Seven Days of Creation

[FlyingTurtle]

OK here's some brainstorming...

The bible says God created everything in seven days. And normally we consider that to be 24 hour earth days. But then you asked when God made the sun, the basis of a earth day, and it was made on the fourth day. The creation account rounds up each day of creation with the words "there was evening, and there was morning - the Nth day". But how can there be evening and morning on the first three days if the sun didn't exist yet? How?

Here's a solution I thought of. On the first day God said "let there be light". And God saw that the light of the first day was good and He called the light of the first day, "day". So here we have, at the very beginning, God basically saying that the light of the first day is the basis for day, not the sun which was made 3 days after. So we have seven days of creation, but they are not earth days but days based in the light of the first day, which God Himself called "day".

For all we know, one such day could last years. Thousands of years. Maybe even millions or billions of years. Or maybe just a few seconds. But if the light of the first day was used as the basis of the days of creation, we have no idea how long that is.

So the universe could well be 13.7 billion years old as science says. It could be 67 trillion years old for all we know.

Just a thought. What do you think?

 

[interpreter]

OK here's some brainstorming...

The bible says God created everything in seven days. And normally we consider that to be 24 hour earth days. But then you asked when God made the sun, the basis of a earth day, and it was made on the fourth day. The creation account rounds up each day of creation with the words "there was evening, and there was morning - the Nth day". But how can there be evening and morning on the first three days if the sun didn't exist yet? How?

Here's a solution I thought of. On the first day God said "let there be light". And God saw that the light of the first day was good and He called the light of the first day, "day". So here we have, at the very beginning, God basically saying that the light of the first day is the basis for day, not the sun which was made 3 days after. So we have seven days of creation, but they are not earth days but days based in the light of the first day, which God Himself called "day".

For all we know, one such day could last years. Thousands of years. Maybe even millions or billions of years. Or maybe just a few seconds. But if the light of the first day was used as the basis of the days of creation, we have no idea how long that is.

So the universe could well be 13.7 billion years old as science says. It could be 67 trillion years old for all we know.

Just a thought. What do you think?

The creation story is actually a prophecy, covering 7000 years beginning in 4000 BC when Adam appeared in Garden of Eden which is now Iraq. That happens to be exactly when and where the first writing appeared and the first civilization appeared. You could say it marks the birth of modern man.

Every thousand years something important happens. For example, at the beginning of the 4th day the Jews conquered Jerusalem and founded the first Kingdom of God which lasted exactly a thousand years.

And Jesus was born at the beginning of the 5th day.

We are now living in the 7th day, which began in 2001 which is when the Battle of That Great Day of God Almighty began (also called the Battle of Ar Mageddon). It began on 9/11 when the Euphrates was dry, and will ultimately result in the latest face of the 7th head of Satan being so soundly defeated that He wont be heard from again for a thousand years, which allows the Church to enjoy a glorious 1000-year reign of the earth.

At the end of the 7 thousand years, the devil is let loose again and the end of the earth comes.

That is called the dispensational view.

 

[jsimms615]

MOD HAT ON​

This thread has been moved from controversial theology (christians only) to Origins Theology by consensus of moderator

MOD HAT OFF​

 

[DrBubbaLove]

Well possessing that knowledge must help some or at least they think so, though am not quite sure how. When we are not guaranteed the next moment, am unclear why we feel the need to make everything in scripture fit some kind of giant cosmetic Rubik or hidden national treasure or Di Vinci code beginning to end. I suppose it all makes for good movies or readings for a fun (hopefully temporary distraction), but I think Jesus clearly wanted our hearts and minds living in the right now.

 

[FlyingTurtle]

Well possessing that knowledge must help some or at least they think so, though am not quite sure how. When we are not guaranteed the next moment, am unclear why we feel the need to make everything in scripture fit some kind of giant cosmetic Rubik or hidden national treasure or Di Vinci code beginning to end. I suppose it all makes for good movies or readings for a fun (hopefully temporary distraction), but I think Jesus clearly wanted our hearts and minds living in the right now.

True. And in the end the creation of the universe takes backseat to how God wants us to live. However, this is still an interesting topic and, even if I wasn't trying to fit some rubric or schema, I am only using the logic within the creation account itself and not bringing in anything external.

And in many ways this line of thinking makes more sense if we just consider the creation account by itself. Because, as I said, God Himself calls the first day's light "day" and then the account says "this was the first day" whereas the sun and moon are nowhere to be found. So in many ways, this interpretation actually makes more sense, regardless of outside influences, simply by using the creation account's own logic.

 

[DrBubbaLove]

DR B added quoteto clarifying who this is directed at.

There are others that make equal sense, so it is not like we have no acceptable answers besides this particular "solution".

I do NOT agree there is a problem needing solving here unless we limit ourselves to a singular and very literal view of the story which is what creates the problem attempting to be solved here. Outside that view there is no such "problem". Not sure what outside influences is being referenced either.

 

[ob77]

OK here's some brainstorming...

The bible says God created everything in seven days. And normally we consider that to be 24 hour earth days. But then you asked when God made the sun, the basis of a earth day, and it was made on the fourth day. The creation account rounds up each day of creation with the words "there was evening, and there was morning - the Nth day". But how can there be evening and morning on the first three days if the sun didn't exist yet? How?

Here's a solution I thought of. On the first day God said "let there be light". And God saw that the light of the first day was good and He called the light of the first day, "day". So here we have, at the very beginning, God basically saying that the light of the first day is the basis for day, not the sun which was made 3 days after. So we have seven days of creation, but they are not earth days but days based in the light of the first day, which God Himself called "day".

For all we know, one such day could last years. Thousands of years. Maybe even millions or billions of years. Or maybe just a few seconds. But if the light of the first day was used as the basis of the days of creation, we have no idea how long that is.

So the universe could well be 13.7 billion years old as science says. It could be 67 trillion years old for all we know.

Just a thought. What do you think?

I believe that the earth is 4.5 billion years old and the Universe much older. Our Father has not been in a hurry to accomplish anything thus far, otherwise this present earth age would have been reduced to fifteen minutes. There are the three earth ages that were spoken of by Peter. The world that was , was pre tohu-vah-bohu- Hebrew for the earth becoming void and without form - not created as such, but that particular earth age ending as such. This previous earth age is where the dinosaurs and all the fossil forms as well as the fossil fuels and sedimentary layers belong, anyone traveling through Utah as well as many other places such as the Grand Canyon can plainly see evidence of this. It was not done in a day, for God Himself, having created Physical laws which are applied equally throughout the Universe does not undo His own doing. Things take their natural course. Mountain ranges have not always been here, we tend to gauge events according to our own life experiences, short as they may be. Now, morning and evening. One can take this literally as a 24hr period if one wishes to. What about morning being the start of a particular era or eon and evening being the end of that particular eon or era or span of immense time passing, after all, God owns the very idea of time . There are so many variables when dealing with spotty information as we only have 66 books in our bible out of the original 163.
To assume that all these things in early Genesis occurred in mere days is beyond plain common sense. Yes, there are miracles, but we have no way to gauge these miracles in God's timeframe. The very fact that things exist as they are is a miracle in itself. Genesis is a greek word for Generations and it starts out with "In the beginning", but it does not say when the beginning was and if it did, could we comprehend the enormous spans of time that that entails?

 

[gluadys]

OK here's some brainstorming...

The bible says God created everything in seven days. And normally we consider that to be 24 hour earth days. But then you asked when God made the sun, the basis of a earth day, and it was made on the fourth day.

Actually, the earth is the basis of the earth day, just as Mars, Venus, Jupiter, etc. are the basis of their days, all of them depending on light from the same sun. The day of each planet is set by the time it takes to rotate on its axis and each has a different rotation time. Venus has the longest day--in fact its day is longer than its year and is equivalent to 243 earth days. Jupiter has the shortest day, equal to less than 10 hours of an earth day.

So there would be no problem having morning and evening on earth prior to the fourth day, so long as there was an equivalent light source and the earth is spinning on its axis.

The pertinent remaining questions would be:
1. what was the light source prior to the fourth day and what happened to it?
2. was the earth moving on an axis? Biblical writers assumed the earth was fixed in place and not moving at all.

 

[random person]

OK here's some brainstorming...

The bible says God created everything in seven days. And normally we consider that to be 24 hour earth days. But then you asked when God made the sun, the basis of a earth day, and it was made on the fourth day. The creation account rounds up each day of creation with the words "there was evening, and there was morning - the Nth day". But how can there be evening and morning on the first three days if the sun didn't exist yet? How?

Here's a solution I thought of. On the first day God said "let there be light". And God saw that the light of the first day was good and He called the light of the first day, "day". So here we have, at the very beginning, God basically saying that the light of the first day is the basis for day, not the sun which was made 3 days after. So we have seven days of creation, but they are not earth days but days based in the light of the first day, which God Himself called "day".

For all we know, one such day could last years. Thousands of years. Maybe even millions or billions of years. Or maybe just a few seconds. But if the light of the first day was used as the basis of the days of creation, we have no idea how long that is.

So the universe could well be 13.7 billion years old as science says. It could be 67 trillion years old for all we know.

Just a thought. What do you think?

I have ordered and received a book titled The Lost World Of Adam And Eve by John H Walton. I have read just a few chapters in this book but it is quite eyeopening. I am going to also buy his other book The Lost World Of Genesis 1, but in this book he retouches upon some of the material from his previous book. Here are some of his conclusions:

Genesis 1:1 is outside the seven days. As Genesis 1:2 opens, we find that material is already present (earth, seas) and that this inchoate world is covered with water and darkness. Again, we know that ancient Near Eastern cosmologies share this characteristic. Darkness and sea are conditions of non-order. But if material is already present, we are immediately prompted by the text to ask why it does not begin with no material if it is going to recount material origins. This should make us curious.

The most important descriptor that is offered in Genesis 1:2 is the Hebrew combination tohu wabohu, translated in the NIV "formless and empty." The implications are the materiality is generally present but without shape, and that the stage is empty of players. The Hebrew combination of tohu wabohu only occurs two more times in the Old Testament
(Isaiah 34:11 & Jeremiah 4:23).

Then he goes on to say conclude that the 7 days of creation aren't material but the order and functionality of the world.

Day 1 represents time
Day 2 represents weather
Day 3 represents food

And points out that after the Flood, God reestablishes this order and functionality in Genesis 8:22:

As long as the earth endures,
seedtime and harvest (food),
cold and heat,
summer and winter (weather),
day and night (time),
will never cease.

Day 4 Luminary and seasonal functionalities
Day 5 Fecundity of sea life
Day 6 Fecundity of animal life and humanity, man's stewardship and role as vice-regents of God

I will post up more later.

 

[random person]

I am only on chapter 5 of Wilton's book.

But from the video I posted up on this forum awhile back, he suggests in a roundabout way that Adam and Eve were true historical persons and may have been proto-Hebrews just as Hebrews were proto-Jews.

If it weren't so, who did Cain fear retribution from... Adam and Eve?

Where did Cain get his wife?

How did Cain build a city, and why did he build a city?

And that the Garden of Eden, was a sacred place, a "cosmic" temple, a place where God and man fellowshipped, where God and man met, a place where Adam and Eve served as priests of God.

 

[Imagican]

The easiest manner in which to understand the TRUTH of God's creation is that God is NOT confined to a 24 hour rotational period of a PLANET THAT HE CREATED.
The NT explains to us that a DAY to God can be as a thousand years. This is NOT meant to be taken LITERAL. It is a FIGURATIVE statement meant to signify that God is OUTSIDE of TIME so far as the measurement used by His MORTAL creation. It could just as easily have been stated, "A BILLION years to God is as a SINGLE day to US". Neither is DEFINITIVE except in the FACT that God is TIMELESS: no beginning, no end.
It is clear to any that actually understand what is offered in the story of creation that the reference to DAYS is NOT LITERAL. The term 'day' is used as a reference to a PERIOD or ERA or specific EVENT. Just like us using the expression: "Back in the DAY". It is NOT a reference to ONE SINGULAR SPECIFIC DAY. It is in reference to a TIME PERIOD. An ERA. A specific PLACE in TIME of particular EVENTS.
Blessings,
MEC

 

[juvenissun]

OK here's some brainstorming...

The bible says God created everything in seven days. And normally we consider that to be 24 hour earth days. But then you asked when God made the sun, the basis of a earth day, and it was made on the fourth day. The creation account rounds up each day of creation with the words "there was evening, and there was morning - the Nth day". But how can there be evening and morning on the first three days if the sun didn't exist yet? How?

Here's a solution I thought of. On the first day God said "let there be light". And God saw that the light of the first day was good and He called the light of the first day, "day". So here we have, at the very beginning, God basically saying that the light of the first day is the basis for day, not the sun which was made 3 days after. So we have seven days of creation, but they are not earth days but days based in the light of the first day, which God Himself called "day".

For all we know, one such day could last years. Thousands of years. Maybe even millions or billions of years. Or maybe just a few seconds. But if the light of the first day was used as the basis of the days of creation, we have no idea how long that is.

So the universe could well be 13.7 billion years old as science says. It could be 67 trillion years old for all we know.

Just a thought. What do you think?

Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

This verse is extremely profound. The "Day" and "Night" are definitions and are static. But the "evening" "morning" suggest a dynamic system. So that the first "day" is the product of a process which includes the Day and the Night.

The concept is beyond human. It is simply fantastic.

 

[random person]

Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

This verse is extremely profound. The "Day" and "Night" are definitions and are static. But the "evening" "morning" suggest a dynamic system. So that the first "day" is the product of a process which includes the Day and the Night.

The concept is beyond human. It is simply fantastic.

It is the concept of order and functionality, it is the creation of time itself.

 

[juvenissun]

It is the concept of order and functionality, it is the creation of time itself.

Time is created in Gen 1:1a.
In a gigantic structure of theology, this beginning is beyond human. It is way more than fantastic.

 

[random person]

Time is created in Gen 1:1a.
In a gigantic structure of theology, this beginning is beyond human. It is way more than fantastic.

I am speaking of the functionality and order of time which began at the creation of mankind.

Besides God and his angels, no creature under heaven but man recognizes the concept of time.

It is commonly stated that God and heaven exist outside the confines of time and rightly so.

 

[Aman777]

OK here's some brainstorming...

1. The bible says God created everything in seven days. And normally we consider that to be 24 hour earth days. But then you asked when God made the sun, the basis of a earth day, and it was made on the fourth day. The creation account rounds up each day of creation with the words "there was evening, and there was morning - the Nth day". But how can there be evening and morning on the first three days if the sun didn't exist yet? How?

2. Here's a solution I thought of. On the first day God said "let there be light". And God saw that the light of the first day was good and He called the light of the first day, "day". So here we have, at the very beginning, God basically saying that the light of the first day is the basis for day, not the sun which was made 3 days after. So we have seven days of creation, but they are not earth days but days based in the light of the first day, which God Himself called "day".

3. For all we know, one such day could last years. Thousands of years. Maybe even millions or billions of years. Or maybe just a few seconds. But if the light of the first day was used as the basis of the days of creation, we have no idea how long that is.

So the universe could well be 13.7 billion years old as science says. It could be 67 trillion years old for all we know.

Just a thought. What do you think?

Amen. Here are the details:

1. God has but 7 Days (Hebrew-yowm-period of labor) God has 6 Creative Days and 1 Day of rest which is Eternity. Genesis Chapter 1 tells us the entire HISTORY of the first 6 Days and Gen 2:1-3 tells us of a FUTURE Day when rests from ALL of His work of creating.

2. Jesus is the Light of the first Day. Jesus has preeminence or First Place in everything. Col 1:18 He provided the light of the first 3 Days AND He aslo provides the light of New Jerusalem in Heaven. Rev 21:23

3. The present 6th Day or period of labor began when Jesus made the beasts of the field and fowl and brought them to Adam, who named them. Gen 2:19 Today will NOT end until AFTER Jesus returns to this Planet and changes ALL creatures into vegetarians. Gen 1:30 Then, He will rule and reign here for a thousand years Rev 20:6 BEFORE our Cosmos is burned. ll Peter 3:10

Then, God's labor will be finished or brought to perfection and Heaven will be filled with ALL of it's host (including Christians). Gen 2:1 God will then rest from ALL of His labor of creating because the 3rd Heaven is made perfect and filled with ALL of it's host who will live FOREVER since the 7th Day is Eternity since it has NO evening and NO end. Gen 2:2-3 Amen?

 

[AnticipateHisComing]

Actually, the earth is the basis of the earth day, just as Mars, Venus, Jupiter, etc. are the basis of their days, all of them depending on light from the same sun. The day of each planet is set by the time it takes to rotate on its axis and each has a different rotation time.

The pertinent remaining questions would be:
1. what was the light source prior to the fourth day and what happened to it?

Nice argument!

This is only an idea for the light source. How about the bright Morning Star and other morning stars? Search scripture to learn they represent the Son of God, Satan and all the angels. Note that many times when angels appear, they are as a bright light. Note that Job says they witnessed creation. How fitting would what appears to be a strange name for heavenly beings, "morning star" be an actual literal descriptive name of the very first light that the earth saw?

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

What does the heavens represent if the sun, moon and stars were not made until the 4th day? I guess it to be the heaven that is the dwelling place of God and the other heavenly beings/angels.

 

[AnticipateHisComing]

The bible says God created everything in seven days. And normally we consider that to be 24 hour earth days. But then you asked when God made the sun, the basis of a earth day, and it was made on the fourth day. The creation account rounds up each day of creation with the words "there was evening, and there was morning - the Nth day". But how can there be evening and morning on the first three days if the sun didn't exist yet? How?

I think that time started at "in the beginning". While God is outside of time, he can certainly work inside of time, like Jesus body being in the grave for 3 days.

So do you think that God who created everything did not know how long a 24 hour day was going to be before he created the sun? Of course he knew how long it would be. One important reason for scriptures to so explicitly call out each days worth of creation is to emphasize God's great power and what he can accomplish in one day.

 

[Aman777]

I think that time started at "in the beginning". While God is outside of time, he can certainly work inside of time, like Jesus body being in the grave for 3 days.

So do you think that God who created everything did not know how long a 24 hour day was going to be before he created the sun? Of course he knew how long it would be. One important reason for scriptures to so explicitly call out each days worth of creation is to emphasize God's great power and what he can accomplish in one day.

God knew exactly how long was each of His Days/Ages. They were as long as necessary to complete a period of work. That is WHY God used the Hebrew word for Day, yowm, which can be ANY period of time, 12 or 24 hours, a lifetime or even Eternity, since the 7th Day is Eternity. It has NO end. Amen?

 

[pshun2404]

OK here's some brainstorming...

The bible says God created everything in seven days. And normally we consider that to be 24 hour earth days. But then you asked when God made the sun, the basis of a earth day, and it was made on the fourth day. The creation account rounds up each day of creation with the words "there was evening, and there was morning - the Nth day". But how can there be evening and morning on the first three days if the sun didn't exist yet? How?

Here's a solution I thought of. On the first day God said "let there be light". And God saw that the light of the first day was good and He called the light of the first day, "day". So here we have, at the very beginning, God basically saying that the light of the first day is the basis for day, not the sun which was made 3 days after. So we have seven days of creation, but they are not earth days but days based in the light of the first day, which God Himself called "day".

For all we know, one such day could last years. Thousands of years. Maybe even millions or billions of years. Or maybe just a few seconds. But if the light of the first day was used as the basis of the days of creation, we have no idea how long that is.

So the universe could well be 13.7 billion years old as science says. It could be 67 trillion years old for all we know.

Just a thought. What do you think?

Amen