The Swimming Pool and the Big Bang

[TemperateSeaIsland]

I find that very, very difficult to believe.

Thats because your ignorant of basic science, sorry but that's the truth.

Of course, you had to change my OP from a swimming pool to a tank, but hey, what else is old?

Whats a swimming pool have to do with anything now? Your assertion is that hydrogen or oxygen alone would explode if subjected to a lit match.

I'm simply pointing out that you can't light a match around Substance A, you can't light a match around Substance B, but combine Substance A with Substance B, and it's safe enough to drink.

If it makes you feel better you can throw a match into a swimming pool that contains molecular oxygen. Just go to an empty swimming pool and throw a match in, I know it's only got around 20% oxygen but it's reasonable experiment. Did it explode?

Didnt notice this... so

Ya --- they can answer, "What caused this?"

Hydrogen gas in the zeppelin reacting with oxygen in the atmosphere.

 

[faster_jackrabbit]

He should know what it is already, after all, it's in the Bible, and it's what Christians are supposed to be.

Not only that, but Lot's wife supposedly turned into it.

 

[Patashu]

Okay, since everyone's struggling to understand, let me rephrase it in a more poignant manner:

Why is it that Hydrogen and Oxygen ignite when separate, but don't ignite when combined in the right amount --- in this case: H[sub]2[/sub]O ?

Because the reaction of hydrogen and oxygen is exothermic (leads to products with stronger bonds, thus releasing energy) and therefore once the reaction begins the heat released can provide the activation energy for reaction in further molecules.
The decomposition of H2O, being the reverse reaction, is thus endothermic. If you electrolyze water it takes in energy and can't spread to consume all the water.

 

[MrGoodBytes]

I guess we can add chemistry to the list of things AV1611VET skipped in high school.

 

[flatworm]

I find that very, very difficult to believe.

The "Or" is crucial. Pure hydrogen OR pure oxygen. The two mixed together within certain bounds of concentration yields an explosive mixture.

Look up the Mythbusters episode where they try to create a methane explosion in a port-a-potty. They repeatedly failed to achieve ignition because the methane concentration was too high.

http://kwc.org/mythbusters/2005/03/mythbusters_exploding_portapot.html

Do we seriously have a 5-page thread dedicated to explaining the basics of combustion?

 

[Freodin]

I find that very, very difficult to believe.

Of course, you had to change my OP from a swimming pool to a tank, but hey, what else is old?

Hydrogene is a gas lighter than air at room temperature. It would not stay in your swimming pool.

 

[Tomk80]

This thread is really funny.

 

[AV1611VET]

Hydrogene is a gas lighter than air at room temperature. It would not stay in your swimming pool.

It would if my swimming pool was upside-down.

 

[AV1611VET]

Look up the Mythbusters episode where they try to create a methane explosion in a port-a-potty.

I saw that episode on TV --- only I thought it was a makeshift house.

Okay, so let me see if I've learned anything here.

Hydrogen, as a stand-alone gas does not explode? Is that correct?

If you generate a spark in an enclosed tank of H, nothing will happen?

 

[flatworm]

I saw that episode on TV --- only I thought it was a makeshift house.

Okay, so let me see if I've learned anything here.

Hydrogen, as a stand-alone gas does not explode? Is that correct?

If you generate a spark in an enclosed tank of H, nothing will happen?

Correct. Except in normal gaseous form, it's H2.

 

[AV1611VET]

Correct. Except in normal gaseous form, it's H2.

Okie - doke --- thanks for the lesson, guys.

 

[yasic]

To put it simply, matter has various amount of energy associated with the state.

For instance H2 has some energy, O has some more, and H2O has a third amount. When you change the state of some matter, some energy must be given off or taken away in order to make it work.

For instance, lets say H2 has 3 units of energy, O has 2 units of energy, and H2O has 4 units of energy.

If we combine an H2 and a O into an H2O we went from (3+2 = 5) to 4 units of energy. That means that we have 1 unit of energy left over... this is what causes the energy (or explosion) when you light H2 and O

If you have a tank of only Hydrogen, then you basically have lots of H2. There is nothing of a lower energy state you can turn H2 into to get it to explode.

Water is H20 and it does not change states. if you wanted to turn H20 into H2 and O you would have to supply a unit of energy, not have one released. this is why nothing happens when you through a match into a pool.



And do know this is overly simplified, like how the O would have to be O2 and a host of other issues...

I hope some of what I said makes sense

 

[[serious]]

I saw that episode on TV --- only I thought it was a makeshift house.

Okay, so let me see if I've learned anything here.

Hydrogen, as a stand-alone gas does not explode? Is that correct?

If you generate a spark in an enclosed tank of H, nothing will happen?

That is correct. Jupiter is made mostly of hydrogen and has lightning storms. Lots of sparks, no explosion. The sun, despite being superheated, only "burns" by nuclear fusion of hydrogen. It does not conventionally burn because there is no oxygen.

 

[AV1611VET]

I hope some of what I said makes sense

Yes --- thank you --- that was very interesting.

 

[AV1611VET]

Jupiter is made mostly of hydrogen and has lightning storms. Lots of sparks, no explosion.

Another very good point --- thanks ---

 

[yasic]

Glad to help

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

That is correct. Jupiter is made mostly of hydrogen and has lightning storms. Lots of sparks, no explosion. The sun, despite being superheated, only "burns" by nuclear fusion of hydrogen. It does not conventionally burn because there is no oxygen.

That reminds me of a movie I saw when I was young and gave me nightmares for months.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0051413/



Dissolved Sailor (Let me try on the pants!)

 

[sinan90]

Okay, since everyone's struggling to understand, let me rephrase it in a more poignant manner:

Why is it that Hydrogen and Oxygen ignite when separate, but don't ignite when combined in the right amount --- in this case: H[sub]2[/sub]O ?

H[sub]2[/sub] +1/2 O[sub]2[/sub] -> H[sub]2[/sub]O is exothermic, ie the energy of the reaction is greater than the energy of activation, hence energy given off. The opposite is endothermic, ie you need to put energy in so there is no release of energy.

 

[MrGoodBytes]

Guys, guys. This is E&C. We are supposed to mock each other's lack of education and grammar, you can't just go and teach people useful stuff in a way they understand.

 

[Gracchus]

Guys, guys. This is E&C. We are supposed to mock each other's lack of education and grammar, you can't just go and teach people useful stuff in a way they understand.

I think the risk that anyone is going to learn is minimal.