What Are Your Beliefs About 'Ghosts'?

[Eudaimonist]

It's amazing how far some will go to disprove something they know absolutely nothing about.

Oh, but I do know something about the subject of the ease with which people can misinterpret their experiences. And I haven't attempted to disprove anything. I'm not in a position to do that. I would have to have been there, and have an opportunity to carefully check things out, possibly with the aid of special equipment.

What I am saying is that people have an amazing tendency to fill in the blanks of their ignorance with the most familiar supernatural explanations that come to mind, instead of recognizing that their ability to imagine mundane explanations is limited.

The reasoning process seems to be: "if I can't think of a mundane explanation -- and I couldn't possibly fail to think of every possible one -- then it must be ghosts/demons/SpaceAliens/BigFoot/etc." Hey, perhaps it was "demons", but how can you be so certain that you've identified the cause?

It's like the example given earlier in this thread about sounds outside of the range of normal hearing that can make one feel terrified for no identifiable reason. If one believes that space aliens have the power to do that, then one will conclude space aliens. If one believes that ghosts can do that, then one will conclude ghosts. Few people will admit that they can't know all the possible mundane explanations (such as sound vibrations) that can account for the "supernatural" event.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[awitch]

Who/what else could it have been? Ever hear footsteps walk across an old wooden floor, or a light switch going on and off? There was no mistaking whatsoever.

Sure, footsteps, slamming doors, all that fun stuff. But assuming it is legitimately paranormal in nature, where's the malevolence? What's the point?

 

[Duckybill]

Sure, footsteps, slamming doors, all that fun stuff. But assuming it is legitimately paranormal in nature, where's the malevolence? What's the point?

I didn't say a thing about "slamming doors". The point is that Satan's power is in staying hidden. One way he does this is by convincing others of ghosts. It's all about deception. This is just one of his methods.

 

[awitch]

I didn't say a thing about "slamming doors". The point is that Satan's power is in staying hidden. One way he does this is by convincing others of ghosts. It's all about deception. This is just one of his methods.

The slamming doors was in my experience.
But what's the motivation for convincing other people it's ghosts? What does he gain from that? What does that accomplish?

 

[SithDoughnut]

.

 

[Duckybill]

The slamming doors was in my experience.
But what's the motivation for convincing other people it's ghosts? What does he gain from that? What does that accomplish?

That they are not demons, which in reality they are. Or that they are departed humans who didn't go to be with God or to Hell. Satan is the god of this age/world. His power is in staying hidden, in deception. God's Word uncovers him.

2 Corinthians 4:3-4 (NKJV)
3 But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4 whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.

 

[awitch]

That they are not demons, which in reality they are. Or that they are departed humans who didn't go to be with God or to Hell. Satan is the god of this age/world. His power is in staying hidden, deception. God's Word uncovers him.

I still don't see what making people think "they" are ghosts other than demons accomplishes. Other than being slightly irritating, what's the point?

 

[Duckybill]

I still don't see what making people think "they" are ghosts other than demons accomplishes. Other than being slightly irritating, what's the point?

Satan is in hiding. When uncovered he loses his power over those who recognize him.

 

[awitch]

Satan is in hiding. When uncovered he loses his power over those who recognize him.

I get that...maybe I need to rephrase.
What's the point of sending demons to play with the light switches and stomp their feet in the hallway in the first place? What is he trying to do? If the point is to remain hidden, then why do it at all?

 

[Zstar]

"Ghosts" are really evil spirits working for Satan to torment and deceive humans.

All of them?

 

[Zstar]

Being Christian forums, has anyone mentioned here about how Jesus acknowledged the existence of ghosts. Just a thought.

A few posts back was brought up a text in the gospels where the diciples thought it was a ghost walking on the sea - he didn't say they don't exsist or were demons but that it was him at that time.

 

[Zstar]

The nature of ghosts or spirits is largely believed to be products of our imagination.. We don't believe there can be say spiritual or psychic communication as in the case of mediums.

Personally I did attend a seance once many years ago and was not convinced there was anything really supernatural about it.. Actually one family tried to probe me with questions which I purposefully didn't answer and the medium could really say nothing about me.. The family was acting as confederates of the medium..

So to me the TV shows about ghosts are mostly playing on peoples imagination..

Thanks for your take on it! Wondered about the Baha'i stance.

 

[Ayersy]

In the same house with the harp, my Sister saw many many odd things. I saw a few others, but the really unexpected thing was our Brother, a devout atheist, saw so much he (like ayersy here) couldn't process it and he left.

Here's a short list:

hear the bicycle of a roommate pull up, very distinctive sound. You remember the 10 speeds in the 80's? Here all the normal sounds of him putting it away, up to and including the doorhandle to the inside turning. Nothing out of the ordinary. Except no one was there! Until 5 minutes later, when Clay did the exact same thing, like always.

That was the final straw for my brother, who checked out the first "arrival" thoroughly. So ayersy's theory is now shot full of holes.

Water faucets would turn on full blast, and turn off just before you could do so, so many times it's hardly worth a mention. Oldest trick in the book

Same thing with the radio. And alarm clock / radio. Troubling thing about this is when you turn away and it turns back on, it's not necessarily the same station. How's that work Ayersy?

Wendy, the harp player, was crying, at her harp. I don't know why. Her hair gets pushed back from her face, and her tears wiped away. No one is there.

Why my Sister and I hear it (same harp, different time) being drug across the floor, and when I take a look the top of it is above the door to Wendy's room, looking for all the world like a human head crunched in the closed door I don't know. I do know all points of entry were closed and locked from the inside, and all possible hiding places large enough for a person were checked thoroughly, and empty.

Go ahead and explain that away ...

Did you get any photographs of this apparent harp damage, per chance? That's the kind of thing I'd take photographs of, personally, you know, to prove it to people. As for the rest, either you're lying, or you're wrong. Both of those are certainly alot more plausible than the laws of physics being completely re-written.

How comes these types of things never happen to me, or people I know? Are you just that special, Raze?

 

[Ayersy]

FALSE. It simply refers to things we haven't discovered yet.

What SithDoughnut said.

When talking about the supernatural, you are implying there is another level of things going on, outside of the physical realm. This is far different than simply explaining things we find within the physical realm.

 

[Robban]

Have been thinking about this "ghost" thing. If there are ghosts, are they not supposed to be seen? "What happened, looks as if you have seen a ghost". They are usually illustrated as some kind of white sheet in the dark, suggesting a bright light maybe. Ghost town, ghostship describe abandanment or desertion,they don,t line up somehow.
Have heard one explaination of unidentified noises etc, belonging to a spirit/s who inhabited someone who after that they passed on occupied the house. So, is there a difference between ghosts and ghosts?

 

[Rationalt]

That they are not demons, which in reality they are. Or that they are departed humans who didn't go to be with God or to Hell.

I think that underlined portion has no biblical support.People either go to heaven or hell after judgement day.There is nothing in between.

Satan is the god of this age/world. His power is in staying hidden, in deception. God's Word uncovers him.

Seems in this case satan/demon is strongly revealing his presence.

2 Corinthians 4:3-4 (NKJV)

3 But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4 whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.

If what you described is the work of satan he is actually trying to scare you away instead of enticing you.The works of satan is actually pushing you closer to god.

Btw, there could be a very simple explanation like an extended insulated electic wire attached to the switches in question was being moved by a rodent.

 

[Zstar]

In the same house with the harp, my Sister saw many many odd things. I saw a few others, but the really unexpected thing was our Brother, a devout atheist, saw so much he (like ayersy here) couldn't process it and he left.

Here's a short list:

hear the bicycle of a roommate pull up, very distinctive sound. You remember the 10 speeds in the 80's? Here all the normal sounds of him putting it away, up to and including the doorhandle to the inside turning. Nothing out of the ordinary. Except no one was there! Until 5 minutes later, when Clay did the exact same thing, like always.

That was the final straw for my brother, who checked out the first "arrival" thoroughly. So ayersy's theory is now shot full of holes.

Water faucets would turn on full blast, and turn off just before you could do so, so many times it's hardly worth a mention. Oldest trick in the book

Same thing with the radio. And alarm clock / radio. Troubling thing about this is when you turn away and it turns back on, it's not necessarily the same station. How's that work Ayersy?

Wendy, the harp player, was crying, at her harp. I don't know why. Her hair gets pushed back from her face, and her tears wiped away. No one is there.

Why my Sister and I hear it (same harp, different time) being drug across the floor, and when I take a look the top of it is above the door to Wendy's room, looking for all the world like a human head crunched in the closed door I don't know. I do know all points of entry were closed and locked from the inside, and all possible hiding places large enough for a person were checked thoroughly, and empty.

Go ahead and explain that away ...

Wondered what you would share with us -

The bycycle one sounds like a disturbance in time to me, pretty cool if you study Astronomy.

Better check that seal better take a closer look at your faucet, I had to close the hot outlet of mine becuase it kept opening.

The timers or components of the electrical phenomonon might be logically explained too.

I've heard about other 'personal experiences' of music being heard from old instuments without strings or the capability of making sounds.

 

[Zstar]

What SithDoughnut said.

When talking about the supernatural, you are implying there is another level of things going on, outside of the physical realm. This is far different than simply explaining things we find within the physical realm.

I think that's a good summary. I'm a big fan of "Ghost Hunters", that's where I heard of 'de-bunk' - find a logical explanation. Researching in the library I've read both thier books - there are just some things outside a logical explanation.

 

[Zstar]

Have been thinking about this "ghost" thing. If there are ghosts, are they not supposed to be seen? "What happened, looks as if you have seen a ghost". They are usually illustrated as some kind of white sheet in the dark, suggesting a bright light maybe. Ghost town, ghostship describe abandanment or desertion,they don,t line up somehow.
Have heard one explaination of unidentified noises etc, belonging to a spirit/s who inhabited someone who after that they passed on occupied the house. So, is there a difference between ghosts and ghosts?

The limitations of launguage is kinda evident. I brought up a few posts back about the most ancient accounts we have of ghosts - this really intersests me so much.

 

[Zstar]

I think that underlined portion has no biblical support.People either go to heaven or hell after judgement day.There is nothing in between.

Seems in this case satan/demon is strongly revealing his presence.



If what you described is the work of satan he is actually trying to scare you away instead of enticing you.The works of satan is actually pushing you closer to god.

Btw, there could be a very simple explanation like an extended insulated electic wire attached to the switches in question was being moved by a rodent.

What if there really a Purgatory, like the Catholics believe? Or a gap between?
To me this would not limit God, One who spent everything into excistance.