The BIG misunderstanding about creation?

[stranger]

Belief for me started at first conciousness [even though I had no words obviously] ... I was aware that I came for 'one-ness' that was complete and yet found myself an 'individual' separated conciousness in a 'world that was not 'me', not controllable... my immediate reaction was 'Let me back' , this is not what I am, not what I want ...

Interestingly perhaps about half of people who remember experince joy in that first moment , a sense of freedom , that is something that has taken me a lifetime to understand.... what did you feel in that instant?

But having realised that life, however transient and unreal, is a journey of first coming to doubt that love is enough for life and then seeing that nothing else comes close , one can come to accept that all things that happen in this world are predicated to that process in ALL creation ... and that it continues in the next [righteous, loving] world

Thus reality as we see it is more like a series [of up to three] 'dreams' to me... we came from what we call 'spirit' and eventually that is what we are [translation to immortal spirit si the end of space and time experience] ... so the interesting thing is to find out why the dreams exist, why they are as realistic to us as our dreams when we are asleep ...

God then is just the wholeness that we are , and pantheists nearly got it right except that they mistake God for projected reality instead of as the source of the projection outside, beyond, that projection of space-time, individual conciousnesses, selves, angels, etc

Thus 'creaton' is just a projection from the spirit, God simply says and it is so... it is not unlike a computer programmer creating a virutal reality and giving the virtual figures in it some kind of artificial intelligence ...

It rather puts the whole seemingly endless dispute about what caused us into persepective !! No-one is wrong, but there is a bigger picture that makes the dispute pale into insignificance ..

 

[California Tim]

I have no idea what you just said, though I tried.

 

[stranger]

OK ...so tell me just one of the things you didn't understand then... and perhaps we can get a little further step by step?

 

[philadiddle]

this seems to be a post that discusses existence, not creation. at least that's the way i read it

 

[ebia]

OK ...so tell me just one of the things you didn't understand then... and perhaps we can get a little further step by step?

Maybe if you get the spelling and grammer to the point where someone can read it first...

 

[stranger]

this seems to be a post that discusses existence, not creation. at least that's the way i read it

Rather it discusses both in the implications of the misunderstanding of 'existence' for the understanding of creation...

if then existence simply cannot be the projected world we deal with as 'selves' then its creation is as much part of the dream as 'existence' in the 'dream'.... and the approach to understanding existence is not through models in this world but through prayer to God and meditation with yearning for His truth , not by relying on the purely conditional [relative] houses of cards constructed by men as 'explanations' , religions, institutions, etc ...

what seems impossible is possible within virtual reality and thus to have faith in rationality within the dream is less rational [sic] than to have faith in what is 'outside' the dream, God ...

Just as in a dream one can sometimes become aware that one is dreaming , so in life one can become aware that this is not our source nor our destination ... thus its creation is not going to be understood fromwithin the dream, but from our [limited so far] knowledge of what is 'outside' it ....

 

[stranger]

Maybe if you get the spelling and grammer to the point where someone can read it first...

Thanks for pointing out my typos, my typing is not good and my eyesight is not good either, I have attempted to correct what I could find now ...

 

[stranger]

Melchizedek [Melchisedec in NT] is indeed one key in scripture to understanding that the many churches of men totally ignore, yet Jesus is the high priest of the order of Melchizedek [NOW!]

Melchizedek is ignored simply because men simply cannot wrap their minds around the spiritual realities written briefly about in scripture , men cannot accept that this is an immortal being to whom Abraham gave honour and that Jesus came after Melchizedek , in his image as priest to men [interface between God and man]

The misunderstanding is almost complete, and men do not even realise that God deludes the men of religion who guide christianity in this world -2Thess 2- a "strong delusion" with a purpose, the very salvation of those who pretend that they know and teach others their delusion about Christ and God ... and indeed the salvation [Rev 7:9-10] of those many who fiollow these blind leaders , men who ironically condemn those who follow the same broad way of the many that they themselves follow, ... yet the many are saved despite their destruction in death, and they are rightly condemned to death for sin, the churches are the seat of sin against God in the name of christianity ... but the scripture actually describes all this, it mUST happen, men must be deluded, must worship Satan as if he were Christ , a false image , a modern image ...

Thus the interface remains despite that men deface it in churches with their necessary soothsayings , the PERFECT priesthood, the image of the son of God yet remains undefiled, but is NOT the image in the minds of most men...

Thus Melchizedek is NOT understood by men because natural man CANNOT understand him :-

1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

One cannot get around this in words, there is no way in words... one cannot explain to people that they are locked into the perception of self as their identity, not their spirit as their 'identity' ... the reason is that the slef is truly, and very deeply, afraid of loss of itself ... man is locked into the illusion of projected reality [what we even call 'physical reality']

thus the interface to God is like a taboo to the self because in it is imjplicit deepest fear ... not just the fear generated by the deep knowledge that we are imperfect and thus unacceptable assacrifice to God, but the deeper fear that on is NOT an individual , not a self, one is spirit, created in the image of God who is SPIRIT, not individual being...

Thus Melchizedek is a projection of the 'priesthood of God, the unremovable connection to the spirit , the thing that generates 'self' in man and the thing that ultimately removes self fom man ... shows that self is the illusion, not spirit....

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Stranger,
While I understand and agree with most of what you say I think that you are leaving out the most important element needed to understanding what you've just said, that is, that man is mortal, of the earth, and he knows that as primary reality. Only those called to spiritual understanding can begin to know the things of the spirit.

Many (mortals) are called but few are chosen. Only the chosen are granted spiritual understanding. Therefore spiritual understanding is only granted to the few.

While it's generous for christians to widely embrace humanity, and include them in the gift of salvation, God makes no such offer.

 

[mark kennedy]

In reading the previous posts I felt as if I were riding a magic carpet smoking my hookah. What you are describing is some kind of eastern mysticism whether you know it or not. I'm not really interested in that to tell you the truth but you do have a couple of Biblical referances I wanted to discuss.

Melchizedek [Melchisedec in NT] is indeed one key in scripture to understanding that the many churches of men totally ignore, yet Jesus is the high priest of the order of Melchizedek [NOW!]

Melchizedek is ignored simply because men simply cannot wrap their minds around the spiritual realities written briefly about in scripture , men cannot accept that this is an immortal being to whom Abraham gave honour and that Jesus came after Melchizedek , in his image as priest to men [interface between God and man]

Melchizedek was both a high priest of Eloihim (the universal name for God). He was also the King of Salem which was ancient Jerusalem who came out to Abraham after the rescue of Lot. He came out with bread, wine and a blessing. "Blessed is Abraham of the Most High God who posseses the heavens and the earth."

The passage in Hebrews 7 talks about Melkizedek being without genealogy. The word is 'agenealogetos' and cannot be found anywhere in the New Testament or ancient Greek literature. The author was a Greek technician, he created one word that makes up an entire paragraph, at any rate. The idea is that he did not owe his kingdom to an inherited title and he was not priest because he was born from the Levetical tribe. He occupied the office of King/Priest because of the soverign will of God.

The misunderstanding is almost complete, and men do not even realise that God deludes the men of religion who guide christianity in this world -2Thess 2- a "strong delusion" with a purpose, the very salvation of those who pretend that they know and teach others their delusion about Christ and God ... and indeed the salvation [Rev 7:9-10] of those many who fiollow these blind leaders , men who ironically condemn those who follow the same broad way of the many that they themselves follow, ... yet the many are saved despite their destruction in death, and they are rightly condemned to death for sin, the churches are the seat of sin against God in the name of christianity ... but the scripture actually describes all this, it mUST happen, men must be deluded, must worship Satan as if he were Christ , a false image , a modern image ...

God does not give them a delusion so they will believe a lie, he just doesn't give them the wisdom to discern it. Now I don't really know what you perceive this delusion of modern churchmen to be nor these nebulous churches that you call 'the seat of sin'. What I do know is that the delusion that is described in 2 Thess. 2 describes a delusion (lit. beguile) in which the fall away from the faith. The context is clear that this is a falling away from the faith to believe the same lie the Devil has told from the begining, 'ye shall be as gods'. In eastern mysticism it is described as 'Thou art that'.

Thus the interface remains despite that men deface it in churches with their necessary soothsayings , the PERFECT priesthood, the image of the son of God yet remains undefiled, but is NOT the image in the minds of most men...

This is a falling away from the faith, the central doctrine of all the churches and churchmen of the Christian faith. The apostasy is marked by a departure to follow the Antichrist. The text is pretty clear, I think you are confused about what the context and content of these verses.

Thus Melchizedek is NOT understood by men because natural man CANNOT understand him :-

1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Here is the truth that is spiritually discerned:

"For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing but to us who are being saved it is the power of God." (I Cor. 1:18)

And again the Scriptures speak to this:

"But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ to all and on all who believe." (Romans 3:21)

One cannot get around this in words, there is no way in words... one cannot explain to people that they are locked into the perception of self as their identity, not their spirit as their 'identity' ... the reason is that the slef is truly, and very deeply, afraid of loss of itself ... man is locked into the illusion of projected reality [what we even call 'physical reality']

Ahhhh good ole transendentalism, now there is the eastern mysticism I spoke of earlier. The world of sense is an elaborate illusion but seem to ignore that external objects really exist as they appear. God created both the object and the ability of the mind to apprehend to object as it exists in reality.

thus the interface to God is like a taboo to the self because in it is imjplicit deepest fear ... not just the fear generated by the deep knowledge that we are imperfect and thus unacceptable assacrifice to God, but the deeper fear that on is NOT an individual , not a self, one is spirit, created in the image of God who is SPIRIT, not individual being...

So we are to transend the illusory images contrived by our individuality into the etheral mystical spirit realm of ulitmate reality. Apparently I have not attained reality since the events that happened in time and space throughout redemptive history are all quite real in my mind.

Thus Melchizedek is a projection of the 'priesthood of God, the unremovable connection to the spirit , the thing that generates 'self' in man and the thing that ultimately removes self fom man ... shows that self is the illusion, not spirit....

That is stangely familar, wait, I know where I heard this before and it wasn't in Scripture. I don't know if this is karma, Nirvana, dharma, samsara maya or one of the others. I do know that you didn't get this from the New Testament, this is classic eastern mysticism.

 

[Dannager]

I...don't think this is the proper place for this subject.

I don't really have any idea what the subject is trying to be, but I don't think this is the place for it.

 

[LoG]

Jesus being a high priest on the order of Melchizedek, then Melchizedek was/is a high priest on the order of Jesus, verified by Abraham giving him a tenth as tithe.
Many are called but few are chosen because of the resistance to taking off the rags of self and putting on the wedding clothes that God is willing to provide to any that would have them.

 

[stranger]

Jesus being a high priest on the order of Melchizedek, then Melchizedek was/is a high priest on the order of Jesus, verified by Abraham giving him a tenth as tithe.

there is no 'order of Jesus' in scripture, all priests worthy by perfection of love to sacrifice their selves are the image of Christ, made that through forgiveness of the Hous of Israel under the new covenant with Israel [Heb 8:3-13] ... thus the FEW CAN become sinless in this life by baptism of the spirit into all truth of God and perfect their love NOW..

The DIFFERENCE for the MANY saved [Rev 7:9-10] is that they MUST travel by the broad way through destruction of the body and the seconhd resurrection :-

Matthew 7:13 ...broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

the point missed by almost all men is that ONLY the FEW CAN enter by the narrow way of perfection to the image of the son in THIS life, everyone else CAN only be perfetced AFTER the second resurrection.. in the righteous new earth...

Thus we see the power process of God's plan, first redeem just one, Jesus, then through him the FEW, the 144,000 saints of THIS earth, then through ther ministry as priests and kings in the new earth the MANY who go by the broad way are saved as in Rev 7:9-10...

the number GROWS irreversibly as more and more men are made perfect but it means that the priests MUST be FIRST and that is why Israel are selected to be first, why jesus ONLY came first for the few lost sheep of the house of Israel :-

Matthew 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Thus the many MISUNDERSTASND completely why God chose Israel, they are chosen to SERVE the many as priests of the perfect immortal order of Melchizedek ... and Jesus is their high priest and king [hence king of the kings!]

BUT priests are NOT kings i n THIS earth, but in the nEW earth of the kingdom of heaven, when Jesus RULES with rod of iron, not NOW!

So very easy to read in scripture, but not if one has first listened to modern christian myth ...

Many are called but few are chosen because of the resistance to taking off the rags of self and putting on the wedding clothes that God is willing to provide to any that would have them.

It is FAR more than that, God actually FOREORDAINED who would be the FIRST fruitys of the spirit, God has said that it will be Israel, and Israel are thus UNCONDITIONALLY forgiven in their NEW covenant with God :-

Heb 8:12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

- read the WHOLE NEW covenat with Israel, Heb 8:3-13 and NOTE with whom it is for NOW ... note that Israel and ONLY Israel IS forgiven despite what almost all christians say ... Israel was indeed rejected by God for a while, scripture says that TOO, but it also contains the prophecy that they will be forgiven BEFORE Jesus returns ... thus the Jews and the paganised gentiles of the lost part of the House of Israel WILL be the firts fruits of the spirit, God has said so and predestinated them to this role :-

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Ephesians 1:11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: