to present the Bible in a practical way (where the rubber meets the road) and in language that can be generally understood by anyone. Hopefully, I am following the example of Jesus who chose tangible parables to esoteric theology when He taught.

At the end of each lesson we do a formal blessing (a.k.a. benediction) to dismiss the congregation while inviting those who need prayer, especially those who need Christ, to remain for ministry by trained ministry teams.

This is, IMO, what it means to be seeker friendly. It may not work for everybody but it sure works for us.

\o/

I think the key is in the parts of your post that I've hightlighted...after prayer and guidence from God. So often I think, we find churches seeking everyone but Gods input. Then after all the plans are made they ask Him to bless it.

 

[luvinjesus111]

Jim

I agree with you Jim

Jesus spoke in parables he did not minimise sin, and I believe He would do the same today. Because the Gospel is presented in a understandable manner it does not mean those speaking miminise sin etc.
I must confess I find it hard myself when P/c's use religious jargon, it just seems to comes out of the mouth and many have no clue what it means.

ie I walked into a church coffee shop one day and I have a physical disability and my walking is not good. This lady shouted at me you need deliverence. Now at that time I was terrified by that word because I'd had really bad experiences and this caused great turmoil. If someone hadnot assured me otherwise that would have left me really troubled. Just my experience of the misuse of jargon. We need to be so careful in our use of words because if not clearly explained it can cause great damage.

karen

I'm sorry to laugh but that was funny though I'm sure it wasn't at the time. may you have many blessings in our wonderful Lord

 

[JimB]

I have been in two fellowships that have heard the 'seeker sensitive' approach and have acceptied it to a degree. Enough that is to change what is existing to accomadate the lost.

The philosophy starts from the idea that we ask people to come to church and get saved there rather than seeing them saved and brought into the church as believers. The gospel should be being preached outside the church walls. And this should be the primary place for increase. Yet our concern in our seeker sensitive services is how many were saved in our services this past week? We fish in the pond when there is an ocean out there in which to throw our nets.

What seems to be a consistant result is that we sacrifice such things as the gifts of the Spirit, spontonaety, and liberty in the services in order to elliminate surprises and messes so that our reputation might not be tarnished by the 'bizarre'. In other words we choose to be 'seeker sensitive' rather than 'God sensitive'. We sacrifice a service led by the Spirit to one that is structured and shaped so that all agree with the total statement which surrounds the preaching.

I was in a fellowship which planned worship around a musucal key. There were 30 singers who sat in the congregation and led out songs from that key for all of the services within a given month. Not even the musicians prepared a set order or list of songs, but the singers waited on the Holy Spirit and sang as He led them. The prophetic people in the church stood in place and prophesied based on inspiration and we seldom had more than 2-3 prophecies in every service.

The remarkable thing about this 'chaos' was that the preached word was confirmed at least 75% of the time by the songs and prophecy without any common discussion between the elements of the service. In what I have known as 'seeker sensitive', this spontonaety is replaced with program. It became man centered, sensitive, and focused rather than God centered, sensitive or focused.

Basically, God has to check in with the pastor to find out if He can get a word in edgewise. Am I saying that pastors cannot hear from God? No. I am saying that not all revelation and inspiration come through one or two individuals in the church. And I am also saying that when there is this spontaneous confirmation, the Holy Spirit imparts a sense of His involvement that is never felt within the design of a program based service.

I want God to invade our worship. I want Him to explode in our midst with dunamis power. The canned version of church that I have seen makes little room for Him.

Just my thoughts and opinions.

Hi Doug,

I would like to respectfully disagree. What you want and what is needed may be two different things. Apparently seeker sensitive is not for you, but then you are not a seeker. The other extreme to what you offer is a totally “spontaneous” service that gives exhibitionism center stage and creates more problems than solutions, and more questions than answers in the minds of seekers. Of course, we like to convince ourself whenwe have had an emotionally cathartic service that God has “invaded” the meeting. Why? Because there was a high degree of goose bumps and decibels and everyone got “blessed” (except of course, the unlearned who person who says you are nuts and leaves never to return again, see 1 Cor. 14.23).

What’s wrong with planning anyhow? The conduct for public meetings recommended by the Apostle seems to demand the opposite of what your “want” as his advice from 1 Corinthians 14 should clearly show:

8Again, if the trumpet does not sound a clear call, who will get ready for battle? ...

19But in the church I would rather speak five intelligible words to instruct others than ten thousand words in a tongue. ...

23So if the whole church comes together and everyone speaks in tongues, and some who do not understand or some unbelievers come in, will they not say that you are out of your mind? ...

26What then shall we say, brothers? When you come together, everyone has a hymn, or a word of instruction, a revelation, a tongue or an interpretation. All of these must be done for the strengthening of the church. 27If anyone speaks in a tongue, two—or at the most three—should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret. 28If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and God. ...

29Two or three prophets should speak, and the others should weigh carefully what is said. 30And if a revelation comes to someone who is sitting down, the first speaker should stop. 31For you can all prophesy in turn so that everyone may be instructed and encouraged. 32The spirits of prophets are subject to the control of prophets. ...

33For God is not a God of disorder but of peace. ...

40But everything should be done in a fitting and orderly way.

​

\o/

 

[Doug45]

Hi Doug,

I would like to respectfully disagree. What you want and what is needed may be two different things. Apparently seeker sensitive is not for you, but then you are not a seeker. The other extreme to what you offer is a totally “spontaneous” service that gives exhibitionism center stage and creates more problems than solutions, and more questions than answers in the minds of seekers. Of course, we like to convince ourself whenwe have had an emotionally cathartic service that God has “invaded” the meeting. Why? Because there was a high degree of goose bumps and decibels and everyone got “blessed” (except of course, the unlearned who person who says you are nuts and leaves never to return again, see 1 Cor. 14.23).

What’s wrong with planning anyhow? The conduct for public meetings recommended by the Apostle seems to demand the opposite of what your “want” as his advice from 1 Corinthians 14 should clearly show:

8Again, if the trumpet does not sound a clear call, who will get ready for battle? ...

19But in the church I would rather speak five intelligible words to instruct others than ten thousand words in a tongue. ...

23So if the whole church comes together and everyone speaks in tongues, and some who do not understand or some unbelievers come in, will they not say that you are out of your mind? ...

26What then shall we say, brothers? When you come together, everyone has a hymn, or a word of instruction, a revelation, a tongue or an interpretation. All of these must be done for the strengthening of the church. 27If anyone speaks in a tongue, two—or at the most three—should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret. 28If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and God. ...

29Two or three prophets should speak, and the others should weigh carefully what is said. 30And if a revelation comes to someone who is sitting down, the first speaker should stop. 31For you can all prophesy in turn so that everyone may be instructed and encouraged. 32The spirits of prophets are subject to the control of prophets. ...

33For God is not a God of disorder but of peace. ...

40But everything should be done in a fitting and orderly way.

​

\o/

Respectfully, I don't believe that I said anything about speaking in tongues without interpretation or the exclusion of a word of prophecy in the language of the congregation. And I don't think spontonaety has to be chaotic. I think the verse you quoted about when we gather everyone should have a psalm, hymn, a revelation, a teaching etc. does suggest spontonaety rather than planning.

Perhaps you apply your experience to my statements?

When I first was saved I went to an AOG church in Oklahoma. They were so far from being staid and conservative that my response was that I should never go back because surely God would strike them dead with lightning. The funny thing is that while my mind was offended, my spriit was hooked. I returned that evening and rehearsed my unwillingness to return. In the middle of a revival, I went back four nights in a row, kicking and screaming from my mind, but compelled by my spirit. I have been enthralled by God ever since.

I am a seeker. I seek the manifest presence of God. I seek to be a person of His presence so that wherever I go the life and power of the Holy Spirit touches those around me. I seek to re-present Jesus to a dying world in the same way that He demonstrated God to the world. I seek to see the miraculous as a regular ongoing part of my ministry and the ministry of the church that I attend.

My experience is the 'seeker sensitivity' and the fear of offense seems to shut down the supernatural movement within a body of people. Your experience with it is obviously different.

Blessings,

Doug

 

[JimB]

Respectfully, I don't believe that I said anything about speaking in tongues without interpretation or the exclusion of a word of prophecy in the language of the congregation. And I don't think spontonaety has to be chaotic. I think the verse you quoted about when we gather everyone should have a psalm, hymn, a revelation, a teaching etc. does suggest spontonaety rather than planning.

Perhaps you apply your experience to my statements?

When I first was saved I went to an AOG church in Oklahoma. They were so far from being staid and conservative that my response was that I should never go back because surely God would strike them dead with lightning. The funny thing is that while my mind was offended, my spriit was hooked. I returned that evening and rehearsed my unwillingness to return. In the middle of a revival, I went back four nights in a row, kicking and screaming from my mind, but compelled by my spirit. I have been enthralled by God ever since.

I am a seeker. I seek the manifest presence of God. I seek to be a person of His presence so that wherever I go the life and power of the Holy Spirit touches those around me. I seek to re-present Jesus to a dying world in the same way that He demonstrated God to the world. I seek to see the miraculous as a regular ongoing part of my ministry and the ministry of the church that I attend.

My experience is the 'seeker sensitivity' and the fear of offense seems to shut down the supernatural movement within a body of people. Your experience with it is obviously different.

Blessings,

Doug

I understand where you are coming from (I was saved in just such an AOG church as you mentioned … it finally fragmented and died, though) and I will add if spontaneity works for you, fine, but we cannot expect unlearned seekers to be as compliant of spontaneity as we are. I think that was part of what the Apostle was driving at and concerned about.

\o/

 

[rhemarob]

As the original poster of this thread I didn't think it would be such a controversial topic.

I see nothing wrong with a church being seeker friendly as long as The Word is being preached, if The Word is being compromised in an attempt just to get numbers that may be another story.

I personally don't care how The Word is packaged just as long its delivered.

 

[rhemarob]

Actually, very few Seeker Friendly churches “poll” (in the official sense) their community. Most that I know of are church plants and are doing what we did. We (after prayer and guidance) decided what kind of church we wanted to be and who we were trying to reach.

We decided (after prayer and guidance) that we would be a contemporary church with a casual method, laid-back, caffeine driven, servant lead, community focused and non-religious (i.e., no religious icons, jargon, vestments, legalisms, etc.)

Our initial target group – because we feel no church can serve the needs of everybody and so need to find their God-given niche – were disenfranchised, unchurched/ dechurched/ overchurched/ underchurched/ prechurched Christians who felt like they were misfits in more traditional churches – which our community has more than its share of – and so had dropped out. We discovered much to our pleasant surprise that there were a large number of these people in our community and our church immediately took off.

So, having realized this up-front, we tailored our church as “Church Done Different” with our meetings deliberately designed to speak to this particular niche group, avoiding technical jargon, stuffy dress codes, phony religiosity, tedious offerings, emotional altar calls, etc.

But because this particular group was in serious need of teaching, we are also a “learning congregation” and I am the “teaching pastor” and my sermons are “Life Lessons” designed to present the Bible in a practical way (where the rubber meets the road) and in language that can be generally understood by anyone. Hopefully, I am following the example of Jesus who chose tangible parables to esoteric theology when He taught.

At the end of each lesson we do a formal blessing (a.k.a. benediction) to dismiss the congregation while inviting those who need prayer, especially those who need Christ, to remain for ministry by trained ministry teams.

This is, IMO, what it means to be seeker friendly. It may not work for everybody but it sure works for us.

\o/

Sounds like a wonderful church to me Jim, especially the caffeine driven part !

 

[JimB]

As the original poster of this thread I didn't think it would be such a controversial topic.

I see nothing wrong with a church being seeker friendly as long as The Word is being preached, if The Word is being compromised in an attempt just to get numbers that may be another story.

I personally don't care how The Word is packaged just as long its delivered.

You are a wise man, rob.

\o/

 

[NacDan]

Caffiene is good. And I think our model works within our community (I'm a member of Jim's church).

Danny

 

[Simon_Templar]

The problem is that by repackaging.. in every case I've ever personaly witnessed it means something akin to turning the service into an episode of oprah.

There is a very basic concept that has been totaly lost by most of the protestant churches.. and the seeker friendly purpose driven movement is the furthest extent of this point. Church services, as described in the bible were for 2 purposes. In my previous post I had lapsed back into this mindset myself and momentarily forgotten the #1 purpose.

#1 purpose of church services... Virtually every time the new testament speaks of a service where believes gathered to worship it uses a greek word "leitourgia" which is where we get the modern word "liturgy". (don't freak out yet I'm not going to advocate prescripted services)... the greek word "leitourgia" is translated in the bible "service" or "minister" as in "the disciples gathered to minister unto the Lord".
The origin of this word is in ancient greece, the wealthy citizens of a city were required to put on an event for the common citizens.. in most cases it was either a musical event or a play or something like that.. the purpose was to entertain and keep up moral among the common citizens.. this was called "leitourgia"

Thus.. the main point of all church services held in the bible was that the believers gathered together and ministered (leitourgia) to God. The service they held was first and formost about pleasing God, and giving God offerings of worship etc.
In the churches I was raised in (non denom. charismatic) this idea was never present.. the entire service was focused on the congregation as an audience.

Now through out scripture God is very clear that he demands to be worshiped as he desires.. not as we find pleasing to ourselves. (see cain and abel etc).

#2 the other main point of a church service, as laid forth by Paul is to edify the body of Christ.. to feed the believers with the word, with the gifts of the spirit and through communion with God to build up their faith.

 

[laterunner]

I'm part of a seeker friendly body/church/assembly (New Frontiers)



Some othersare ''Seeker friendly'' making a cosy ''hospital'' just for the lost, lonely, sick & deprived. while the rest are ''open to all'' God is calling out of the world & it's sicknesses; those who are seeking the truth.
We don't have to load conviction on them,because God is thier creator & Father.
If the grace of God touches people when they are met ''at the door'';with no ulterior motive other than to be a blessing to them, you have been their humble servant; no??




Please bear this in mind for the sake of the new Christian.
(Your responsibility!!!!) ------>
At one of the bible weeks some years ago now one of the words was on "Plate Spinning" anyone that was there will never be able to forget it. I hope this will do the same for you. ;D ;D 8)
We "Mature"???Christians can be those who put burdens on new or young Christians that are not in Gods timing.
We might say to them (Joe)---->

"Well done your a Christian now Do you know what that means in your life" Joe enters stage left with a stick & that first plate to spin.

You are wanting to be most helpful to them that you ask
"Are you reading your bible every day" Joe the new Christian goes away to take care of this other plate on a stick. No problem moving from on stick to the other.

Your next effort to guide Joe on the right path
"Are you getting to the mid-week meeting" Now joe's got the problem of dealing with three plates but dispite a few wobbles he keeps them going.

"Joe you know what is is to be a Christian, you're reading your bible every day & are faithfully getting to the mid-week meetings. Are you praying early in the morning or in evening for an hour"
Joe now has real trouble getting to each of the sticks with plates, he must keep them spinning or they'll get broken.

Can you now see him running around trying to cope with those & the other plates other Christians might say that Joe needs to keep spinning.


We so much wants to help God do what we think He should be doing, don't we.
I'm so glad for the grace of God on my life. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

 

[Doug45]

I understand where you are coming from (I was saved in just such an AOG church as you mentioned … it finally fragmented and died, though) and I will add if spontaneity works for you, fine, but we cannot expect unlearned seekers to be as compliant of spontaneity as we are. I think that was part of what the Apostle was driving at and concerned about.

\o/

I agree that Paul was concerned about chaos in the Corinthian church and he prescribed some sense of order to eliminate the the abuses, but he didn't shut down the spontaneity and move of the Spirit within the gatherings.

From my contact with different churches who present themselves as seeker sensitive, they are more concerned with not offending people than not offending God. That to me is a trajedy and did not even enter Paul's mind concerning the Corinthian church.

Just where I'm coming from.

Doug