Raise your hand and say "Aye"!

[ZiSunka]

Everyone who thinks violence is the answer to violence, raise your hand and say "aye!"

 

[TwinCrier]

Let me guess, a pscifist extremist that lives in lala land where everyone is all nice and shares flowers and hugs their teddy bears thinks everyone who supports the use of force in defense of self, family or country is a big green meanie. Lord only knows how such people will fare in armegeddon.

Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

 

[ZiSunka]

Let me guess, a pscifist extremist that lives in lala land where everyone is all nice and shares flowers and hugs their teddy bears thinks everyone who supports the use of force in defense of self, family or country is a big green meanie. Lord only knows how such people will fare in armegeddon.

Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

 

[JPPT1974]

Jesus came to send peace
And to make sure the world was peaceful
In Him!

 

[TheUltimateWarrior]

Jesus came to send peace
And to make sure the world was peaceful
In Him!

Actually Jesus Said "Dont think I have come to bring peace, but a sword".

 

[ZiSunka]

Actually Jesus Said "Dont think I have come to bring peace, but a sword".

So then, violence is the solution to violence, in the words of Jesus?

 

[TheUltimateWarrior]

So then, violence is the solution to violence, in the words of Jesus?

You really need to stop changing what I say, if you have no arguement against my words thats fine, but dont put words in my mouth when you lack a better arguement.

 

[ZiSunka]

You really need to stop changing what I say, if you have no arguement against my words thats fine, but dont put words in my mouth when you lack a better arguement.

Then what ARE you saying?

 

[TheUltimateWarrior]

Then what ARE you saying?

That to say Jesus came to bring Peace on earth is Scripturally untrue and that Jesus said he came not to bring peace but a Sword. I thought i made it pretty clear, especially since I quoted someone.

 

[ZiSunka]

That to say Jesus came to bring Peace on earth is Scripturally untrue and that Jesus said he came not to bring peace but a Sword. I thought i made it pretty clear, especially since I quoted someone.

But what does that mean, specifically?

How does that take form in the real world?

 

[TheUltimateWarrior]

But what does that mean, specifically?

How does that take form in the real world?

It means that Jesus did not come to bring peace on the earth but a sword. I think it spretty simple.

A sword cuts and is used to kill in battle. Dont bait me, go ahead and say what you are waiting to say and we can save three pages of the run-around.

 

[aReformedPatriot]

Everyone who thinks violence is the answer to violence, raise your hand and say "aye!"

I do, but to a limited extent. The Federal Government and other world Gov't have the right to wage war. I suppose the difference for me is when violence just becomes gratuitous but as such not all violence is gratuitous in nature.

But in real simple terms: Kill the other guy and the immediate violence ends.

That being said, I think that all diplomatic efforts resemble the cycle that a battered woman and her batterer enter into:

1. Everything is Fine
2. Tension mounts
3. Violence Occurs
4. The Honeymoon stage occurs (I love you; I am sorry; It will never happen again; Flowery Language; Restoration of the relationship)
1. Everything is Fine
2. Tension mounts
3. Violence Occurs
4. The Honeymoon stage occurs (I love you; I am sorry; It will never happen again; Flowery Language; Restoration of the relationship)
1. Everything is Fine

Tis a vicious cycle that on the global scale with regard to governments is not going to cease, nor are they commanded to in scripture.

Edit: On a more personal level between say, me and Roy, I don't think violence is useful. Roy hits me, I beat the snot out of him, we assail each other constantly with threats forever and a day.. Ain't nobody benefiting from that at all.

 

[ZiSunka]

It means that Jesus did not come to bring peace on the earth but a sword. I think it spretty simple.

A sword cuts and is used to kill in battle. Dont bait me, go ahead and say what you are waiting to say and we can save three pages of the run-around.

What do you mean by a sword?

I'm not baiting you, I'm trying to figure out what you are saying. What does it mean in the real world? What is a sword in terms of today's world?

Did Jesus mean for Christians to raise a sword or is that something that is his domain only?

 

[aReformedPatriot]

I don't think the verse that says Jesus brought a sword not peace has anything to do with violence per se. It's more of an illustration that when one embraces the Gospel it makes one an enemy of the world. We are now hostile to the world, whether it be our family who are without Christ or the against the Government. I don't think that verse on its own is ground for violence to be shed.

 

[ZiSunka]

But in real simple terms: Kill the other guy and the immediate violence ends.

It does?

When did that ever happen?

I think in real life it works this way:

You kill me.
My family/nation/gang kills you.
Your family/nation/gang kills someone in your family/nation/gang.
Your family/nation/gang kills someone in my family/nation/gang.
Repeat...
1000 years later...
My family/nation/gang kills someone in your family/nation/gang.

The whole war in Bosnia was started in 1000 AD between two warring religious factions. It's still going on today, in a more subdued and less reported-on way.

Killing only propagates killing.

 

[seebs]

Jesus said multiple things on the topic of peace. The "not peace but a sword" line gets hauled out every time this comes up, but there are many more statements where Jesus affirms and praises both peace and peacemakers.

The question of what to make of this is one I have not personally entirely resolved. I do think it is clearly in error to completely disregard either passage. I am open to the notion that there may be context to them.

 

[ZiSunka]

I don't think the verse that says Jesus brought a sword not peace has anything to do with violence per se. It's more of an illustration that when one embraces the Gospel it makes one an enemy of the world. We are now hostile to the world, whether it be our family who are without Christ or the against the Government. I don't think that verse on its own is ground for violence to be shed.

Aw, were's your rep button?

I really want to rep you for this post.

 

[seebs]

It means that Jesus did not come to bring peace on the earth but a sword. I think it spretty simple.

A sword cuts and is used to kill in battle. Dont bait me, go ahead and say what you are waiting to say and we can save three pages of the run-around.

Honestly, I have no idea what you think this means.

Do you mean that Christians should be physically violent? That Christians may be physically violent some of the time? That Jesus is bringing an actual bladed implement which we can touch with our hands?

I have no idea at all. Everyone seems to be quite sure they know what this verse means, but no one agrees on it.

 

[seebs]

I don't think the verse that says Jesus brought a sword not peace has anything to do with violence per se. It's more of an illustration that when one embraces the Gospel it makes one an enemy of the world. We are now hostile to the world, whether it be our family who are without Christ or the against the Government. I don't think that verse on its own is ground for violence to be shed.

I actually basically agree.

The question is how we can best express this "hostility". I think it may clarify issues to use a more concrete word; "enmity".

How, then, should we treat these enemies?

 

[Tenken07]

I thought that verse "not peace but a sword" was to have everyone go against each other, to put christ first. Well, maybe not against each other, but certainly to put christ first.