The modern Republican party is hurtling towards fascism

[Handmaid for Jesus]

Fascist policies would involve things like nationalizing some industries, outlawing labor unions, full-blown government censorship, and launching foreign wars. Trump did none of that

He didn't do it but he wanted to and still wants to. Just listen to what he says. IMHO the only reason he didn't do it was because there were principled people in his orbit that prevented it.

 

[Merrill]

I mentioned the specific feature Trumpism ("Trumpism" btw, is not Trump himself...which you seem not to have noticed) shares with classifical fascism as defined by the people who invented it.

Fascism might involve such things, but those actions are also shared by other forms of totalitarianism and authoritarianism.

The unique feature of classical fascism is that a single individual is identified and accepted as the irreplaceable embodiment of the ethos and collective will of the movement. That's Trumpism.

Calling Trump a Fascist is equivalent to calling Biden a Communist

neither is true, and is just silly

Trump plays up this Teddy Roosevelt power presidency--that he can single-handedly get things done while others couldn't.

Sometimes this works to our benefit, as when the Trump administration blocked the sale of the Port of Long Beach (basically the largest container port in the US) from being sold to a CCP-run company called COSCO in 2017. Can you imagine what would have happened in the following years if the Chinese government controlled our shipping in the Pacific?

other times he oversteps his bounds and does silly or counter-productive things

but if we are going to declare presidential overreach as authoritarian (and it can be), why aren't we looking at Biden's latest attempts to circumvent law, and even the Constitution, to "forgive" 559 billion dollars in student loan debt, which amounts to stealing from taxpayers and the middle-class in order to reward his upper-middle-class, coastal supporters?

And how about the Democrats doing things like instituting "vaccine passports" in places like New York, or issuing take-down notices to social media companies when people on those platforms criticize the administration, or ask about Hunter's laptop?

I got new for you: our whole government is "authoritarian" and this idea that it is one orange guy who is the problem is complete nonsense.

 

[JustOneWay]

other times he oversteps his bounds and does silly or counter-productive things

Like staging a coup on the government, refusing to return classified documents, sexual abuse on a woman, and about 90 other criminal indictments.

silly things to do, right?

 

[Fantine]

It seems some of you are trying to do a PR job on fascism.

Saying it's not "exactly" fascism...and therefore we don't have to worry about it...

It's not working for those who are discerning. Let's put it this way: "almost" fascism is bad," "indications" of fascism is bad, fascism by any other name is bad.

You are doing America a disservice trying to assuage their very justifiable concerns.

Don't fall for the PR job, Americans.

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

Calling Trump a Fascist is equivalent to calling Biden a Communist

neither is true, and is just silly

Trump plays up this Teddy Roosevelt power presidency--that he can single-handedly get things done while others couldn't.

Sometimes this works to our benefit, as when the Trump administration blocked the sale of the Port of Long Beach (basically the largest container port in the US) from being sold to a CCP-run company called COSCO in 2017. Can you imagine what would have happened in the following years if the Chinese government controlled our shipping in the Pacific?

other times he oversteps his bounds and does silly or counter-productive things

but if we are going to declare presidential overreach as authoritarian (and it can be), why aren't we looking at Biden's latest attempts to circumvent law, and even the Constitution, to "forgive" 559 billion dollars in student loan debt, which amounts to stealing from taxpayers and the middle-class in order to reward his upper-middle-class, coastal supporters?

And how about the Democrats doing things like instituting "vaccine passports" in places like New York, or issuing take-down notices to social media companies when people on those platforms criticize the administration, or ask about Hunter's laptop?

I got new for you: our whole government is "authoritarian" and this idea that it is one orange guy who is the problem is complete nonsense.

Oh PULEEZ! Stop with the whataboutism!

 

[RDKirk]

Calling Trump a Fascist is equivalent to calling Biden a Communist

neither is true, and is just silly

Trump plays up this Teddy Roosevelt power presidency--that he can single-handedly get things done while others couldn't.

Sometimes this works to our benefit, as when the Trump administration blocked the sale of the Port of Long Beach (basically the largest container port in the US) from being sold to a CCP-run company called COSCO in 2017. Can you imagine what would have happened in the following years if the Chinese government controlled our shipping in the Pacific?

other times he oversteps his bounds and does silly or counter-productive things

but if we are going to declare presidential overreach as authoritarian (and it can be), why aren't we looking at Biden's latest attempts to circumvent law, and even the Constitution, to "forgive" 559 billion dollars in student loan debt, which amounts to stealing from taxpayers and the middle-class in order to reward his upper-middle-class, coastal supporters?

And how about the Democrats doing things like instituting "vaccine passports" in places like New York, or issuing take-down notices to social media companies when people on those platforms criticize the administration, or ask about Hunter's laptop?

I got new for you: our whole government is "authoritarian" and this idea that it is one orange guy who is the problem is complete nonsense.

Well, since you're not actually reading what I'm writing, there's no point in my wasting time.

 

[Merrill]

Like staging a coup on the government, refusing to return classified documents, sexual abuse on a woman, and about 90 other criminal indictments.

silly things to do, right?

I never made excuses for Trump

but I suggest you take a look at all the influence peddling, international bribery, and sketchy stuff the Biden's have been up to for the last 20 years

Even Obama didn't like Joe, thought he was corrupt and incompetent, and didn't want to endorse him

 

[Merrill]

Well, since you're not actually reading what I'm writing, there's no point in my wasting time.

It was pretty clear I did read your post and was responding directly to it

My take is that Trump is not a "Fascist" --I doubt Trump even knows what Fascism is, as most people don't.

And I never said we didn't have to worry about Trump's authoritarianism. I pointed out that Biden is just as authoritarian, if not worse in many ways.

 

[A2SG]

It was pretty clear I did read your post and was responding directly to it

My take is that Trump is not a "Fascist" --I doubt Trump even knows what Fascism is, as most people don't.

And I never said we didn't have to worry about Trump's authoritarianism. I pointed out that Biden is just as authoritarian, if not worse in many ways.

I dunno....forgiving student debt versus lying about an election being stolen and trying to stay in power despite losing....

Not sure I see the two as equivalent, really.

-- A2SG, not exactly a Biden supporter here, but come on.....

 

[Pommer]

It was pretty clear I did read your post and was responding directly to it

My take is that Trump is not a "Fascist" --I doubt Trump even knows what Fascism is, as most people don't.

And I never said we didn't have to worry about Trump's authoritarianism. I pointed out that Biden is just as authoritarian, if not worse in many ways.

Trump isn’t fascist.
Fascists (for all of their faults), live by principles.
Trump is a Right-wing authoritarian cult leader, an actual mythos would require a framework of principles on which to build.
Trump has utilitarianism coursing through his veins, he’ll do whatever, say whatever he feels he needs to do (or say) to achieve his aim, whatever that happens to be that day.

That’s it.

 

[USincognito]

but I suggest you take a look at all the influence peddling, international bribery, and sketchy stuff the Biden's have been up to for the last 20 years

You mean the rumors, innuendo, tales of missing and dead whistleblowers and other fantasies about his supposed corruption for which there's no actual evidence? Is your reference to "international bribery" an allusion to the long debunked Shokin firing myth?

Even Obama didn't like Joe, thought he was corrupt and incompetent, and didn't want to endorse him

Citation needed.

And I never said we didn't have to worry about Trump's authoritarianism. I pointed out that Biden is just as authoritarian, if not worse in many ways.

An absolutely insane assertion if one were to make it. President Biden isn't calling American citizens vermin, stirring up racial and religious animus, there is no plan for him to replace the entire military and government structure of this country with yes men, called the press "the enemy of the people", etc.

 

[RDKirk]

It was pretty clear I did read your post and was responding directly to it

My take is that Trump is not a "Fascist" --I doubt Trump even knows what Fascism is, as most people don't.

And I never said we didn't have to worry about Trump's authoritarianism. I pointed out that Biden is just as authoritarian, if not worse in many ways.

I said repeatedly that Trumpism is not Trump.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I mentioned the specific feature Trumpism ("Trumpism" btw, is not Trump himself...which you seem not to have noticed) shares with classifical fascism as defined by the people who invented it.

Fascism might involve such things, but those actions are also shared by other forms of totalitarianism and authoritarianism.

The unique feature of classical fascism is that a single individual is identified and accepted as the irreplaceable embodiment of the ethos and collective will of the movement. That's Trumpism.

I think you can successfully argue that a cult of personality often undergirds the beginning of a fascist state.

That can be said of many nations and revolutions and rebellions though. George Washington for example, became somewhat synonymous with the nation we live in....

Hitler, Mussolini? Sure...but also Mao, Stalin, and Pol Pot. I'm not sure that the cult of personality is necessarily fascism in of itself. One could easily say that Obama was elevated by his supporters beyond criticism and would claim anyone who found fault in him was racist. The right mocked the left as idolizing him...and in some ways they did. Many ranked him amongst the greatest Presidents ever.

Mussolini outlined fascism in a foundational document (I don't recall the name). The fascist nation is pro-collectivist, and against individualism. It's imperialist and seeks expansion through conquest. It's non-democratic, and the controlling party is hierarchical. Every person is expected to contribute to the state, and the state is obligated to the basic welfare of every person.

I can't stress the all encompassing nature of the state easily....nor the way the state is expected to, at all times, pursue the collective welfare of all. It's actually not a surprise why Hitler, admiring Mussolini, married socialism to nationalism. Both sides claim he was a product of the other....but he was really a product of both.

 

[RDKirk]

I think you can successfully argue that a cult of personality often undergirds the beginning of a fascist state.

That can be said of many nations and revolutions and rebellions though. George Washington for example, became somewhat synonymous with the nation we live in....

Hitler, Mussolini? Sure...but also Mao, Stalin, and Pol Pot. I'm not sure that the cult of personality is necessarily fascism in of itself. One could easily say that Obama was elevated by his supporters beyond criticism and would claim anyone who found fault in him was racist. The right mocked the left as idolizing him...and in some ways they did. Many ranked him amongst the greatest Presidents ever.

I would argue that Mao, Stalin, Pol Pot--and let's throw the Kim dynasty in there--were more fascist than Communist. If the state isn't being run by a committee, but is actually controlled by an untoucheable strongman, it's not Communist. It's not necessarily fascist (it could be a monarchy, even), but it's not Communist.

Mussolini outlined fascism in a foundational document (I don't recall the name). The fascist nation is pro-collectivist, and against individualism. It's imperialist and seeks expansion through conquest. It's non-democratic, and the controlling party is hierarchical. Every person is expected to contribute to the state, and the state is obligated to the basic welfare of every person.

I can't stress the all encompassing nature of the state easily....nor the way the state is expected to, at all times, pursue the collective welfare of all. It's actually not a surprise why Hitler, admiring Mussolini, married socialism to nationalism. Both sides claim he was a product of the other....but he was really a product of both.

As I've mentioned, fascist states will have many characteristics in common with other types of totalitarianism. But a fascist state will always have Il Duce, Der Fuhrer, or Dear Leader.

 

[durangodawood]

Fascism is more about dreams of state-glory for people who feel put down and irrelevant ("make ____ great again").

Communism is more about lies of state enforced economic justice for people who feel stolen from ("to each according to their needs...")

 

[joan1431]

The leftist ideology is what caused America to be in its current state. I suggest you educate yourself on communism. You will find the progressive left is backed by the communist party. Look up the school of thought. See the cpusa website etc.

This is also not the place for your political beliefs. This is a Christian forum for Christians to talk about scripture.

 

[Desk trauma]

This is also not the place for your political beliefs. This is a Christian forum for Christians to talk about scripture.

Per the statement of purpose of this forum that's incorrect.

 

[iluvatar5150]

The leftist ideology is what caused America to be in its current state.

What state is that?

Can you point to a country with a right-wing ideology that's doing better?

 

[Occams Barber]

This is also not the place for your political beliefs. This is a Christian forum for Christians to talk about scripture.

This is the American Politics Forum.

It is specifically intended as a place to discuss US politics. CF has Forums covering a range of topics. If you wish to discuss scripture etc. there are a multitude of other Forums available to you.

American Politics Forum Statement of Purpose​

The American Politics forum is open for all members to discuss and debate political topics that apply specifically to the United States.​

​

OB

 

[USincognito]

The leftist ideology is what caused America to be in its current state.

Such as, and what state would that be?

I suggest you educate yourself on communism. You will find the progressive left is backed by the communist party. Look up the school of thought. See the cpusa website etc.

I'm going suggest that you have been misinformed. Progressivism is an approach to issues rather than an ideology. Many liberals progressives focus social issues. Christian progressives focus on economic inequality. An older, but still relevant example of the latter was William J. Bryan.

This is also not the place for your political beliefs. This is a Christian forum for Christians to talk about scripture.

You might find browsing the various sections of CF and reading the pinned posts to be informative.