Reformation Day

[AlexDTX]

This may be in the wrong area, but I was not sure where to pose this comment.

I hate Halloween and consider it an abomination. I know there are many who think it is harmless to glorify demons and evil, but I believe it is very damaging.

Many congregations agree with my view so they offer their "safe" alternatives of Fall Festivals, Harvest Day, Trunk or Treat or what have you. It think these are lame and indirectly worship Gaia, or "Mother" Earth.

What I don't understand is why Protestants don't join the Lutherans in celebrating Reformation Day. I am not a Lutheran but Reformation Day precedes the bringing of the Feast of Samhain (called Hallowed Evening on October 31st, then All Saints Day November 1 by the Catholic Church). Halloween came to the United States by the Irish Catholics during the Great Potato Famine of Ireland during the latter 19th century. Whereas Reformation Day began on October 31st 1517 when Martin Luther nailed his 95 Thesis on the Wittenberg Chapel door.

Lutherans have celebrated this great event that brought the new birth to millions all over Europe and is the American Protestant heritage in the New World. The 500th anniversary of this great day will be next year in 2017.

Instead of the lame harvest festivals, celebrate Reformation Day by having the kids dress up as saints of history past and have games and food appropriate for such a celebration. I am not saying eliminate Halloween, I am saying celebrate something better.

 

[gord44]

It's pretty common in quite a few different denominations. Usually those that study the great reformers like Luther and Calvin. Most Reformed (because of knowledge of Calvin and the Puritans) folk like to mark Reformation day. So you will see it celebrated in many Presbyterian and Reformed Baptist churches.

 

[AlexDTX]

It's pretty common in quite a few different denominations. Usually those that study the great reformers like Luther and Calvin. Most Reformed (because of knowledge of Calvin and the Puritans) folk like to mark Reformation day. So you will see it celebrated in many Presbyterian and Reformed Baptist churches.

Thank you for your comment. That is good to know. I think it would be better for all Protestant congregations to celebrate it.

 

[Dave-W]

I hate Halloween and consider it an abomination. I know there are many who think it is harmless to glorify demons and evil, but I believe it is very damaging.

In general I agree.

What I don't understand is why Protestants don't join the Lutherans in celebrating Reformation Day.

Many or most protestants of the Arminian and Wesleyan camp are entirely unaware of it. While most have heard of Luther and his posting the statements on a door of a church somewhere in Germany, most could not name the city or the date; much less that there is a commemoration of that date.

I am not sure if you would include us Messianics as "protestants" or not, but many of us consider Luther to be a flaming anti-semite. So we would not celebrate that.

 

[AlexDTX]

In general I agree.

Many or most protestants of the Arminian and Wesleyan camp are entirely unaware of it. While most have heard of Luther and his posting the statements on a door of a church somewhere in Germany, most could not name the city or the date; much less that there is a commemoration of that date.

I am not sure if you would include us Messianics as "protestants" or not, but many of us consider Luther to be a flaming anti-semite. So we would not celebrate that.

I understand the anti-semitic side of Luther would offend Messianics, but I not exclude them from the Protestant camp. I used the term "Protestant" because Luther would not be observed by Catholics or Greek Orthodox. Truth is, none of us are "Protestants" since none of us protested the sales of indulgences. Instead, I reference the groups many of us Protestants found our salvation within.

As for Messianic, I am not sure of your meaning either. There are Jews who come to Christ and participate in various Protestant organizations, who still call themselves Messianics as a differentiation from Rabbinic Judaism. And there are those Jews who call themselves Messianics who continue in a Judaic worship of God following the Rabbinic format.

Regardless, I am grateful that you generally agree with my desire to see some better use of the October 31st activity.

 

[Dave-W]

As for Messianic, I am not sure of your meaning either. There are Jews who come to Christ and participate in various Protestant organizations, who still call themselves Messianics as a differentiation from Rabbinic Judaism. And there are those Jews who call themselves Messianics who continue in a Judaic worship of God following the Rabbinic format.

Most catholics call us protestant because we are not them. Many protestant groups agree.

But at our genesis, the Modern Messianic movement was started in the 1880s by 2 (possibly more) rabbis in eastern Europe - Isaac Licthenstien in Romania and Joseph Rabinowitz in Moscow. Both came to believe in Jesus/Yeshua from reading the New Testament scriptures on their own and independently modified their Orthodox services to the Gospel. Rabinowitz became itinerant and started Messianic Chassidic congregations in most major cities of Russia.

Yes, there have been a lot of believing Jews that came in from the Baptists, Presbyterians, Methodists and even the Catholics. Much of our doctrinal stance has been influenced by protestant sources. But since we are a relatively young movement, that is still evolving; and going more toward some parts of Rabbinic Judaism, and in other parts we have had to blaze our own trail.

 

[Dave-W]

Regardless, I am grateful that you generally agree with my desire to see some better use of the October 31st activity.

I attended a Messianic Liturgy conference about 10 years ago. One of the attending rabbis from the New York City area talked about celebrating Purim (usually in February) with costumes and games. A traditional Jewish family visited his office and asked if they celebrated Purim. Apparently all the Reform synagogues in the area celebrated Halloween and NOT Purim. That family did not want their kids to grow up thinking that dressing like witches and zombies is ok. So they joined on the spot. They were not even New Covenant believers yet.

 

[AlexDTX]

Most catholics call us protestant because we are not them. Many protestant groups agree.

But at our genesis, the Modern Messianic movement was started in the 1880s by 2 (possibly more) rabbis in eastern Europe - Isaac Licthenstien in Romania and Joseph Rabinowitz in Moscow. Both came to believe in Jesus/Yeshua from reading the New Testament scriptures on their own and independently modified their Orthodox services to the Gospel. Rabinowitz became itinerant and started Messianic Chassidic congregations in most major cities of Russia.

Yes, there have been a lot of believing Jews that came in from the Baptists, Presbyterians, Methodists and even the Catholics. Much of our doctrinal stance has been influenced by protestant sources. But since we are a relatively young movement, that is still evolving; and going more toward some parts of Rabbinic Judaism, and in other parts we have had to blaze our own trail.

Thank you for that brief history lesson. I was led to Christ by a Russian Jew who did not participate in messianic service, but was a member of the Assembly of God. Having a atheist background with very little Jewish culture he did not care for that movement. However, he did care about bringing Jews to Jesus which is why he later worked with Jews for Jesus. He invited me to work with J4J as well.

Perhaps the Messianic movement will become more like the 1st century movement of the Way, which began with the Jewish believers first. As I understand history, they still met in synagogues until kicked out by the non believing Jews. I wish the best for you. It is my personal observation that the words are true (my paraphrase)... when the natural branches are grafted back into the vine, how much more the vine increases.

 

[Dave-W]

As I understand history, they still met in synagogues until kicked out by the non believing Jews.

Correct. That all started changing with the 70 ad sacking of Jerusalem when the New Covenant believer Jews "fled for the hills" as our Lord commanded (Luke 21.20-21). It had started to be restored when Bar Kochba led his revolt. (135 ad) Most of the Jerusalem based Believing Jews joined in until Kochba was declared "messiah" by the chief rabbi and no true believer would fight for a false messiah. That permanently made a separation between church and synagogue.

But after that, Rome came down hard on the Jews all thru the empire and at that point Christianity still looked a lot like Judaism. So many things were changed to distance the church from her Jewish roots. Eventually the believing Jews got kicked out of the church as well. (read why in Eusubius) That sect called Nazoreans died out in the 400s. No acceptance by Jews or Christians.