the Antichrist

[Douggg]

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

John 4:25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.

John 12:13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

John 19:19 And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.

John 19:21 Then said the chief priests of the Jews to Pilate, Write not, The King of the Jews; but that he said, I am King of the Jews.


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So there you have it. Jesus was born into this world to be a king, words of Jesus Himself, John 18:37. Pilate writing the title on the cross about Jesus - King of the Jews, John 19:19. The Jews rejecting Jesus as their king, John 19:21.


The Antichrist will be the another, John 5:43, who will be anointed the King of Israel, the king of the Jews, as the Jews will think he is their long awaited messiah.

 

[RandyPNW]

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

John 4:25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.

John 12:13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

John 19:19 And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.

John 19:21 Then said the chief priests of the Jews to Pilate, Write not, The King of the Jews; but that he said, I am King of the Jews.


----------------------------


So there you have it. Jesus was born into this world to be a king, words of Jesus Himself, John 18:37. Pilate writing the title on the cross about Jesus - King of the Jews, John 19:19. The Jews rejecting Jesus as their king, John 19:21.


The Antichrist will be the another, John 5:43, who will be anointed the King of Israel, the king of the Jews, as the Jews will think he is their long awaited messiah.

I personally am undecided about this. On the one hand we have Jesus saying this, that his people will accept other kings besides himself. That doesn't have to mean Antichrist. It could mean Herod, or any number of pretend Messiahs that were appearing around that time.

On the other hand, the Antichrist types in the Bible, like Antiochus 4, were not particularly friendly to the Jews. He rewarded those who compromised their faith and persecuted those who wished to be true to their faith. I doubt Jews would accept a King of the Jews who encouraged them to abandon their Jewish faith.

But I absolutely do not expect the Jewish People to get better as we approach the end of the age. I expect the Jews to continue as they have since the 1st coming of Christ, rejecting him as a people. We are told that Israel will only recover their true faith, as a nation, when Jesus comes back.

So the Jews may continue to accept false political leadership, although I certainly do not think that it is right now. I like Netanyahu, who appears to be kindly toward Christians and very protecting of his people.

I don't know what will happen next, except that I think we're seeing Zech 12 play out, with Israel's neighbors attacking them with malice, and Israel successfully fighting them off. But we know it's going to get worse before it gets better.

We're told the whole world will gather against Jerusalem. And we're already seeing that in the UN and even in the US. This thing really seems to be setting up for either Gog and Magog or Armageddon, or both?

 

[pasifika]

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

John 4:25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.

John 12:13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

John 19:19 And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.

John 19:21 Then said the chief priests of the Jews to Pilate, Write not, The King of the Jews; but that he said, I am King of the Jews.


----------------------------


So there you have it. Jesus was born into this world to be a king, words of Jesus Himself, John 18:37. Pilate writing the title on the cross about Jesus - King of the Jews, John 19:19. The Jews rejecting Jesus as their king, John 19:21.


The Antichrist will be the another, John 5:43, who will be anointed the King of Israel, the king of the Jews, as the Jews will think he is their long awaited messiah.

Hi @Douggg, how did you come to the conclusion that the antichrist is a Jew from those verses you quoted?

 

[Douggg]

I personally am undecided about this. On the one hand we have Jesus saying this, that his people will accept other kings besides himself. That doesn't have to mean Antichrist. It could mean Herod, or any number of pretend Messiahs that were appearing around that time.

Randy, none of the false christs, following Jesus's first coming, have ever been anointed the King of Israel. The Jews, from their standpoint, are still looking for the arrival of their King of Israel messiah. They will mistake the prince who shall come following the Gog/Magog event as being their long awaited messiah.

That person will be anointed the King of Israel thought-to-be messiah, by the Jews - making him the Antichrist.

 

[Douggg]

Hi @Douggg, how did you come to the conclusion that the antichrist is a Jew from those verses you quoted?

Because for the Jews to embrace the person, thinking he is their messiah, his must be a Jew - someone perceived to be descended from King David.

That the person must be a Jew to be the King of Israel - goes back to the time of the Exodus...

Deuteronomy 17:
14 When thou art come unto the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, and shalt possess it, and shalt dwell therein, and shalt say, I will set a king over me, like as all the nations that are about me;

15 Thou shalt in any wise set him king over thee, whom the LORD thy God shall choose: one from among thy brethren shalt thou set king over thee: thou mayest not set a stranger over thee, which is not thy brother.


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In Ezekiel 37, the messiah is referred to as David my servant. It is also what the Jews believe.

Ezekiel 37 is a prophesy about the reunification of the northern and southern kingdoms back into one nation. That happened back on Mary 14, 1948. Once one nation again, then David my servant, a referral to the messiah, will be their king.

Ezekiel 37:
24 And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them.

25 And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever.

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There are other passages about the person that indicate that he must be a Jew. When the person is killed for claiming to be God, and finds his soul in hell in Isaiah 14 from a brief period of time, God having disdain for the person does not let him remain there....

Isaiah 14:
19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.

20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.

The person will betray his own people the Jews... who will have trusted him as being the messiah, when he stops the daily sacrifice, goes into the temple, sits, claims to have achieved God-hood.

 

[d taylor]

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The antichrist or false prophet (his other title) purpose is to bring worship to the beast from the sea who is also known as the man of sin

 

[Douggg]

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The antichrist or false prophet (his other title) purpose is to bring worship to the beast from the sea who is also known as the man of sin

little horn > becomes the prince who shall come > becomes the Antichrist > becomes the revealed man of sin > becomes the beast-king. Who will be cast alive into the lake of fire at Jesus's Second Coming.

The false prophet (who is not the Antichrist) will initially be perceived to be Elijah the prophet by the Jews. He is the one who will anoint the prince who shall come as the King of Israel.

The Antichrist, about three years into the 7 years, reveals himself as the man of sin, and not the messiah after all. He will be killed for the act of stopping the daily sacrifice, then sitting in the temple, claiming to be God.

Being killed, he is the mortally wounded head on the beast coming out of the sea. Brought back to life he becomes the beast-king, the eighth king of Revelation 17:11. Having first come on the scene as the little horn, the seventh king.

The false prophet is not a king but a religious figure, associated with worship.

The Antichrist, who later becomes the beast-king, is a king.

 

[d taylor]

little horn > becomes the prince who shall come > becomes the Antichrist > becomes the revealed man of sin > becomes the beast-king. Who will be cast alive into the lake of fire at Jesus's Second Coming.

The false prophet (who is not the Antichrist) will initially be perceived to be Elijah the prophet by the Jews. He is the one who will anoint the prince who shall come as the King of Israel.

The Antichrist, about three years into the 7 years, reveals himself as the man of sin, and not the messiah after all. He will be killed for the act of stopping the daily sacrifice, then sitting in the temple, claiming to be God.

Being killed, he is the mortally wounded head on the beast coming out of the sea. Brought back to life he becomes the beast-king, the eighth king of Revelation 17:11. Having first come on the scene as the little horn, the seventh king.

The false prophet is not a king but a religious figure, associated with worship.

The Antichrist, who later becomes the beast-king, is a king.

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No i completely disagree. But i do not have time (going to work) to write out a longer reply.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

John 4:25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.

John 12:13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

John 19:19 And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.

John 19:21 Then said the chief priests of the Jews to Pilate, Write not, The King of the Jews; but that he said, I am King of the Jews.


----------------------------


So there you have it. Jesus was born into this world to be a king, words of Jesus Himself, John 18:37. Pilate writing the title on the cross about Jesus - King of the Jews, John 19:19. The Jews rejecting Jesus as their king, John 19:21.


The Antichrist will be the another, John 5:43, who will be anointed the King of Israel, the king of the Jews, as the Jews will think he is their long awaited messiah.

With all due respect.....Jesus Christ of Nazareth is not speaking about some futuristic anti- Christ who is annointed as king to geopolitical Isreal. If you read the entire verse He is speaking about the Pharisees / Jews accepting each other over Him. Let us reason.
Blessings

John 5
“I do not receive honor from men. 42 But I know you, that you do not have the love of God in you. 43 I have come in My Father’s name, and you do not receive Me; if another comes in his own name, him you will receive. 44 How can you believe, who receive honor from one another, and do not seek the honor that comes from the only God? 45 Do not think that I shall accuse you to the Father; there is one who accuses you—Moses, in whom you trust. 46 For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me; for he wrote about Me. 47 But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?”

 

[eleos1954]

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

John 4:25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.

John 12:13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

John 19:19 And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.

John 19:21 Then said the chief priests of the Jews to Pilate, Write not, The King of the Jews; but that he said, I am King of the Jews.


----------------------------


So there you have it. Jesus was born into this world to be a king, words of Jesus Himself, John 18:37. Pilate writing the title on the cross about Jesus - King of the Jews, John 19:19. The Jews rejecting Jesus as their king, John 19:21.


The Antichrist will be the another, John 5:43, who will be anointed the King of Israel, the king of the Jews, as the Jews will think he is their long awaited messiah.

The Antichrist will be the another, John 5:43, who will be anointed the King of Israel, the king of the Jews, as the Jews will think he is their long awaited messiah.

No .... all the criteria the antichrist must meet (book of Daniel)


The little horn would come “up among them”—that is, from among the 10 horns that were the kingdoms of Western Europe (Daniel 7:8). So it would be a little kingdom somewhere in Western Europe.

It would have a man at its head who could speak for it (Daniel 7:8).

It would pluck out or uproot three kingdoms (Daniel 7:8).

It would be different from the other 10 kingdoms (Daniel 7:24).

It would make war with and persecute the saints (Daniel 7:21, 25).

It would emerge from the pagan Roman Empire—the fourth kingdom (Daniel 7:7, 8).

God’s people (the saints) would “be given into his hand” for “a time and times and half a time” (Daniel 7:25).

It would “speak great words against” or blaspheme God (Daniel 7:25 KJV). In Revelation 13:5, the Bible says the same power speaks “great things and blasphemies.”

Israel don't fit the criteria (description of the anti-christ)

 

[Douggg]

No .... all the criteria the antichrist must meet (book of Daniel)


The little horn would come “up among them”—that is, from among the 10 horns that were the kingdoms of Western Europe (Daniel 7:8). So it would be a little kingdom somewhere in Western Europe.

eleos, there is a path that the person goes through on the way to his destruction. Beginning with being the little horn. And ending as the beast-king. In between, he is in the role of being the Antichrist, King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah by the Jews. That phase lasts around three years, most of the first half of the 7 years.... before that phase ends.

little horn > becomes the prince who shall come > becomes the Antichrist > becomes the revealed man of sin > becomes the beast-king. Who will be cast alive into the lake of fire at Jesus's Second Coming.


The little horn, leader over ten EU kings. The 7th king of Revelation 17:10

The beast king, dictator of the EU. The 8th king of Revelation17:11

 

[Douggg]

With all due respect.....Jesus Christ of Nazareth is not speaking about some futuristic anti- Christ who is annointed as king to geopolitical Isreal. If you read the entire verse He is speaking about the Pharisees / Jews accepting each other over Him. Let us reason.
Blessings

John 5
“I do not receive honor from men. 42 But I know you, that you do not have the love of God in you. 43 I have come in My Father’s name, and you do not receive Me; if another comes in his own name, him you will receive. 44 How can you believe, who receive honor from one another, and do not seek the honor that comes from the only God? 45 Do not think that I shall accuse you to the Father; there is one who accuses you—Moses, in whom you trust. 46 For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me; for he wrote about Me. 47 But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?”

Maria,

The Pharisees/Jews were not accepting each other as the King of Israel. They were honoring each other, but not a being the King of Israel. Jesus was saying that He came in the name of the Lord to be their king. But that the Pharisees/Jews were not recognizing Jesus as such.

The Jew have not accepted another as the King of Israel who was ever anointed the King of Israel. There have been false christs, such as Simon bar Kochba. But none of those were ever anointed the King of Israel.

 

[Douggg]

Here is the monumental eschatology understanding problem:

Conditioned by generations, upon generations, of talk about the Antichrist....

As soon as anyone says "the Antichrist", it brings up thoughts in most people's minds of thinking of the person in a universal sense.

But not understanding that the person is in that phase of being the Antichrist only for the time of being the King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah by the Jews.

So that there ends up being all sorts of theories, such as the pope/papacy being the Antichrist, or the Mahdi being the Antichrist, etc.

 

[3 Resurrections]

The Jew have not accepted another as the King of Israel who was ever anointed the King of Israel. There have been false christs, such as Simon bar Kochba. But none of those were ever anointed the King of Israel.

Agreed that Simon bar Kochba was one of the "false christs", but he was certainly not the first in Christ's own generation to pose as such.

You are making the point that to qualify as the "Antichrist", this individual must be anointed as King of Israel. This was NOT the requirement scripture mentioned for the Antichrist / Man of Lawlessness individual. The only thing he would be able to accomplish would be to "EXALT HIMSELF". (2 Thess. 2:4). This level of self-aggrandizement does not even indicate that this individual would be able to convince others to worship him as the King of Israel. The only thing he would succeed in doing would be pushing himself into the forefront, presenting himself as the king of Israel for a time.

This already happened in AD 66 with the Zealot leader Menahem, who stole King Herod's royal garments from Masada, and came with his armed followers to Jerusalem. As Josephus wrote, he came "in the state of a king", and dressed in Herod's royal regalia, went up to worship in the temple "in a pompous manner". In this he was trying to imitate King Solomon on the day of the temple's dedication. Menahem had murdered the former high priest Ananias, who had been trying to maintain control over the more radical Zealot elements in Jerusalem at the time. Once Menahem's "restrainer" Ananias was murdered and "taken out of the way", Menahem "exalted himself" in Jerusalem by becoming an "insupportable tyrant", as Josephus called him.

Menahem's self-exaltation as the titular "King of Israel" did not last for long, since Ananias' son Eleazar murdered Menahem soon after in retaliation for killing his father.

Douggg, you are trying to exaggerate the eschatological significance of this Antichrist character. He never was predicted in scripture to morph into a beast empire who would gain world power, and he was never called the "little horn". And this Antichrist / false christ has absolutely nothing to do with the EU today. The Antichrist is ancient history by now, having been murdered in AD 66. No amount of charts will prove your point if they do not align with all of scripture's content.

Maria is right to make an Antichrist connection with the Pharisee's generation. This was going to be something the Pharisees personally dealt with in their first-century generation, which is why Christ accused them of being willing to accept false christs who would come in their own name, and not God the Father's name, as Jesus had done.

 

[eleos1954]

eleos, there is a path that the person goes through on the way to his destruction. Beginning will being the little horn. And ending as the beast-king. In between, he is in the role of being the Antichrist, King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah by the Jesus. That phase lasts around three years, most of the first half of the 7 years.... before that phase ends.

little horn > becomes the prince who shall come > becomes the Antichrist > becomes the revealed man of sin > becomes the beast-king. Who will be cast alive into the lake of fire at Jesus's Second Coming.

The little horn, leader over ten EU kings. The 7th king of Revelation 17:10

The beast king, dictator of the EU. The 8th king of Revelation17:11

Nope , Israel don't fit the criteria ... you really think the nation of Israel is going to fall for person that speaks Blasphemous things about God and thinks He can change Gods laws? No way.

Rome was the last world empire succeeded by the kingdom of God. Daniel prophesied that no other kingdom would dominate the world or the church. Many have tried and failed. Napoleon failed, Kaiser failed, Hitler failed, USSR failed. At the moment the USA is the strongest world power but it does not rule the world. It cannot, not because of the US or European unity or Sharia. It cannot because God’s Word through Daniel says that Rome was the last world empire and it was destroyed by the kingdom of God in his vision.

The Bible says: As you saw iron mixed with ceramic clay, they will mingle with the seed of men; but they will not adhere to one another, just as iron does not mix with clay. (Daniel 2:43)

The Bible predicts that Europe will always be divided and will never unite to form a strong, lasting, united empire. And that’s exactly the situation in modern Europe today.

Point the last kingdom described in Daniels vision is Rome ... not Israel.

 

[Douggg]

You are making the point that to qualify as the "Antichrist", this individual must be anointed as King of Israel. This was NOT the requirement scripture mentioned for the Antichrist / Man of Lawlessness individual.

When the Antichrist reveals himself to be the man of lawlessness, it will end his time in his Antichrist phase.

That the Jews are still looking for their King of Israel, messiah is proof that no-one ever fulfilled that role in their eyes. What the Jews think and believe is essential to understanding the end time events involving the Antichrist.

 

[Douggg]

Nope , Israel don't fit the criteria ... you really think the nation of Israel is going to fall for person that speaks Blasphemous things about God and thinks He can change Gods laws? No way.

The person will no longer be the Antichrist when he does those things.

 

[Douggg]

Point the last kingdom described in Daniels vision is Rome ... not Israel.

Agreed. The Roman Empire is manifested in the end times as the EU. Being the Antichrist is not being the king of the Roman Empire, but being the King of Israel, thought-to be-messiah by the Jews.


Being the little horn is being the leader over ten EU leaders

Being the beast- king is being the dictator of the EU.

In between, is the person's time as the Antichrist, King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah by the Jews.

 

[eleos1954]

The person will no longer be the Antichrist when he does those things.

Yes the antichrist will, he's described as a man

Revelation 13:18 ESV​

This calls for wisdom: let the one who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man, and his number is 666.

 

[Douggg]

Yes the antichrist will, he's described as a man

Revelation 13:18 ESV​

This calls for wisdom: let the one who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man, and his number is 666.

Revelation 13:18 is to identify of the name of the beast-king.

Revelation 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.