Socialism, Atheism and Apathetic Christians

[Ayersy]

You mean like this?



(Description of a near-death experience catalogued at Near Death Experience Research Foundation (NDERF) with Evidence of the Afterlife)

Funny, when I had a near death experience, none of that happened. It just went black, then I woke up in hospital. Maybe I'm cool enough to not go to hell.

 

[Wolseley]

Hmm... Says he was calling out for Allah and Buddah as well... Shouldn't that be a lake of fire offence?

Actually, if you read the accounts on that site, even atheists have NDE's which they describe in identical terms to those experienced by Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, and Jews. The defining thing seems to be the greater religious belief in the near-death experiencer after the experience, be it heavenly or hellish.....even in the atheists.

As for the experiences being a hallucination or a dream, it's easy to airily dismiss them, but I would counsel to read through the experiences or get Dr. Long's book, and then decide.

But I'm not about to argue with anybody about it. If you're adamantly against the concept of an afterlife, bully for you. We'll all find out one day, won't we?

 

[rambot]

Socialism is a product of Atheism. In Socialism, government holds all right to property ownership. What does the Bible say? The Ten Commandments form the center of the Old and New Testament law and provide rules against theft and coveting, which demand pre-existing private property rights.

No private property under socialism? That doesn't sound right at all.

I think socialism only controls the means of production and not necessarily private ownership.

If anything, new testament evidence indicates that when the spirit is amongst people, they are inclined to live in a FAR more communist economic system.

 

[jgarden]

"Clirus" has now moved on to "greener pastures" and it is now trying "to peddle her wares" under the guise of "Self Sustaining Lifestyles" - of all things!

Same themes, same wording, same message - the only thing that hasn't remainded the same is the title!!!!!

 

[Belk]

Actually, if you read the accounts on that site, even atheists have NDE's which they describe in identical terms to those experienced by Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, and Jews. The defining thing seems to be the greater religious belief in the near-death experiencer after the experience, be it heavenly or hellish.....even in the atheists.

As for the experiences being a hallucination or a dream, it's easy to airily dismiss them, but I would counsel to read through the experiences or get Dr. Long's book, and then decide.

But I'm not about to argue with anybody about it. If you're adamantly against the concept of an afterlife, bully for you. We'll all find out one day, won't we?

Not if we are correct and there isn't one.

 

[The Lady Kate]

You mean like this?



(Description of a near-death experience catalogued at Near Death Experience Research Foundation (NDERF) with Evidence of the Afterlife)

Actually, I think they meant something better written. I mean really... that was total garbage.

 

[clirus]

"Clirus" has now moved on to "greener pastures" and it is now trying "to peddle her wares" under the guise of "Self Sustaining Lifestyles" - of all things!

Same themes, same wording, same message - the only thing that hasn't remainded the same is the title!!!!!

You got to know when to hold them and when to fold them.

I believe "Self Sustaining Lifestyles" discusses a different concept, but all my discussions will lead back to the Bible, which does not change.

Since the Bible does not change, only the way it is applicable can be discussed.

 

[Chamdar]

So, clirus, if "atheism=socialism", then how does that explain atheists who are pro-capitalist and reject socialism themselves (and don't deny they don't exist, either). One cannot be pro-capitalist and be a socialist at the same time. You're not making any sense, but then you never do.

On the other hand, I find some non-leftist atheists even more offensive than the leftist atheists (i.e. the cult of Ayn Rand).

 

[clirus]

So, clirus, if "atheism=socialism", then how does that explain atheists who are pro-capitalist and reject socialism themselves (and don't deny they don't exist, either). One cannot be pro-capitalist and be a socialist at the same time. You're not making any sense, but then you never do.

On the other hand, I find some non-leftist atheists even more offensive than the leftist atheists (i.e. the cult of Ayn Rand).

For political purposes I break people into four groups.

1) Conservative Christians

A Conservative Christian is a person that believe in the inerrorancy of the Bible.

A Conservative Christian believes the Biblical doctrines; God created the universe, and God created humans,

2) Liberal Christians

A Liberal Christian has accepted Jesus Christ as Lord/Savior, but believes the Bible can be interpreted in many ways and maybe the Bible is just not applicable to present day situations.

Liberal Christians usually favor Socialism instead of Capitalism and usually will oppose the death penalty and war.

3) Conservative Atheist

A Conservative Atheist sees no need to accept Jesus Christ as Lord/Savior, but believes in conservative economic policies and Capitalism.

These are frequently the very wealthy people.

4) Liberal Atheists

A Liberal Atheist is a person that believes humans can achieve perfection. Socialism is a required party of that perfection.

A Liberal Atheist believe in science and medicine doctrines: the universe was created by the big bang, humans evolved from nothing.

Summary

I find it is the concept of liberal = socialism as in Liberal Christians and Liberal Atheists which vote for democrats.

I find it is the concept of conservative = capitalism as in Conservative Christians and Conservative Atheists which vote for Republicans.

The above is why you see Liberal Christians (like Catholics) voting for democrats and most business people (Conservative Atheists) voting for Republicans.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

For political purposes I break people into four groups.

1) Conservative Christians

A Conservative Christian is a person that believe in the inerrorancy of the Bible.

A Conservative Christian believes the Biblical doctrines; God created the universe, and God created humans,

2) Liberal Christians

A Liberal Christian has accepted Jesus Christ as Lord/Savior, but believes the Bible can be interpreted in many ways and maybe the Bible is just not applicable to present day situations.

Liberal Christians usually favor Socialism instead of Capitalism and usually will oppose the death penalty and war.

3) Conservative Atheist

A Conservative Atheist sees no need to accept Jesus Christ as Lord/Savior, but believes in conservative economic policies and Capitalism.

These are frequently the very wealthy people.

4) Liberal Atheists

A Liberal Atheist is a person that believes humans can achieve perfection. Socialism is a required party of that perfection.

A Liberal Atheist believe in science and medicine doctrines: the universe was created by the big bang, humans evolved from nothing.

Summary

I find it is the concept of liberal = socialism as in Liberal Christians and Liberal Atheists which vote for democrats.

I find it is the concept of conservative = capitalism as in Conservative Christians and Conservative Atheists which vote for Republicans.

The above is why you see Liberal Christians (like Catholics) voting for democrats and most business people (Conservative Atheists) voting for Republicans.

That's a very narrow conceptual framework to work with.
First, you are equating Liberalism with Socialism. That doesn't hold. A person can be a liberal and not be a Socialist, and a Conservative need not always support Capitalism in every sector of activity. You may me consider me, from your perspective at least, a liberal. But I'm most certainly not a Socialist by any meaningful use of the term.
Second, you are only considering Conservative and Liberal Christians and Atheists. What about Agnostics (like myself), skeptics, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, Pagans, Deists, theosophists. Etc, etc.? There exists a broader range of views than simply Christian Vs. Atheist. Your ideology doesn't capture the breadth and depth of public opinion in a meaningful sense if it confines itself to a strict dichotomy.
Third, are people only ever strictly 'liberal' or 'conservative'? Isn't there some middle-ground? For example, I can think of many people, including myself, who might hold a very liberal opinion on one issue, but a very conservative opinion on a different issue.